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The "I Can't Believe There's No Abortion Thread" Part Deux: Electric Boogaloo

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  • psych
    replied
    Originally posted by leswp1 View Post
    THis and your other post helped me to type less. When I taught Nursing they did a really great mock exercise that gave people a particular background, circumstances, job, money and family members. They then entered the arena with those circumstances and had to figure out how to survive and try to move forward with things like affording food, utilities, transportation, meds, clothing, rent, etc.
    It was a great way to help people understand there is a lot more than will involved in surviving. Looks like a few people on this thread could do with participating in something like that to understand you can't just dismiss circumstances and basic needs. Saying it is easier now? No. I spent my whole career caring for people who were doing their damest to move forward. Some were successful but some were OK but some were in bad straits, even with them pedaling as fast as they could. The working poor are over a barrel. Lots of the time all it takes is the car breaking down, someone getting sick, rent increase and the house of cards falls down.

    Maybe the mindset may hold true for those who are childless it they are willing to screw the upper generations. There is no way it should be considered OK to put kids at risk of being without food or a roof while taking a leap of faith.

    Do genealogy for a hobby. The statement that most of the people coming over here were not dirt poor holds true for most of what I find. ALmost all of the people I have researched were not in a situation where their last dollar was spent on passage. They had large social networks that were established when they came or knew someone who knew someone. Moving now this is NOT what you usually see.
    I did a similar poverty exercise my second semester of nursing school. I loved it. One of my favorite things I did in school. I was a 60-something disabled woman living with her son, daughter-in-law, and three kids. I basically had to forego my medication every other day because we couldn’t afford it.

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  • St. Clown
    replied
    Only 43% of Americans state that they could cover the cost of an emergency if it were $1,000.

    https://fortune.com/recommends/banki...gency-expense/

    I doubt those who can afford that low threshold are the people being discussed here.

    Leave a comment:


  • leswp1
    replied
    Originally posted by psych View Post
    Abused women don’t leave their abusive significant other because it’s “utterly dislocating”? You talk with abused women on a regular basis like I do at my work? Good god, your analogies are hot garbage.
    THis and your other post helped me to type less. When I taught Nursing they did a really great mock exercise that gave people a particular background, circumstances, job, money and family members. They then entered the arena with those circumstances and had to figure out how to survive and try to move forward with things like affording food, utilities, transportation, meds, clothing, rent, etc.
    It was a great way to help people understand there is a lot more than will involved in surviving. Looks like a few people on this thread could do with participating in something like that to understand you can't just dismiss circumstances and basic needs. Saying it is easier now? No. I spent my whole career caring for people who were doing their damest to move forward. Some were successful but some were OK but some were in bad straits, even with them pedaling as fast as they could. The working poor are over a barrel. Lots of the time all it takes is the car breaking down, someone getting sick, rent increase and the house of cards falls down.

    Maybe the mindset may hold true for those who are childless it they are willing to screw the upper generations. There is no way it should be considered OK to put kids at risk of being without food or a roof while taking a leap of faith.

    Do genealogy for a hobby. The statement that most of the people coming over here were not dirt poor holds true for most of what I find. ALmost all of the people I have researched were not in a situation where their last dollar was spent on passage. They had large social networks that were established when they came or knew someone who knew someone. Moving now this is NOT what you usually see.

    Leave a comment:


  • Slap Shot
    replied
    Originally posted by SJHovey View Post

    Well sure, it's an obstacle, but so is the need to get a new drivers license when you move to a different state.
    I stopped at this disingenuous b.s. Comparing getting a DL to a full on move to another state is preposterous even for you.

    Cc:Kep - nor every refugee overcomes and comparing fleeing say a civil war to abortion legislation as a motivating factor is Hovey level b.s.
    Last edited by Slap Shot; 09-12-2023, 04:44 PM.

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  • psych
    replied
    Originally posted by Kepler View Post

    Good lord, the old junior high school social media trope. This is not productive. You overreacted, you were rebutted, and now you are wildly throwing out flack, desperately trying to cover your escape.

    Flee, I'm not pursuing. You've shown what you are. Drop your devastating adolescent last words, gather the rubes' cheers, and let's move on to why we all hate Hovey. That's more fun.
    Classic use of DARVO on your part. I’m not overreacting. I’m not fleeing. I don’t have to cover an “escape”, because quite simply, you’re wrong. Your analogy sucks. Your one article you quickly pulled from Google trying to prove your point doesn’t trump the years of experience I have in the field of psychology working as a therapist, and now nurse, with women who’ve suffered abuse at the hands of husbands, boyfriends, etc. Your quadrupling down on this is embarrassing.
    As for Hovey, yeah, I enjoy making fun of him, but in reality, he’s by far the smartest conservative on this board. Furthermore, if we were talking about the topic of running a business, I would value his opinion when it comes to what it takes to own a successful one, since I assume he must be doing well for himself. More power to him.
    I’ll let you escape now. Back to the topic at hand.

    Leave a comment:


  • MissThundercat
    replied
    Originally posted by SJHovey View Post

    Well sure, it's an obstacle, but so is the need to get a new drivers license when you move to a different state. It's just not an insurmountable obstacle.

    Are you telling me that the thousands upon thousands of people walking to the US from Central America or coming here from West Africa, are doing so with wheel barrows full of cash? People are taking the leap and changing where they live every single day with way less financial means than some waitress and her family in Huron, SD.
    As someone who's been poor enough to have housing instability and stay in a homeless shelter:

    3x monthly income, a decent credit score, and a lack of places that fit one's budget may not be "insurmountable," but one cannot climb that mountain on their own.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kepler
    replied
    Originally posted by SJHovey View Post

    Well sure, it's an obstacle, but so is the need to get a new drivers license when you move to a different state. It's just not an insurmountable obstacle.

    Are you telling me that the thousands upon thousands of people walking to the US from Central America or coming here from West Africa, are doing so with wheel barrows full of cash? People are taking the leap and changing where they live every single day with way less financial means than some waitress and her family in Huron, SD.
    While it is way more onerous than Hovey is saying here, he is right that every refugee who comes to the US overcomes challenges incomparably more severe than leaving the slave states.

    Fun factoid: the story of early American immigrants being poor is largely a myth. American immigrants prior to the 1960s were overwhelmingly from the middle and upper middle class strata of their societies, the way immigrants from Asia continue to be.

    Indeed it was only when we really did started attracting the tired, poor, huddled masses in the 1970s, that Good Old Kind Honorable America blotted out the text of Lady Liberty. It didn't help, of course, that the new immigrants were the wrong color.

    The Average American deeply cherishes and honors American values, right up until the instant they are slightly frightened or inconvenienced by them.



    Last edited by Kepler; 09-12-2023, 03:09 PM.

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  • Kepler
    replied
    Originally posted by psych View Post
    Is this what you turn to when you’re wrong?
    Good lord, the old junior high school social media trope. This is not productive. You overreacted, you were rebutted, and now you are wildly throwing out flack, desperately trying to cover your escape.

    Flee, I'm not pursuing. You've shown what you are. Drop your devastating adolescent last words, gather the rubes' cheers, and let's move on to why we all hate Hovey. That's more fun.

    Leave a comment:


  • SJHovey
    replied
    Originally posted by Slap Shot View Post

    I know you're going to argue otherwise but you contradict yourself. People living paycheck to paycheck absolutely have money as an obstacle.
    Well sure, it's an obstacle, but so is the need to get a new drivers license when you move to a different state. It's just not an insurmountable obstacle.

    Are you telling me that the thousands upon thousands of people walking to the US from Central America or coming here from West Africa, are doing so with wheel barrows full of cash? People are taking the leap and changing where they live every single day with way less financial means than some waitress and her family in Huron, SD.

    Leave a comment:


  • psych
    replied
    Originally posted by Kepler View Post

    6. 7. 8. I guess they don't know what they're talking about, either.



    The analogy is correct. red state Poors are behind the eight ball and can't leave because they do not have the resources and are afraid of the isolation -- just like everybody else on this thread has been saying. Not sure what you're whining about.


    Whining? Is this what you turn to when you’re wrong? My goodness, you’re a hypocrite. You cite one article, where three of the eight reasons provided somehow act as proof that your analogy is correct? How about the other five reasons in your one article? Those point to…? I’d say take the “L”, but you’re acting like Chuck, Whalers, and Jeb, so I don’t expect you to do so. Frankly, it’s disturbing.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kepler
    replied
    Originally posted by psych View Post
    Abused women don’t leave their abusive significant other because it’s “utterly dislocating”? You talk with abused women on a regular basis like I do at my work? Good god, your analogies are hot garbage.
    6. 7. 8. I guess they don't know what they're talking about, either.

    6. Family Expectations and Experiences. Many posted descriptions of how past experiences with violence distorted their sense of self or of healthy relationships: “I watched [my dad] beat my mom. Then I found someone just like dad,” or, “Because raised by animals, you partner with wolves.” Some mentioned family and religious pressures: “My mother told me God would disown me if I broke my marriage.”

    7. Financial Constraints. Many referred to financial limitations, and these were often connected to caring for children: “I had no family, two young children, no money, and guilt because he had brain damage from a car accident.” Others were unable to keep jobs because of the abuser’s control or their injuries, and others were used financially by their abuser: “[My] ex racked up thousands of debt in my name.”

    8. Isolation. A common tactic of manipulative partners is to separate their victim from family and friends. Sometimes this is physical, as one woman experienced: “I was literally trapped in the backwoods of WV, and he would use my little boy to keep me close.” Other times isolation is emotional, as one woman was told: “You can either have friends and family or you can have me.”
    The analogy is correct. red state Poors are behind the eight ball and can't leave because they do not have the resources and are afraid of the isolation -- just like everybody else on this thread has been saying. Not sure what you're whining about.



    Last edited by Kepler; 09-12-2023, 01:33 PM.

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  • FadeToBlack&Gold
    replied
    Originally posted by Kepler View Post
    You guys are so ready with your blah blah coastal elite blah paint by numbers narrative
    As opposed to your "blah blah poors/minorities still living in red states are fascists or just dumb blah poor people are icky paint-by-numbers" narrative?

    Unserious takes get unserious responses, Kep.

    Leave a comment:


  • Slap Shot
    replied
    Originally posted by SJHovey View Post
    I tend to think that Kepler is right. Money isn't the obstacle. But he is also wrong.

    The primary roadblock to people moving is fear. Fear of the unknown.

    They are currently living paycheck to paycheck....
    I know you're going to argue otherwise but you contradict yourself. People living paycheck to paycheck absolutely have money as an obstacle.

    Leave a comment:


  • psych
    replied
    Abused women don’t leave their abusive significant other because it’s “utterly dislocating”? You talk with abused women on a regular basis like I do at my work? Good god, your analogies are hot garbage.

    Leave a comment:


  • ScoobyDoo
    replied
    Originally posted by SJHovey View Post
    Humans are wanderers. They have been since the beginning. We constantly migrate to places where we think there are better opportunities for life. Notwithstanding all of the hand-wringing around here over supposed obstacles to moving, at no time in history has it been easier to move than right now. Transportation is easier. The ability to search for housing and jobs is substantially easier than at any time in history.

    Again, people aren't fleeing red states because they see no reason to do so.
    lmao

    Leave a comment:

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