117th Congress: DEMS IN DISARRAY!!!111!!

[Handyman]

Right on cue! I don’t think infrastructure and reconciliation are dead yet. Drastically watered down? Absolutely.

Edit: All of this internal disagreement and time spent crafting the bill adds to the “Dems in Disarray” narrative that the MSM is pushing, which may end up coming true if we torpedo everything, while allowing Republicans to craft a compelling* messaging of their own for the midterms.

*compelling to the average mainstream voter, not hardcore partisans who read political articles daily like I’m guessing all of us do.

I think they are because The Progressives won't lower the number and neither side wants to budge. Manchin and Sinema have nothing to gain they aren't going anywhere. Manchin literally "Rich-Splained" why they can't do Reconciliation from his yacht when he was confronted and Sinema ran away. The Progressives want all or nothing and Manchin and Sinema are there to say "ok, nothing" because they got their headlines when they negotiated the bipartisan deal.

Maybe "dead" isn't the right term, but it is on a ventilator and never got the vaccine so its days are numbered.

[psych]

I think they are because The Progressives won't lower the number and neither side wants to budge. Manchin and Sinema have nothing to gain they aren't going anywhere. Manchin literally "Rich-Splained" why they can't do Reconciliation from his yacht when he was confronted and Sinema ran away. The Progressives want all or nothing and Manchin and Sinema are there to say "ok, nothing" because they got their headlines when they negotiated the bipartisan deal.

Maybe "dead" isn't the right term, but it is on a ventilator and never got the vaccine so its days are numbered.

Going from $6 trillion to $2 trillion is budging. No, no one thought $6 trillion was the real number, but I’ll admit I was fooled when Manchin/Sinema voted to advance the $3.5 reconciliation budget framework since I figured they’d land close to that number.
That Manchin has drawn his redline at $1.5 trillion, and decries Democrats proposing subsidizing coal workers’ pay, until they can transition into clean jobs, as “welfare”, means you’re right, we’re likely ****ed. Giving Manchin and his state- his constituents- billions more wasn’t enough to move the needle on the overall number. I was wrong.
Yarmuth retiring as chair of one of the top 3-5 most powerful House committees is kind of a canary in the coal mine for Democrats’ chances come the midterms, and he’s doing it before the infrastructure and reconciliation bills are officially dead. At this point, even if they both pass, I think the narrative is firmly in GOP hands, and it’ll take some amazing messaging from Democrats to turn the tables.

[dxmnkd316]

The sad thing is you don't realize we already have that...

So you'd make it official then?

[ScoobyDoo]

Going from $6 trillion to $2 trillion is budging.

Yeah. This is the part that ****es me off. Sinema and Manchin are basically Republicans at this point. They negotiate like Mitch does. My way or the ****ing highway. Both bills are dead.

[The Sicatoka]

Sinema and Manchin are basically Republicans at this point.

You'd be happier if they switched and that thing called Mitch was majority leader again?

[ScoobyDoo]

You'd be happier if they switched and that thing called Mitch was majority leader again?

Wouldn't make much difference. As usual the Dems oversight is a joke and their DOJ is a bigger joke. At least if Mitch were in charge we'd have a shot of getting over the hump in the midterms. Now the mindless idiots and the facebook algorithm will just continue to make everything close again.

I'll ask the easy question. It's simple to answer. Why isn't Trump in jail? He committed treason in office. There is no doubt about that. He's still doing it in plain sight.

[The Sicatoka]

Why isn't Trump in jail? He committed treason in office.

Please explain. I'm two impeachments behind I guess.

[Handyman]

Going from $6 trillion to $2 trillion is budging. No, no one thought $6 trillion was the real number, but I’ll admit I was fooled when Manchin/Sinema voted to advance the $3.5 reconciliation budget framework since I figured they’d land close to that number.
That Manchin has drawn his redline at $1.5 trillion, and decries Democrats proposing subsidizing coal workers’ pay, until they can transition into clean jobs, as “welfare”, means you’re right, we’re likely ****ed. Giving Manchin and his state- his constituents- billions more wasn’t enough to move the needle on the overall number. I was wrong.
Yarmuth retiring as chair of one of the top 3-5 most powerful House committees is kind of a canary in the coal mine for Democrats’ chances come the midterms, and he’s doing it before the infrastructure and reconciliation bills are officially dead. At this point, even if they both pass, I think the narrative is firmly in GOP hands, and it’ll take some amazing messaging from Democrats to turn the tables.

Bernie wont lower from $3.5 (neither will the House Progs) and Manchin is a no at $3.5. Dropping from $6 isn't budging anymore than me saying I will accept less than $80k to be a community college teacher is budging.

[Handyman]

So you'd make it official then?

Do you think I want to expel Manchin from the Senate or something? He isn't going anywhere and nothing the Dems do will hurt him or help him.

You want us to coddle him because he is a Blue Senator in a Red State. I think they should ignore him and tell him WV can pound sand because of the way he acts. He and Sinema are not crusaders, they are destroying the Democratic Party (and the Country) from within. I am not going to stand by and applaud that because they have Ds behind their name.

Your fear mongering doesn't hold water. He isn't flipping parties and he will live and die in the next election on his family name. He knows that which is why he doesn't even hide how bought and sold he is anymore.

[unofan]

I think they should ignore him and tell him WV can pound sand because of the way he acts.

As soon as you get 50 senators to the left of him, by all means. Right now you have 48. You don't have to like that, but that's reality as we sit here today.

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

What really needs to happen is a Constitutional amendment to reform the entire Senate, its raison d'etre, and introduce term limits, but I'm well aware that has a snowball's chance in Hell of ever happening.

[dxmnkd316]

Serious question. What do term limits actually buy?

im just not convinced they're going to provide the solutions people think they will. If anything, you've got new people more susceptible to corporate bribes.

[rufus]

Serious question. What do term limits actually buy?

im just not convinced they're going to provide the solutions people think they will. If anything, you've got new people more susceptible to corporate bribes.

Maybe. But at least it wouldn't always be the same people, and maybe it would be different companies bribing them.

Diversity is good, right?

[ScoobyDoo]

Serious question. What do term limits actually buy?

im just not convinced they're going to provide the solutions people think they will. If anything, you've got new people more susceptible to corporate bribes.

They won't work either. Citizens United made things worse and without a complete overhaul via legislation it's pretty hopeless to be honest.

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

I don't think it's unreasonable to support a lifetime two-term limit for Senators - 12 years in one public office is plenty. I'd probably leave Reps as-is.