POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

[Russell Jaslow]

Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

The swastika actually has a rich and noble history in many unique cultures before the Nazis appropriated it for evil. Your point is taken, but bad comparison (it's somewhat interesting that primitive people on different continents independently used it as an important symbol)

True. And that's one of reasons Hitler chose it, because of its past history. There are many minor variations of it over history, and even Hitler (remember, he was an art major) tweaked it for Germany's final version.

The Finnish Air Force used it before Nazi Germany. After WWII, they stopped using it.

A U.S. Army unit located out west used it as part of their symbol because they were honoring the local Native American tribe which had used it for centuries because it meant good luck to them. When WWII started, needless to say, the Army unit changed their logo.

Those of you "oldtimers" from the Hockey-L days may remember a photo someone found from an early 1900s Canadian newspaper showing a female hockey team, nicknamed the "Swastikas." I think I still have that photo somewhere. Back then, it was perfectly acceptable to use a nickname and team logo like that. Now, it seems so weird.

[JF_Gophers]

North Carolina proves again that they're lost. Lost.

Republicans passed a bunch of things knowing they may lose the governor's race to hamper the dems in fixing issues.

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

IMHO, you are mistaking history, and the forgiveness of time to honoring people who were losers.

Some like to think the statues represent history. And in some aspects they do. But the history could probably be better shown in a simple marker, perhaps with some of the names of the dead.

Instead, the statues are there to make us think that the confederate generals were some kind of hero. They are not. They were just part of a losing battle.

I've seen Lee's efforts washed over here and on other boards- after the war he was some kind of gentleman, or that he was just fighting for Virginia, bla bla bla.

Which is to suggest that he fought for the wrong side in the war, as he was against slavery.

It would be interesting to ask the thousands of dead confederate soldiers he commanded into death about that line of thinking. Or the thousands of Union soldiers that died due to his command the same thing.

The man was a key part in 300,000 people killed in the Civil war. Had he fought for the north, perhaps less would have died, and the separation between the north and south would not be nearly has harsh, as the war would have ended a lot sooner.

But he didn't. He fought for the side that every single goal pointed to keeping slavery to make people rich. Killed a lot of people. And lost. How does that make him a hero or a gentleman?

To Your Point

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

The comments on that are a piece of work. Compared to those, Flaggy looks normal.

Good lord...

I am not sure what is more disturbing...that they think a Black man defaced the statue or just the fact that they use act as a reason to spew some really horrid rhetoric.

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

Teddy didnt rebel against the country and become Benedict Arnold. Good lord dude I know you are trying to make a point but you need to brush up on history if you are going to do it because that was pathetically off point.

The problem isnt that Lee hated Black people...it is that he committed treason against the United States in the name of his racism. You ever been to Arlington Cemetery? If not go there and go to his house and read about it sometime. This myth he was a moral man who hated slavery and only fought for the South because of Virginia is a crock.

Why is this so difficult for people to understand? ^^^^^

Our teaching of history in this country is a failure. And utter and despicable failure.

Good for Baltimore. Shame on anyone who leaves one of these ****ing statues up.

North Carolina proves again that they're lost. Lost.

[Drew S.]

The monument protesters in Durham, NC toppled will likely be put back up. There is state law prohibiting the removal of them.

Believe the actual law is that the senate(or a senate committee) has to sign off before one is removed. The law was just passed in the last couple of years. I read yesterday that the police are planning to charge everyone involved with some sort of felony.

[Rover]

Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

I would be all for keeping the Southern Monuments if they werent now rallying cries for racists. That seems to be their Alamo now so let them watch it burn. They dont want it up for Historical perspective, they want them to honor the racist traitors. Well...

That's what I think too. Most of these neo-Nazi dorks probably have no clue who the fuk Robert E Lee is. Its all about representing white power and nothing else. If you told them Lee urged reconciliation and applied to get his citizenship to the United States back after the war, they wouldn't know what you're talking about because they have no interest in historical facts.

Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

It's fun to watch brent twist himself into knots trying to defend a racist symbol while still trying to condemn racism.

"You know, the swastika, as we know it now, has come to mean..."

You can't address or fix anything unless you address or fix everything.

Coz... you know... consistency.

[alfablue]

Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

IIRC 30 some odd signers of the Declaration of Independence were slave owners.

IIRC at the 50th anniversary of the Battle of Gettysburg, the survivors marched across the field and shook hands with each other.

What about the Nazis?

We read the writings of Nazi generals and admirals, some who served in the new West German armed forces. They served an evil government, yet we didn't shoot/hang them all. Some were respected lecturers after the war in this country.

Our German scientists were better than Russia's German scientists and we got to the moon first.

We hate the Nazis but like the Germans? Why can't we decry the Rebellion and honor the participants?

IMHO, you are mistaking history, and the forgiveness of time to honoring people who were losers.

Some like to think the statues represent history. And in some aspects they do. But the history could probably be better shown in a simple marker, perhaps with some of the names of the dead.

Instead, the statues are there to make us think that the confederate generals were some kind of hero. They are not. They were just part of a losing battle.

I've seen Lee's efforts washed over here and on other boards- after the war he was some kind of gentleman, or that he was just fighting for Virginia, bla bla bla.

Which is to suggest that he fought for the wrong side in the war, as he was against slavery.

It would be interesting to ask the thousands of dead confederate soldiers he commanded into death about that line of thinking. Or the thousands of Union soldiers that died due to his command the same thing.

The man was a key part in 300,000 people killed in the Civil war. Had he fought for the north, perhaps less would have died, and the separation between the north and south would not be nearly has harsh, as the war would have ended a lot sooner.

But he didn't. He fought for the side that every single goal pointed to keeping slavery to make people rich. Killed a lot of people. And lost. How does that make him a hero or a gentleman?

[JF_Gophers]

Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

The monument protesters in Durham, NC toppled will likely be put back up. There is state law prohibiting the removal of them.

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

What could go wrong?

(Also qualifies for Top Comments.)

[jericho]

Speaking of Lincoln

Should we take bets on who is responsible...

The comments on that are a piece of work. Compared to those, Flaggy looks normal.

[Slap Shot]

Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

Borrowing from Stephen Colbert...

...It's weird that Trump wasn't as angry nor quick to condemn neo-Nazis and murder as he was with Hillary Clinton, Obama, the NYT, CNN, Joe Scarborough, Kristin Stewart, the cast of Hamilton, CNN, Fake News, Diet Coke, Nordstroms, Arnold Schwartenager, the Mayor of London, Sedik Kahn, Steven Colbert, the state of NH, Gold Star families, Penn Gilette, Meryl Streep, Django Unchained, CEOs from the Manufacturing Council...

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

I agree with trix.

Antifa, while noble in their cause, are fine until they resort to violence that is not self-defense/etc. Then I don't like them one bit. "They yelled stuff at us" and "they spew hate" are not justifiable excuses.

You do know they're bused in by Soros to create terror at these events, yes?

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

http://www.theonion.com/graphic/trum...ould-be--56663