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  • Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

    Originally posted by dxmnkd316 View Post
    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/0...alation-241526

    **** me...


    Also, didn't this ******* say he wasn't going to reveal his plans?
    It's so nice that Trump thinks it's all just a game of Risk.

    Comment


    • Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

      Originally posted by WeAreNDHockey View Post
      Is the empirical evidence to suggest this? I ask because I do not know. It seems that buying more house than you can afford is a more recent occurrence and and the affordability of housing can be tied to a lot more than just a mortgage interest deduction. Was housing out of the reach of most people in our urban areas in 1960 or 1970? You could deduct your interest then, too.
      It's the same argument that could be applied to the cost of tuition. The object of the seller is to maximize the amount of money they can get from a buyer. Anyone who's sold something in their lives, whether it's a house, something on eBay or Craigslist, whatever it may be, will tell you this. Obviously a buyer then makes a "bid" on the item, and eventually the buyer and seller come to an agreement on a price. When there is a means for buyers to gain extra money (whether by debt or subsidy), the seller is going to take advantage of that and raise the price because they know they can get it.

      Credit has also became a lot more "advertised" and loose in the 80's, and the options even more so with the repeal of Glass-Steagall in the early-to-mid-90's. With some time for the market to adjust to these "openings", of course prices have been on the rise. To your specific point about interest deduction, perhaps we need to look at if there was any sort of rise in the decade or so after it was introduced. I do believe the credit loosening was the real driving factor.

      Comment


      • Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

        Originally posted by FadeToBlack&Gold View Post



        Translation: "The generals told me we have a plan; I trust them - haven't read it! Now, you said my ball went out of bounds? Yeah, don't count that shot."
        Is this going to turn out like the carrier fleet that was steaming towards NK at that very moment but was actually passing near Papua/New Guinea and pointed towards western Australia?
        "The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." George Orwell, 1984

        "One does not simply walk into Mordor. Its Black Gates are guarded by more than just Orcs. There is evil there that does not sleep, and the Great Eye is ever watchful. It is a barren wasteland, riddled with fire and ash and dust, the very air you breathe is a poisonous fume." Boromir

        "Good news! We have a delivery." Professor Farnsworth

        Comment


        • Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

          Originally posted by joecct View Post
          Unfortunately, given the current political and social climate, yes. However, nothing is set in concrete and I pray that one day attitudes will change.
          A bit interesting how the question changes from "Should we actually do it?" to "Should it be an option?". The latter seems quite authoritarian.

          Comment


          • Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

            Also regarding gun control, Dems need to be clear about exactly what they want to do, because otherwise you leave yourself open to charges of taking people's guns and other such nonsense.

            So, were I running the DNC or running for Prez or whatever, my proposal would be this: I'd have one gun law, and only one gun law, that I'd push for whatever term I'd be running for. That 1 law would be to keep guns out of the hands of mentally ill people and people under surveillance for terrorism. Simple, concise, and for once you'd put NRA loons on the defensive when they opposed this.

            How would this work? People under a terrorism watch would not be notified obviously, but law enforcement would obtain court order to suspend their right to own firearms and put them in the Brady bill database. Mentally ill people would not go through a court order but would be informed (or their guardian) that their doctor had flagged them also in the database. If they happen to be cured or get better at a later date, or if somebody under surveillance turns out to be harmless, they would get their access back.

            I personally would like stricter gun control, but also realize Dems need to build up some credibility on this issue while playing offense against the gun lobby. "Why do you want guns in the hands of terrorists or people hearing voices" is a question that should be asked instead of "why do you done support da gubmit comin' into our homes and a takin' our gunz?"

            Kep regarding economic liberalism its not a disagreement but more of a general problem in the country that to date has no solution. Most of us agree that the rich should in fact pay more taxes. We also agree that the revenue from said taxes should be transferred to people on the lower end of the income ladder in the form of increased health coverage and college tuition for example. So far so good and Dems should absolutely run on not universal single payer but expanded Medicaid and Medicare which recent events have proven are extremely popular even amongst righty voters.

            However, all of this will not actually make a wide swath of the country, from Pennsylvania down to Georgia across to Arizona and up to Montana and back across the Great Lakes to western NY, prosperous. It'll allow people to tread water better which is certainly worthwhile, but while we're telling people they'd be worse off without us, not exactly a winning message, Republicans are telling the same people if you help us kick out all illegal immigrants you'll get your jobs back. Well, once resonates a lot more than the other.

            I, nor Hillary, nor Bernie, nor Trump, nor anybody else has a solution to bring back 50's era living standards to the Rust Belt, the Prairies, rural New England, etc. I would hope these people realize they're being played for suckers, but my solution to their plight isn't a campaign friendly one - leave and move to where the jobs are!
            Legally drunk???? If its "legal", what's the ------- problem?!? - George Carlin

            Ever notice how everybody who drives slower than you is an idiot, and everybody who drives faster is a maniac? - George Carlin

            "I've never seen so much reason and bullsh*t contained in ONE MAN."

            Comment


            • Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

              Originally posted by St. Clown View Post
              Is this going to turn out like the carrier fleet that was steaming towards NK at that very moment but was actually passing near Papua/New Guinea and pointed towards western Australia?
              The generals have given him an actual football and told him it's the nuclear football.
              Cornell University
              National Champion 1967, 1970
              ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
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              Comment


              • Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

                Originally posted by Rover View Post
                Also regarding gun control, Dems need to be clear about exactly what they want to do, because otherwise you leave yourself open to charges of taking people's guns and other such nonsense.

                So, were I running the DNC or running for Prez or whatever, my proposal would be this: I'd have one gun law, and only one gun law, that I'd push for whatever term I'd be running for. That 1 law would be to keep guns out of the hands of mentally ill people and people under surveillance for terrorism. Simple, concise, and for once you'd put NRA loons on the defensive when they opposed this.

                How would this work? People under a terrorism watch would not be notified obviously, but law enforcement would obtain court order to suspend their right to own firearms and put them in the Brady bill database. Mentally ill people would not go through a court order but would be informed (or their guardian) that their doctor had flagged them also in the database. If they happen to be cured or get better at a later date, or if somebody under surveillance turns out to be harmless, they would get their access back.

                I personally would like stricter gun control, but also realize Dems need to build up some credibility on this issue while playing offense against the gun lobby. "Why do you want guns in the hands of terrorists or people hearing voices" is a question that should be asked instead of "why do you done support da gubmit comin' into our homes and a takin' our gunz?"

                Kep regarding economic liberalism its not a disagreement but more of a general problem in the country that to date has no solution. Most of us agree that the rich should in fact pay more taxes. We also agree that the revenue from said taxes should be transferred to people on the lower end of the income ladder in the form of increased health coverage and college tuition for example. So far so good and Dems should absolutely run on not universal single payer but expanded Medicaid and Medicare which recent events have proven are extremely popular even amongst righty voters.

                However, all of this will not actually make a wide swath of the country, from Pennsylvania down to Georgia across to Arizona and up to Montana and back across the Great Lakes to western NY, prosperous. It'll allow people to tread water better which is certainly worthwhile, but while we're telling people they'd be worse off without us, not exactly a winning message, Republicans are telling the same people if you help us kick out all illegal immigrants you'll get your jobs back. Well, once resonates a lot more than the other.

                I, nor Hillary, nor Bernie, nor Trump, nor anybody else has a solution to bring back 50's era living standards to the Rust Belt, the Prairies, rural New England, etc. I would hope these people realize they're being played for suckers, but my solution to their plight isn't a campaign friendly one - leave and move to where the jobs are!
                And then you re-define "mentally ill" to the point where you take everyone's guns. Forget it.

                Comment


                • Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

                  Originally posted by joecct View Post
                  Unfortunately, given the current political and social climate, yes. However, nothing is set in concrete and I pray that one day attitudes will change.
                  Within a few decades abortion will be 100% OBE for all but the Poors. Women will have simple, discrete, non-invasive, 100% effective pharmaceutical and other options and they will be in complete control, and that will be that. At that point it will of course be recriminalized, because in the US the one thing we do better than anyone else is criminalize poverty.

                  Abortion was a bridge solution. Better than having unwanted babies and better than making women slaves to their biology, but still a suboptimal solution if for no other reason than it was so easily exploited to anger and manipulate reactionaries.

                  And after you lose abortion, and your grandkids have accepted gays the way we accepted non-whites, the brief but lethal warping of democratic politics by religious extremism will be all but done. The American Al Qaeda is on its way out.
                  Last edited by Kepler; 08-11-2017, 12:14 PM.
                  Cornell University
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                  • Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

                    How about unlimited guns and abortions? Is that a compromise that makes both sides happy?

                    Cornell '04, Stanford '06


                    KDR

                    Rover Frenchy, Classic! Great post.
                    iwh30 I wish I could be as smart as you. I really do you are the man
                    gregg729 I just saw your sig, you do love having people revel in your "intelligence."
                    Ritt18 you are the perfect representation of your alma mater.
                    Miss Thundercat That's it, you win.
                    TBA#2 I want to kill you and dance in your blood.
                    DisplacedCornellian Hahaha. Thread over. Frenchy wins.

                    Test to see if I can add this.

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                    • Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

                      Originally posted by FlagDUDE08 View Post
                      And then you re-define "mentally ill" to the point where you take everyone's guns. Forget it.
                      you obviously meet anyone's definition

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by French Rage View Post
                        How about unlimited guns and abortions? Is that a compromise that makes both sides happy?
                        I've proposed this multiple times on here. Everyone wins in this situation.
                        Originally posted by BobbyBrady
                        Crosby probably wouldn't even be on BC's top two lines next year

                        Comment


                        • Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

                          Originally posted by dxmnkd316 View Post
                          http://www.politico.com/story/2017/0...alation-241526

                          **** me...


                          Also, didn't this ******* say he wasn't going to reveal his plans?
                          He says a lot of things. My kid is draftable age. I am not a happy camper. My Dad dodged the bullet for Korea. Don't want to try the family luck twice.

                          Originally posted by St. Clown View Post
                          Heh. Girlfriend's dad was kind enough to explain to me that he owns 100 guns at the moment, and had just purchased five more earlier that week. Subtle.
                          Ahhh, but was he cleaning the guns when you came to visit. My dad always thought that most effective.

                          Originally posted by WeAreNDHockey View Post
                          This is me, totally. I would refer to myself as an "independent" because I did not want to be labeled. I still don't consider myself a democrat though because I think that title should be confined to someone who is actually a member of their party. I now "label" myself as a progressive. I once went back and tried to remember my voting records and at one point in my 30s I voted about 2/3 D and about 1/3 R. A few of those votes were cast for republicans runnning unopposed, but eventually I stopped voting in general elections for people who were running unopposed. I will also say the last republican I voted for was in the 2000 Michigan presidential primary when I voted for McCain. I have not given a single republican a vote in the 21st century, and my guess is I never will again.

                          But I'm still not a democrat.
                          I am fiscally conservative but socially liberal. On the tests I come out pretty close to center. No party does what I want.

                          Originally posted by WeAreNDHockey View Post
                          Until we have a society that values life from conception through birth until a natural (even if unforeseen) death, pro-life people are too often some of the biggest hypocrites walking the face of the Earth. In fact the movement shamefully has referred itself as the "pro-LIFE" movement when it is basically nothing but a pro-BIRTH movement. Given their way, ALL support before and after the moment of birth would be done away with. Sheesh, they talk about the moment of conception being the important demarcation in time, when it is really the moment of birth.
                          THIS!1!111!!!! The 'Christians' of the right are an abomination. NO bigger hypocrites exist

                          Originally posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
                          Current Democratic Party positions reduce the number of abortions far more than current Republican positions. Facts are facts.
                          Facts are against the law.

                          Originally posted by Slap Shot View Post
                          It's so nice that Trump thinks it's all just a game of Risk.
                          and don't you wonder if he knows where all the dice are?

                          Originally posted by Kepler View Post
                          Within a few decades abortion will be 100% OBE for all but the Poors. Women will have simple, discrete, non-invasive, 100% effective pharmaceutical and other options and they will be in complete control, and that will be that. At that point it will of course be recriminalized, because in the US the one thing we do better than anyone else is criminalize poverty.

                          Abortion was a bridge solution. Better than having unwanted babies and better than making women slaves to their biology, but still a suboptimal solution if for no other reason than it was so easily exploited to anger and manipulate reactionaries.
                          There is chemical abortion now. It has been available for years. They attempted to make it illegal and failed. Problem is you need to access it early enough, you need availability and to get it covered. All of those can be insurmountable barriers. De-funding clinics, etc is what works for the pro-birthers. It is very effective

                          Comment


                          • Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

                            Originally posted by French Rage View Post
                            How about unlimited guns and abortions? Is that a compromise that makes both sides happy?
                            I'd be for it. Good luck with the authoritarians on both "sides".

                            Comment


                            • Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

                              Originally posted by French Rage View Post
                              How about unlimited guns and abortions? Is that a compromise that makes both sides happy?
                              I seriously ask this but replace guns with the death penalty. Are pro-birthers willing to do away with the death penalty? Are pro-choicers ready to accept the death penalty? (and yes I know people opposed to capital punishment often do so on the grounds it is imposed with too much bias or too much incompetence on the part of law enforcement. These are the two reasons I am opposed to it. If it was fair and I trusted the average cop, the Jerry Sanduskys of the world would be getting beheaded)

                              Comment


                              • Re: POTUS 45.16 - If Never Forgotten, One Would ALWAYS Remember Something.

                                Originally posted by joecct View Post
                                One of the biggest subsidies in the tax code.

                                I prefer counting it all, everyone files single and gets $45,000 off the top as the standard exclusion. Pay a % (15 & 20%) on the rest.

                                Corporations use GAAP and have a $1 million exclusion and pay 15% on the excess.

                                The middle class pays a bit. LeBron pays a lot, Bill Gates pays more. Sears pays nothing.
                                A far more important thing to do is count all income as equal. Which means that there's no tax change based on capitol gains. THAT is where the most change in absolute tax rate comes from- the richer you get, the higher proportions of long term capitol gains you get- which changes your rate from 33% to 15%. That has to stop.

                                Income is income, and there's no reason "unearned" income should be taxed less than earned income. I'm not saying it should be taxed more, too. Just that it should be treated equally.

                                If that change is made, and the top tax rate is dropped to 30% even, it would still make a MASSIVE different in a good way.

                                Comment

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