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POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

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  • Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

    Originally posted by Brenthoven View Post
    And there is where the getting rid of cheap labor comes in/illegals. If one eliminates a chunk of the work force, then supply (workers willing to work for cheap) is less than demand (jobs). You are correct that companies will try to get by on the cheap, and there will always be a certain percentage that will work for that wage. We both are trying to change the game a little, just in different ways.
    The approach currently being taken by Trump seems to make little sense. Yes, he is trying to make it harder to get in to the country with a physical barrier and kick more people out. But at the same time his approach is to take jobs out of Mexico and move them to the US, which will only encourage more illegal immigration to follow the jobs. If you really want to crack down on the illegal immigration from Mexico (since you mentioned the wall I assume you care less about Asian immigrants, and the ideas below would likely impact Central American immigration as well) you need to crack down on the employers rather than the immigrants. Then couple that with an expanded guest worker program or something similar to still allow employers to be fully staffed. It would also seem that if you want to discourage illegal immigration from Mexico the easiest way to do it would be to help strengthen the Mexican economy. Encourage companies to locate to Mexico rather than Asia, provide jobs in Mexico. A strong Mexican economy is in our best interest, not only to slow illegal immigration, but to provide more stability in Mexico. If there was a strong economy there you might even make an impact on the reliance on cartels and drug trafficking which can only help us here as well. The current policies of the right towards immigration are the exact same as the war on drugs, they aren't looking to proactively address the causes, they are only looking to punish the offenders. History has shown that is not effective.

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    • Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

      Originally posted by alfablue View Post
      Other than the racism part of profiling, and the racism part of most illegal immigration fear policy- there's no relationship between the TSA an immigration, then?
      There's a relationship, and as you said, it doesn't really pertain to illegal immigration; it does pertain to immigration and fear of those big bad Muslims, though. (ok, that last part was really snarky, sorry 'bout that, felt it was needed to explain my point).
      Never really developed a taste for tequila. Kind of hard to understand how you make a drink out of something that sharp, inhospitable. Now, bourbon is easy to understand.
      Tastes like a warm summer day. -Raylan Givens

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      • Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

        Originally posted by jerphisch View Post
        The approach currently being taken by Trump seems to make little sense. Yes, he is trying to make it harder to get in to the country with a physical barrier and kick more people out. But at the same time his approach is to take jobs out of Mexico and move them to the US, which will only encourage more illegal immigration to follow the jobs. If you really want to crack down on the illegal immigration from Mexico (since you mentioned the wall I assume you care less about Asian immigrants, and the ideas below would likely impact Central American immigration as well) you need to crack down on the employers rather than the immigrants. Then couple that with an expanded guest worker program or something similar to still allow employers to be fully staffed. It would also seem that if you want to discourage illegal immigration from Mexico the easiest way to do it would be to help strengthen the Mexican economy. Encourage companies to locate to Mexico rather than Asia, provide jobs in Mexico. A strong Mexican economy is in our best interest, not only to slow illegal immigration, but to provide more stability in Mexico. If there was a strong economy there you might even make an impact on the reliance on cartels and drug trafficking which can only help us here as well. The current policies of the right towards immigration are the exact same as the war on drugs, they aren't looking to proactively address the causes, they are only looking to punish the offenders. History has shown that is not effective.
        I don't care if you're Asian, Mexican, Russian, German, etc. If you are an illegal immigrant, you should not be here. There is a neighborhood somewhat close to me, heavily Russian populated. I'll just say that I doubt all of them are legally here.

        Edit: for the locals: 36th and 169. Big time Russian neighborhood.
        Never really developed a taste for tequila. Kind of hard to understand how you make a drink out of something that sharp, inhospitable. Now, bourbon is easy to understand.
        Tastes like a warm summer day. -Raylan Givens

        Comment


        • Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

          Originally posted by SJHovey View Post
          There is still a lot of bigotry and hatred in this country. There will always be a lot of bigotry and hatred in this country. All you can do is chip away at it, as has been done certainly for all the years I've been around, and long before that. You don't chip away at it by "shunning" or by ignoring people. You don't do it by hating them back. You do your best to show them a better way. If it sticks, great. If not, you've done your best. It's a lot like second grade math. It took some longer than others, and some never got it.
          And I'd say the major mover of all that is when people had the black family, or the gay couple, move into their neighborhood and start going to their schools, and their wives didn't get raped, and their children didn't get molested, and the crime rate didn't go up, and their property values didn't go down. Things like that.

          It certainly wasn't because of political discourse on the subject of tolerance. You aren't gonna change a bigot's mind by talking to them, or ameliorating their feelings. Only exposure to the things they hate, and them discovering for themselves how their hatred has been misinformed, will do that. If they want to stay secluded in their little cone of bigotry, I ain't gonna go seeking them out and try to drag them out into the light.
          What kind of cheese are you planning to put on top?

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          • Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

            Originally posted by rufus View Post
            And I'd say the major mover of all that is when people had the black family, or the gay couple, move into their neighborhood and start going to their schools, and their wives didn't get raped, and their children didn't get molested, and the crime rate didn't go up, and their property values didn't go down. Things like that.

            It certainly wasn't because of political discourse on the subject of tolerance. You aren't gonna change a bigot's mind by talking to them, or ameliorating their feelings. Only exposure to the things they hate, and them discovering for themselves how their hatred has been misinformed, will do that. If they want to stay secluded in their little cone of bigotry, I ain't gonna go seeking them out and try to drag them out into the light.
            Agree on exposure. But talking with them is part of that, IMO.
            Never really developed a taste for tequila. Kind of hard to understand how you make a drink out of something that sharp, inhospitable. Now, bourbon is easy to understand.
            Tastes like a warm summer day. -Raylan Givens

            Comment


            • Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

              Originally posted by alfablue View Post
              When the TSA or CBP singles out Muslims, what would you call it?
              Muslims are a race, don'cha know.
              What kind of cheese are you planning to put on top?

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              • Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

                Originally posted by rufus View Post
                Muslims are a race, don'cha know.
                As (the hilarious) W Kamau Bell said:

                Not all Muslims are Arab. Not all Arabs are Muslim.

                Unfortunately, there are some who don't believe those statements. They think Muslim/Arab are interchangeable, thereby making it a race issue, not a religious one.
                Never really developed a taste for tequila. Kind of hard to understand how you make a drink out of something that sharp, inhospitable. Now, bourbon is easy to understand.
                Tastes like a warm summer day. -Raylan Givens

                Comment


                • Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

                  Originally posted by Brenthoven View Post
                  I don't care if you're Asian, Mexican, Russian, German, etc. If you are an illegal immigrant, you should not be here. There is a neighborhood somewhat close to me, heavily Russian populated. I'll just say that I doubt all of them are legally here.

                  Edit: for the locals: 36th and 169. Big time Russian neighborhood.
                  This is such a beautiful example of why there can't be an honest conversation....

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by jerphisch View Post
                    This is such a beautiful example of why there can't be an honest conversation....
                    How does know that someone is likely not here legally?
                    Does sarah palin have a tunnel up there to sneak Russians in?

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                    • Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

                      Donald Trump, International Man of Mystery.

                      https://images.dailykos.com/images/4...png?1496089826
                      What kind of cheese are you planning to put on top?

                      Comment


                      • Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

                        Originally posted by jerphisch View Post
                        This is such a beautiful example of why there can't be an honest conversation....
                        Explain?

                        I can't 100% say some are illegals. Some from that neighborhood work with some friends of mine, and they kinda have the whole mail-order bride thing/arranged marriage thing going on.

                        Edit: Where there's smoke....that sorta thing.
                        Last edited by The Rube; 06-01-2017, 10:27 AM.
                        Never really developed a taste for tequila. Kind of hard to understand how you make a drink out of something that sharp, inhospitable. Now, bourbon is easy to understand.
                        Tastes like a warm summer day. -Raylan Givens

                        Comment


                        • Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

                          Originally posted by rufus View Post
                          And I'd say the major mover of all that is when people had the black family, or the gay couple, move into their neighborhood and start going to their schools, and their wives didn't get raped, and their children didn't get molested, and the crime rate didn't go up, and their property values didn't go down. Things like that.

                          It certainly wasn't because of political discourse on the subject of tolerance. You aren't gonna change a bigot's mind by talking to them, or ameliorating their feelings. Only exposure to the things they hate, and them discovering for themselves how their hatred has been misinformed, will do that. If they want to stay secluded in their little cone of bigotry, I ain't gonna go seeking them out and try to drag them out into the light.
                          Yet what's funny is in all these political threads that is precisely what you, and everyone else, are trying to do. Most have resorted to political discourse as opposed to using the shun feature.
                          That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

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                          • Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

                            Originally posted by SJHovey View Post
                            Most have resorted to political discourse as opposed to using the shun feature.
                            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nRB8Jor8tPs
                            Cornell University
                            National Champion 1967, 1970
                            ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
                            Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

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                            • Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

                              Originally posted by Brenthoven View Post
                              I don't care if you're Asian, Mexican, Russian, German, etc. If you are an illegal immigrant, you should not be here.
                              Meh. Every immigrant to the US before about 1920 was illegal, or anyway alegal. It's not even in the top 100 things I worry about.

                              I am way less concerned about the threats posed by illegal immigrants than about the threats posed by the frothing jackwagons who are so hot to deport them. Given the choice, I'd gladly keep the former and get rid of the latter.
                              Cornell University
                              National Champion 1967, 1970
                              ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
                              Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

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                              • Re: POTUS 45.11: Attack! Repeat. Atrack!!!

                                Originally posted by Kepler View Post
                                Meh. Every immigrant to the US before about 1920 was illegal, or anyway alegal. It's not even in the top hundred things I worry about.
                                Just because it happened before does not make it correct now.
                                Never really developed a taste for tequila. Kind of hard to understand how you make a drink out of something that sharp, inhospitable. Now, bourbon is easy to understand.
                                Tastes like a warm summer day. -Raylan Givens

                                Comment

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