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115th Congress. In Bridge, Can Hearts be Trumped? In Spades!

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  • Re: 115th Congress. In Bridge, Can Hearts be Trumped? In Spades!

    Originally posted by Kepler View Post
    The problem is the hobbits. There in the shire, far (they think) from danger, they live kind of feet up and mind in neutral so to speak. Politics is very much not their thing. They're essentially good, but they're simply not engaged, let alone heroic.

    We always have enough pure numbers to beat the orcs. (I thought the Balrog was not a race but just one dude -- in the Harvard Lampoon parody, he was "The Ballhog," and I don't remember there being trolls at all in Tolkien though obviously I am old and senile.) The problem is most of our numbers go through life blissfully unaware of the evil growing in Mordor.
    I'd agree with the shire analogy for the most part, which is my point. Or I suppose my question. In swing states there was clearly a good deal of cross over voting. 20 point swings from Obama to Trump in several areas by the Shire Folk who participated. I've lived a few places and known a lot of people and even among the many Orcs with camo upholstered couches below velvet John Wayne-over-the-the-flag pictures I've known and know, I just can't think of any that wouldn't vote for a woman. (And it's not like they're too PC to say so.) They liked Peg Thatcher and likely might have gone for a Condi Rice. But that's entirely anecdotal. So what I'm getting at is that among the left and the part of the the middle needed, the contention is that misogyny played a major factor. I'm suspicious and would like to know if that's actually true, or even if that's at least perceived to be true by folks around here?

    Hmmm... It's been 15 years at least since I read any Tolkien, but... regarding Balrogs: Balrogs were a race of corrupted lesser god types known as the Maiar and the Captains of Angband under the original fallen Vala (Gods) Melkor. After the defeat of Melkor in the First Age, the Balrogs scattered to the depths of the earth where they remained hidden. tBalrog in LOTR is one that the Dwarves of Moria stumbled upon in digging a bit too deep. (Uncovering a Balrog in West Virginia is another danger in coal mining, I suppose.) Sauron is also a Maiar, the most powerful of that race, as are Gandalf and Saruman, albeit much lesser ones.

    Which brings us to the fact that the only two good side beings in Middle Earth as it pertains to Power, that could stand alone against a Balrog would be Gandalf and Cate Blanchett. Galadriel seems a bit weird, (maybe because she is around 6500 years old) but she alone of all characters is powerful enough to wrestle with Sauron in thought and come away unscathed. Among many examples commonly cited, a minor but important female character in the Silmarilion, Aredhel, says to her oppressive bros, "I am your sister and not your servant, and beyond your bounds I will go as seems good to me!" Which isn't too terrible for a white guy in 1917 or so.

    Edit: Also: Trolls.
    Last edited by Wisko McBadgerton; 04-08-2017, 10:07 AM.
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    • Re: 115th Congress. In Bridge, Can Hearts be Trumped? In Spades!

      Yeah, I really don't think misogyny is as big of a factor as Hillary and third-wave feminists want to believe. What it really boils down to is, 25 years of smear campaigns and phony scandalmongering against the Clintons, finally paid off for the Rs. Americans are tired of hearing the Clinton name, tired of seeing them on TV, and just want them to retire and go away.

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      • Re: 115th Congress. In Bridge, Can Hearts be Trumped? In Spades!

        Originally posted by Handyman View Post
        No there were more Balrogs in a previous age I do believe...

        Yep
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        • Re: 115th Congress. In Bridge, Can Hearts be Trumped? In Spades!

          Originally posted by Wisko McBadgerton View Post
          what I'm getting at is that among the left and the part of the the middle needed, the contention is that misogyny played a major factor.
          Sexism was not a reason for Hillary losing. The sexists, however large, are a subset of the Republican base voters. There wasn't a single one of those votes Hillary was going to pick up.

          It's the same with racism, to a point. The racists, however large, are a subset of the Republican base voters. There wasn't a single one of those votes Obama was going to pick up. The one difference was Obama seemed to magnetize racists to come out of the woodwork for the GOP. I'm not sure this happened with the sexists. There was plenty of Hillary Derangement, but I think that was primarily driven by the Clinton Derangement that the Echo Chamber has been using to get rich for 25 years.
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          • Re: 115th Congress. In Bridge, Can Hearts be Trumped? In Spades!

            Originally posted by Kepler View Post
            Sexism was not a reason for Hillary losing. The sexists, however large, are a subset of the Republican base voters. There wasn't a single one of those votes Hillary was going to pick up.

            It's the same with racism, to a point. The racists, however large, are a subset of the Republican base voters. There wasn't a single one of those votes Obama was going to pick up. The one difference was Obama seemed to magnetize racists to come out of the woodwork for the GOP. I'm not sure this happened with the sexists. There was plenty of Hillary Derangement, but I think that was primarily driven by the Clinton Derangement that the Echo Chamber has been using to get rich for 25 years.
            And all that is irrelevant. Trump got Romney numbers. Clinton voters didn't come out. You can't explain away the misogyny just because it was the Democrats who were misogynist. There is a subset of Democratic voters who will not vote for a woman. You know it. I know it. That's one of the many groups within the Democratic party that stayed home on election day. Is that a huge group? No. But, it wasn't a huge number that lost the election now was it?
            **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

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            • Re: 115th Congress. In Bridge, Can Hearts be Trumped? In Spades!

              Originally posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
              And all that is irrelevant. Trump got Romney numbers. Clinton voters didn't come out. You can't explain away the misogyny just because it was the Democrats who were misogynist. There is a subset of Democratic voters who will not vote for a woman. You know it.
              No, I don't "know it." I think it's a mistaken premise with nothing behind it but a tired "sky is falling" shtick. People didn't not vote for Hillary because she was a woman. People did not vote for Hillary because she's fundamentally unlikable, and because the Echo Chamber successfully made her out to be Satan.

              Warren, Sebelius, Klobuchar, Gillibrand, or McCaskill all win that election, just as Harris will win in 2020.
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              • Re: 115th Congress. In Bridge, Can Hearts be Trumped? In Spades!

                Klobuchar doesnt win that election at all. Warren I think has issues as well. You are taking a huge leap pretending that the Right wont go after every candidate the same way and if they find something wont destroy them over it. Especially warren, her personality is so off putting to many people she would have issues all over the place.

                To deny that some Democrats are misogynists though is putting your head in the sand. Some are, some are also racist. Some hate Jews. Some are just jerkoffs. They are no more pure of heart than anyone else and to think otherwise is academically bankrupt.
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                • Re: 115th Congress. In Bridge, Can Hearts be Trumped? In Spades!

                  The one D that would have won quite handily was Landslide Joe Biden. Likeable, any issues were minor and would have preserved the status quo.
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                  • Re: 115th Congress. In Bridge, Can Hearts be Trumped? In Spades!

                    Originally posted by Handyman View Post
                    Klobuchar doesnt win that election at all. Warren I think has issues as well. You are taking a huge leap pretending that the Right wont go after every candidate the same way and if they find something wont destroy them over it. Especially warren, her personality is so off putting to many people she would have issues all over the place.
                    Warren's personality isn't off-putting to me at all, though to be fair that may simply be because I tend to be on the same wavelength as professors. I would be honestly surprised if more people found her off-putting than, say, Obama, who has the same problem with the proles ("you tryin' to say you're smarter n' me?!")

                    I'm not "pretending" the Right won't attack anybody with a (D). Obviously that's their signature move. But Hillary was uniquely vulnerable for two reasons (1) you want off-putting? She would be the Olympic champion. (2) 25 years of accumulation. She was the RWNJ dream Democratic nominee.

                    What is with this crap of reading minds, by the way? "You know it." "Pretending." Don't quit your day job, you're not cut out to be a Mentalist.


                    To deny that some Democrats are misogynists though is putting your head in the sand. Some are, some are also racist. Some hate Jews. Some are just jerkoffs. They are no more pure of heart than anyone else and to think otherwise is academically bankrupt.
                    I can't believe I even have to say this but I will. Yes. Of course some Democrats are sexist, or racist, or cannibals. We are talking about probabilities. There are no absolute statements concerning sufficiently large groupings of human beings except that one.
                    Last edited by Kepler; 04-10-2017, 10:08 AM.
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                    • Re: 115th Congress. In Bridge, Can Hearts be Trumped? In Spades!

                      Originally posted by joecct View Post
                      The one D that would have won quite handily was Landslide Joe Biden. Likeable, any issues were minor and would have preserved the status quo.
                      I wouldn't say the one D, because most half-way decent candidates would have had no trouble with The Toddler Tyrant, but Biden would have won with near Obama 2008 numbers, yes. I don't believe he would have flipped any additional states because the country is simply too polarized right now, and he would have lost IN because the Obama win there in 2008 was a once-in-a-thousand-trials outlier.
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                      • Re: 115th Congress. In Bridge, Can Hearts be Trumped? In Spades!

                        Originally posted by joecct View Post
                        The one D that would have won quite handily was Landslide Joe Biden. Likeable, any issues were minor and would have preserved the status quo.
                        People didn't want the status quo, that was not a positive this election.

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                        • Re: 115th Congress. In Bridge, Can Hearts be Trumped? In Spades!

                          Originally posted by Handyman View Post
                          Klobuchar doesnt win that election at all. Warren I think has issues as well. You are taking a huge leap pretending that the Right wont go after every candidate the same way and if they find something wont destroy them over it. Especially warren, her personality is so off putting to many people she would have issues all over the place.

                          To deny that some Democrats are misogynists though is putting your head in the sand. Some are, some are also racist. Some hate Jews. Some are just jerkoffs. They are no more pure of heart than anyone else and to think otherwise is academically bankrupt.
                          The difference between Hillary and every other one of those people is that the GOP had 24 years to prepare for her. Warren is much like Hillary, except for far fewer years. Though there's the ol' Pocahontas marker, making her a proven liar to many people. Likely a significant issue, and not simply a joke subject, to many blue collar workers.
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                          • Re: 115th Congress. In Bridge, Can Hearts be Trumped? In Spades!

                            Originally posted by Handyman View Post
                            Klobuchar doesnt win that election at all. Warren I think has issues as well. You are taking a huge leap pretending that the Right wont go after every candidate the same way and if they find something wont destroy them over it. Especially warren, her personality is so off putting to many people she would have issues all over the place.

                            To deny that some Democrats are misogynists though is putting your head in the sand. Some are, some are also racist. Some hate Jews. Some are just jerkoffs. They are no more pure of heart than anyone else and to think otherwise is academically bankrupt.
                            Gotta agree with this. People are also discounting the laziness/exhaustion of the Dem base which had been in power for 8 years. Whenever that happens the whiners start making noise that since they didn't get 100% of what they wanted while in power they're picking up their ball and going home. Short of an Obama 3rd term, I don't think we can say anybody else would have won this race. Even Biden who I happen to like would have been tagged as being too old, sickly/grief stricken (yes, Trump would have gone there), and if Hillary had been in DC too long, I''ll remind everybody Biden got elected to the Senate in 1972 and never left Washington.
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                            • Originally posted by Rover View Post
                              ... I''ll remind everybody Biden got elected to the Senate in 1972 and never left Washington.
                              Not quite true. He took Amtrak back to Wilmington every weekend.
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                              • Re: 115th Congress. In Bridge, Can Hearts be Trumped? In Spades!

                                Well Played South Carolina

                                Joe Wilson is a POS so it is doubly awesome
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