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  • Originally posted by MissThundercat View Post
    Inevitably with bigots, I need to remember it's never their fault. I remember with Bob Gray, he elevated himself to martyr status and was desperate for us to get the hammer and nails and put him up in a couple of minutes.
    Bigots come in every size, shape, skin-color and sexual orientation.

    So do bullies who refuse to consider what the other bigots say, and that's exactly what we're seeing from your gang right now.

    Wake up. We all need to consider each others' cultural sensitivities- now more that ever -and find a way to make it work to some extent for the bulk of us.

    A smart man (was it Abbie Hoffman?) once said that the difference between revolutionary hate and conventional hate amounts to the difference between dog **** and chicken ****, and he was right about that.

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    • Originally posted by Stauber1 View Post
      This thread is something else.....

      Fish, for the umpteenth time, we aren't *creating* a problem by failing to enact new laws. On the contrary, some people are trying to create new laws to address a problem that *doesn't exist*.

      And you know this. It's why you move the goalposts, going from "you're naive if you think men aren't creeping into the ladies room!" - to - "we can't push too hard, society just isn't ready for it and we might scare away all the bigots."

      We get it. You aren't comfortable with transgender folks. That must be tough for you. But just because you get the ickies it doesn't mean other people should have their right to exist legislated away (and the ability to go to the bathroom is a pretty fucking basic part of existence).
      So you feel free to visit the the closest BR at any juncture?

      Sure you do. I would too, but that **** won't flush just yet.

      This sort of "logic" is a considerable factor in the continuing existence of Trumpism, but it's not going to work.

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      • Originally posted by Fishman'81 View Post

        Bigots come in every size, shape, skin-color and sexual orientation.

        So do bullies who refuse to consider what the other bigots say, and that's exactly what we're seeing from your gang right now.

        Wake up. We all need to consider each others' cultural sensitivities- now more that ever -and find a way to make it work to some extent for the bulk of us.

        A smart man (was it Abbie Hoffman?) once said that the difference between revolutionary hate and conventional hate amounts to the difference between dog **** and chicken ****, and he was right about that.
        No one is bullying you they're simply calling you out for whining about a problem that doesn't exist.

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        • Originally posted by Slap Shot View Post

          No one is bullying you they're simply calling you out for whining about a problem that doesn't exist.
          I'll also add that which can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence. Being asked to provide evidence and being dismissed for lack of it isn't bullying either. At least Flaggy cited his sources, even if they were grainy YouTube videos.

          And also, speaking of Trump voters, polls indicate growing support of trans rights across the board with the only holdouts being far-right wing Evangelicals.

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          • Originally posted by Slap Shot View Post

            No one is bullying you they're simply calling you out for whining about a problem that doesn't exist.
            Well, it's obviously a problem in half of the country, and that makes it an actual problem.

            Still, it's not rocket science to find some middle ground, which has been my point from the get-go.

            All-stall BR's are the wave of the future, and I'm not worried a bit about who occupies the adjacent one, unless my neighbor has downed burritos and draft beer the prior evening.
            Last edited by Fishman'81; 05-30-2021, 12:12 AM.

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            • As bigotry is exposed it retreats. At first, bigotries are the unexamined assumption of 95% of "common sense" people. The victims speak up and little by little the mass of people is educated and, because they have human empathy, they abandon their biases. Or, more exactly, the older ones die off and the kids who were raised to hate reject their parents' lessons.

              But it only retreats down to the set of authoritarians, where it holds on as strong as ever. The core, Right, reactionary base is just as racist, just as misogynist, just as homophobic and transphobic, as it ever was, and always will be. These people are incapable of putting themselves into anyone else's shoes. They are fascists. They will die fascists, as will their children and all their descendants.

              Conservatives are a permanent class of cognitive failures.
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              • Originally posted by Fishman'81 View Post

                Well, it's obviously a problem in half of the country, and that makes it an actual problem.
                Repeating a lie won't eventually make it come true.

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                • Originally posted by Kepler View Post
                  As bigotry is exposed it retreats. At first, bigotries are the unexamined assumption of 95% of "common sense" people. The victims speak up and little by little the mass of people is educated and, because they have human empathy, they abandon their biases. Or, more exactly, the older ones die off and the kids who were raised to hate reject their parents' lessons.

                  But it only retreats down to the set of authoritarians, where it holds on as strong as ever. The core, Right, reactionary base is just as racist, just as misogynist, just as homophobic and transphobic, as it ever was, and always will be. These people are incapable of putting themselves into anyone else's shoes. They are fascists. They will die fascists, as will their children and all their descendants.

                  Conservatives are a permanent class of cognitive failures.
                  There are 1.5 million KNOWN trans and non-conforming people in the country.

                  The only reason why trans people are at the front of the culture war now is because Republicans and the Religious Right are desperate to hold on to power.

                  Reminder: just because there is proposed legislation against it, doesn't make it a problem. See "voter fraud ."
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                  • Originally posted by MissThundercat View Post

                    There are 1.5 million KNOWN trans and non-conforming people in the country.

                    The only reason why trans people are at the front of the culture war now is because Republicans and the Religious Right are desperate to hold on to power.

                    Reminder: just because there is proposed legislation against it, doesn't make it a problem. See "voter fraud ."
                    This is true. The Republicans need someone scary* to point to and say "LOOK! BE ASCURRRRRED". Without fear, they lose.

                    *note: doesn't actually need to be scary. Just able to be described as scary. Like a Great Dane. Huge dog, kinda scary if you didn't know they are basically just a small cow and essentially harmless. And when you get to know them, they're very friendly.
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                    • Originally posted by Fishman'81 View Post

                      Well, it's obviously a problem in half of the country
                      No, it isn't.

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                      • Originally posted by MissThundercat View Post

                        There are 1.5 million KNOWN trans and non-conforming people in the country.

                        The only reason why trans people are at the front of the culture war now is because Republicans and the Religious Right are desperate to hold on to power.

                        Reminder: just because there is proposed legislation against it, doesn't make it a problem. See "voter fraud ."
                        Please don't conflate an issue of societal bathroom norms with the Fascist voter-suppression bills. There is no real comparison to be made, in terms of impact.





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                        • Societal bathroom norms lol

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                          • Originally posted by Deutsche Gopher Fan View Post
                            Societal bathroom norms lol
                            If he keeps swinging, maybe he'll give us a cold.
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                            • I mean the absolute nerve of me, going out and participating in society and using the bathroom that corresponds with my gender!
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                              "One word frees us from the weight and pain of this life. That word is love."- Socrates
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                              • Originally posted by MissThundercat View Post
                                I mean the absolute nerve of me, going out and participating in society and using the bathroom that corresponds with my gender!
                                I know! But since it’s not as important as ensuring the very survival of our democracy, we have no time for you - back of the line! It’s just such a crying shame that we can only work on a single issue at a time....

                                Oh, if only our brave legislators had the capacity to do absolutely nothing about banning people from bathrooms while saving democracy.
                                If you don't change the world today, how can it be any better tomorrow?

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