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Campaign 2016 Part XVI: KICK THE BABY!

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  • #256
    Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVI: KICK THE BABY!

    Originally posted by Kepler View Post
    There's still that third group: the party cynics. There are plenty of people who are publicly supporting and enabling Trump for purely political reasons, without believing any of the gibberish. This includes "professional Republicans" such as politicians (in office or out), pundits, and party apparatchiks. These people wouldn't let the average sincere Trump supporter into their gated community, let alone their home.
    There's no question that between the two of us I am clearly the more pessimistic person Kep, but here, I think you're flat wrong. Yes there are exceptions who prove the rule. There are some Trump voters who don't hate blacks, or immigrants or maybe even rebel flag wearing, demolition derby going, summer teeth sporting residents of the average rural southern Ohio county. But they are few and far between. I think the majority of Trump supporters are people who believe the worst things about other people who look different and that support is bigotry borne.

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    • #257
      Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVI: KICK THE BABY!

      Originally posted by WeAreNDHockey View Post
      There's no question that between the two of us I am clearly the more pessimistic person Kep, but here, I think you're flat wrong. Yes there are exceptions who prove the rule. There are some Trump voters who don't hate blacks, or immigrants or maybe even rebel flag wearing, demolition derby going, summer teeth sporting residents of the average rural southern Ohio county. But they are few and far between. I think the majority of Trump supporters are people who believe the worst things about other people who look different and that support is bigotry borne.
      There's a big chunk of them no doubt. But I just don't think one can overestimate party affiliation inertia. Most people who vote for X 3 times in succession will keep on voting X until the day they die -- the nominee doesn't matter. Nor is inertia entirely unreasonable, since platforms persist across decades and the parties do represent the basic inventive/curious (liberal) vs. consistent/cautious (conservative) personality attribute dichotomy. Our politics is to some extent wired right into our heads.
      Last edited by Kepler; 08-07-2016, 09:59 AM.
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      • #258
        Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVI: KICK THE BABY!

        This is a clean summary view of the polling.
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        • #259
          Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVI: KICK THE BABY!

          Is really anyone surprised?
          "I went over the facts in my head, and admired how much uglier the situation had just become. Over the years I've learned that ignorance is more than just bliss. It's freaking orgasmic ecstasy".- Harry Dresden, Blood Rites


          Western Michigan Bronco Hockey- 2012 Mason Cup Champions

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          • #260
            Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVI: KICK THE BABY!

            Originally posted by bronconick View Post
            Is really anyone surprised?
            They've gotta solve this problem first.
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            • #261
              Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVI: KICK THE BABY!

              Now you see, a smart campaign would do everything it can to walk away from stuff like that...Drumpf embraces it.
              "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
              -aparch

              "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
              -INCH

              Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
              -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

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              • #262
                Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVI: KICK THE BABY!

                If three or four top level elected Republicans could be as forceful in a dissent on Trump as Rick Wilson is in this, I'd feel a lot better about November.

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                • #263
                  Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVI: KICK THE BABY!

                  Originally posted by Handyman View Post
                  Now you see, a smart campaign would do everything it can to walk away from stuff like that...Drumpf embraces it.
                  Trump embraces it not out of stupidity (although he may be dumber than he paints himself in his endless boasts) but because he believes what he is saying. Trump is a close-minded, hateful, bigoted little piece of 5h!t. He is running as the person he is and his supporters are -- by and large -- with him on all aspects.

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                  • #264
                    Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVI: KICK THE BABY!

                    Originally posted by Brenthoven View Post
                    Have an honest question here...for the most part, the Dems haven't really attacked Trump until recently. They've stayed above the fray, instead they have patted themselves on the back. Trump has not changed his tactics, really. Is he counting on the marginal voters, or the Bernie Bros to see the changed tactics in the Dem camp as a...for lack of a better word, truly....desperate move? A sign of weakness?
                    IMO attacks are not just a Trump thing. Watch Fox News or listen to Rush Limbaugh, and more recently MSNBC. One has no idea what their platform is...except that is for 'attack'. The GOP has shifted in that direction. Dems typically do on the attack, but mostly just in the heat of an election cycle. After Sanders, unification was just Hillary's first order of business.
                    Go Gophers!

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                    • #265
                      Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVI: KICK THE BABY!

                      Originally posted by WeAreNDHockey View Post
                      If three or four top level elected Republicans could be as forceful in a dissent on Trump as Rick Wilson is in this, I'd feel a lot better about November.
                      From the article:

                      Trump's entire path to victory has been predicated on winning white men, particularly less educated white men, in droves. Yet he is right now underperforming Mitt Romney's 2012 showing among whites, men, white evangelicals and whites without a college degree, while hemorrhaging every other demographic.
                      That is pretty sad.

                      And while Drumpf is everything he puts forth, the people behind the campaign, and the GOP in general should be doing everything they can to keep this stuff away from him. Someone in that campaign has to know what it to takes to actually win an election.
                      "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
                      -aparch

                      "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
                      -INCH

                      Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
                      -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

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                      • #266
                        Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVI: KICK THE BABY!

                        Originally posted by WeAreNDHockey View Post
                        If three or four top level elected Republicans could be as forceful in a dissent on Trump as Rick Wilson is in this, I'd feel a lot better about November.
                        I'll feel better when stories like that run in the NY Post.

                        This is not a war we on the left can win. We can beat Trump in an election, but the only people who can stop the normalization of Trump are people on the right. That takes this out of the ordinary horse race and makes it a united effort to protect democracy and reject autocracy.
                        Cornell University
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                        ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
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                        • #267
                          Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVI: KICK THE BABY!

                          Originally posted by Kepler View Post
                          I'll feel better when stories like that run in the NY Post.

                          This is not a war we on the left can win. We can beat Trump in an election, but the only people who can stop the normalization of Trump are people on the right. That takes this out of the ordinary horse race and makes it a united effort to protect democracy and reject autocracy.
                          Give it time...they wont put anything like that out this far away from the election because they have money to make on reader interest. They have a lot invested in coverage...

                          Like I said, if the debates go as bad as we all kind of expect them to then you will see the corporate overlords start to distance themselves. When it becomes obvious no amount of spin will make Drumpf work for the majority then it becomes a game of "how much money can we make on the schadenfreude. I think for this election we can just call that the Laugher Curve...the point when the downfall is more fically advantageous than propping them up.

                          Now...if WikiLeaks is able to get their hands on Drumpfs tax returns like they said they are trying to do...then the game changes fast and furious!
                          "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
                          -aparch

                          "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
                          -INCH

                          Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
                          -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

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                          • #268
                            Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVI: KICK THE BABY!

                            Originally posted by Handyman View Post
                            ...Someone in that campaign has to know what it to takes to actually win an election.
                            No one who is a Republican "company guy" wants to willingly attach themselves to Trump. AND Trump likely doesn't want to spend money to get those type of people, when he can get go-getters who don't know better right out of college for a fraction of the price.
                            “Demolish the bridges behind you… then there is no choice but to build again.”

                            Live Radio from 100.3

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                            • #269
                              Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVI: KICK THE BABY!

                              That isnt true...if guys like Rick Santorum are out there campaigning for him that means he has to have some of the GOP insiders with him and their staffs. He isnt getting guys like Bush or Romney but the guys who ran against them he is trying to bring into the fold.
                              "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
                              -aparch

                              "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
                              -INCH

                              Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
                              -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

                              Comment

                              • #270
                                Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVI: KICK THE BABY!

                                Originally posted by aparch View Post
                                No one who is a Republican "company guy" wants to willingly attach themselves to Trump. AND Trump likely doesn't want to spend money to get those type of people, when he can get go-getters who don't know better right out of college for a fraction of the price.
                                Manafort is actually a big deal GOP consultant. IINM he has worked for every GOP nominee since Reagan.
                                Cornell University
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                                ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
                                Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

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