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  • #61
    Re: Major earthquake in Haiti

    Originally posted by jmh View Post
    Blaming the victims for some mythical deal with the devil and blaming American foreign policy for historical events in the not-too-long-ago past (whether you agree with the stance or not) aren't even close to the same thing, let alone just being one incremental step from each other.
    Right, America bashing and the hatred that it generates, has a much more modern feel to it. Much more relevant. Much more prevelant. I do apologize for not giving anti-Americanism the respect it deserves.
    2011 Poser of the Year & Pulitzer Prize winning machine gunner.

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    • #62
      Re: Major earthquake in Haiti

      Originally posted by Old Pio View Post
      Right, America bashing and the hatred that it generates, has a much more modern feel to it. Much more relevant. Much more prevelant. I do apologize for not giving anti-Americanism the respect it deserves.
      The difference isn't between "modern" and "not modern", the difference is between attributing the problems in Haiti to historical events and mythical ones.

      In any case, I apologize for not realizing that it's anti-American to think it's possible that the USA might have at some point in the past done something that was incorrect or had a negative impact on anyone.
      Cornell University Men's Hockey
      NCAA Champions: 1967, 1970
      ECAC Champions: 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
      Ivy League Champions: 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018

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      • #63
        Re: Major earthquake in Haiti

        Originally posted by jmh View Post
        The difference isn't between "modern" and "not modern", the difference is between attributing the problems in Haiti to historical events and mythical ones.

        In any case, I apologize for not realizing that it's anti-American to think it's possible that the USA might have at some point in the past done something that was incorrect or had a negative impact on anyone.
        Yup, that's what I said and that's what I meant. Glad you got the point. BTW, the "problem" in Haiti is a monstrous devastating earthquake, the genesis of which cannot be blamed on the United States. My only point and in your irresistable impulse to blame America first, you evidently missed it, is that perhaps we should prioritize here and blame America later. Wrong again, Pio. And if you simply can't stop yourself from being critical of America, you might consider complaining about the "insufficiency" or "inappropriateness" or "slowness" of the help we're providing. At least that would be on point.
        Last edited by Old Pio; 01-15-2010, 01:07 PM.
        2011 Poser of the Year & Pulitzer Prize winning machine gunner.

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        • #64
          Re: Major earthquake in Haiti

          How in the name of Zeus' butthole would climate of any way, shape or form, have anything to do with an earthquake? I can't even begin to fathom the thought process required to make the connection. At least try for something equally asinine that involves the earth, like blame it on the oil wells dug in the Gulf of Mexico.

          Goddammit, I just gave them their next big idea, didn't I?
          "I went over the facts in my head, and admired how much uglier the situation had just become. Over the years I've learned that ignorance is more than just bliss. It's freaking orgasmic ecstasy".- Harry Dresden, Blood Rites


          Western Michigan Bronco Hockey- 2012 Mason Cup Champions

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          • #65
            Re: Major earthquake in Haiti

            Originally posted by bronconick View Post
            How in the name of Zeus' butthole would climate of any way, shape or form, have anything to do with an earthquake? I can't even begin to fathom the thought process required to make the connection. At least try for something equally asinine that involves the earth, like blame it on the oil wells dug in the Gulf of Mexico.

            Goddammit, I just gave them their next big idea, didn't I?
            And the winner for this week's colorful phrase is. . .Bronconick. Before you give credit to your gay middle school drama teacher, here's the link to the article about Danny Glover. The relevant quote comes toward the end.

            http://blogs.news.com.au/dailytelegr...act_with_gaia/
            2011 Poser of the Year & Pulitzer Prize winning machine gunner.

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            • #66
              Re: Major earthquake in Haiti

              Originally posted by gregg729 View Post
              Good on you! I'd look into volunteer organizations myself if I weren't starting a new job on the 1st.
              I hear ya on the new job, especially in todays market. Part of the benefits of owning a company is I can swing these sorts of things without any real issues. I imagine its also harder with a wife and kids to be responsible for too...
              "Look to the end, no matter what it is you are considering. Often enough, God gives man a glimpse of happiness, and then utterly ruins him"

              -Herodotus

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              • #67
                Re: Major earthquake in Haiti

                Haitian hip-hop artist and Wyclef Jean's Haitian organizer for Yele Haiti, Jimmy O, is a victim of the earthquake.

                http://marquee.blogs.cnn.com/2010/01...-quake/?hpt=T2
                Uncle Mickey: July 23, 1950-July 22, 2003

                WRPI, 91.5 FM...usually color commentary.

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                • #68
                  Re: Major earthquake in Haiti

                  Originally posted by Old Pio View Post
                  BTW, the "problem" in Haiti is a monstrous devastating earthquake, the genesis of which cannot be blamed on the United States. My only point and in your irresistable impulse to blame America first, you evidently missed it, is that perhaps we should prioritize here and blame America later.
                  A) Nobody is blaming America for the earthquake, obviously.
                  B) But you're right, we should be prioritizing, the important thing is that we all should be focused on the people of Haiti and on doing what needs to be done to get them through this difficult time. The rest can wait.

                  Edit to clarify: Nobody here is blaming America for the earthquake.
                  Last edited by jmh; 01-15-2010, 02:55 PM.
                  Cornell University Men's Hockey
                  NCAA Champions: 1967, 1970
                  ECAC Champions: 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
                  Ivy League Champions: 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018

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                  • #69
                    Re: Major earthquake in Haiti

                    Originally posted by BadgerAlum@WMU View Post
                    There actually is a priority list, and DC and Puerto Rico are on the top of that list, followed by current territories. This also came up during the 1995 Quebec referendum when it was hypothesized that the Atlantic provinces might petition for statehood/territorial status in the US if Quebec voted 'oui.' If you want, I can give you the source, once I dig out my masters' thesis (on Canadian English-French political relations pre-confederation).
                    As a totally irrelevant aside, I've done some academic work on the same subject. As I recall there were some rumoured plans or sketches about the maritimes (and Newfoundland?) bolting for the states. Of course once Quebecois were beaten by "money and the ethnic vote" everyone disowned the idea Greater New England was ever in the works. I've seen some moderately plausible scenarios where the entire Canadian Confederation collapses and joins the US piecemeal except for an independent Quebec.

                    On topic,

                    Does anyone or organization know what rural areas are like after this? Is it possible they're actually better off without any large structures to collapse on peoples heads.
                    Last edited by BoomGoestheDynamite; 01-15-2010, 03:05 PM.

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                    • #70
                      Re: Major earthquake in Haiti

                      Originally posted by UNH '00 View Post
                      China gave $1 million
                      MLB gave $1 million
                      Yankees gave $500K
                      Mrs. Tom Brady gave $1.5 million

                      hmmmm......
                      NHL giving $100,000
                      R.I.P. NASC/MCLA Mohawks Hockey

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                      • #71
                        Re: Major earthquake in Haiti

                        Originally posted by jmh View Post
                        A) Nobody is blaming America for the earthquake, obviously.
                        B) But you're right, we should be prioritizing, the important thing is that we all should be focused on the people of Haiti and on doing what needs to be done to get them through this difficult time. The rest can wait.

                        Edit to clarify: Nobody here is blaming America for the earthquake.
                        Right. And nobody here is nostalgic for the Duvaliers, Pere and Fils. And the same goes for Aristide, who's evidently threatening to return to Haiti from South Africa (?). Once we've dealt with the immediate (overwhelming) problems it becomes a bit trickier. If we just flow money in for reconstruction and the inevitable corruption takes a huge bite of it, then we've done wrong. On the other hand, the extent to which we expect and demand that the money be spent wisely, we'll just as surely be accused of "colonialism" or something.

                        But all of that can wait for another day. Right now, we need to do what we can when we can and ask the Almighty to give these poor people his blessings.
                        Last edited by Old Pio; 01-15-2010, 03:40 PM.
                        2011 Poser of the Year & Pulitzer Prize winning machine gunner.

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                        • #72
                          Re: Major earthquake in Haiti

                          Originally posted by BoomGoestheDynamite View Post
                          As a totally irrelevant aside, I've done some academic work on the same subject. As I recall there were some rumoured plans or sketches about the maritimes (and Newfoundland?) bolting for the states. Of course once Quebecois were beaten by "money and the ethnic vote" everyone disowned the idea Greater New England was ever in the works. I've seen some moderately plausible scenarios where the entire Canadian Confederation collapses and joins the US piecemeal except for an independent Quebec.

                          On topic,

                          Does anyone or organization know what rural areas are like after this? Is it possible they're actually better off without any large structures to collapse on peoples heads.
                          You remind me of a lecture from my professor of geomorphology, Muhammad Ali Rizvi (who used to kid that he was also from DU--Dacca University) who explained that compared to other natural disasters, earthquakes are really not that big a deal, except when they occur under populated areas. There are evidently earthquakes going on all the time.

                          You're probably right in that rural areas haven't suffered the cataclysmic damage we've seen in Port au Prince, on the other hand, those areas have something approaching zero infra structure, and aren't able to adequately support the folks who live there (arable farm land is a dream for most of 'em) much less refugees from the city. Water, food, sewage, heat, light, medical care, these are all things in very short supply under the best of circumstances. Now?
                          2011 Poser of the Year & Pulitzer Prize winning machine gunner.

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                          • #73
                            Re: Major earthquake in Haiti

                            Originally posted by Old Pio View Post
                            You remind me of a lecture from my professor of geomorphology, Muhammad Ali Rizvi (who used to kid that he was also from DU--Dacca University) who explained that compared to other natural disasters, earthquakes are really not that big a deal, except when they occur under populated areas. There are evidently earthquakes going on all the time.

                            You're probably right in that rural areas haven't suffered the cataclysmic damage we've seen in Port au Prince, on the other hand, those areas have something approaching zero infra structure, and aren't able to adequately support the folks who live there (arable farm land is a dream for most of 'em) much less refugees from the city. Water, food, sewage, heat, light, medical care, these are all things in very short supply under the best of circumstances. Now?
                            Yeah, I suppose their good be serious problems if/when the rural population decideds that if the government/NGO goods and services aren't coming to them, they'll go to Port Au Prince or the other larger towns and just create mass slums waiting for Aid.

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                            • #74
                              Re: Major earthquake in Haiti

                              Originally posted by BoomGoestheDynamite View Post
                              On topic,

                              Does anyone or organization know what rural areas are like after this? Is it possible they're actually better off without any large structures to collapse on peoples heads.
                              Like I posted before, it depends on if they are like many of the other islands and use concrete block for construction. If there is a lot of that, I'd worry the the destruction will find it's way into the countryside..

                              The block is very hurricane safe... But not exactly good for earthquakes in the manner I've seen it built on other islands...

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                              • #75
                                Re: Major earthquake in Haiti

                                Originally posted by AMC View Post
                                It wasn't France that spent a good chunk of the 20th Century either a.) brutally occupying Haiti over a sugar pricing dispute or b.) propping up one of the most kleptomaniac, insane, violent regimes the world has ever seen.

                                The US has always treated Haiti like a pariah, starting with its independence and US terror over a slave revolt in the American south. We dropped the ball in Haiti, like we dropped the ball everywhere else we pursued regime change and intervention to use an independent nation as a pawn in a geopolitical chess match. I have no problem with us taking full responsibility for not rebuilding, but plain BUILDING a viable, independent Haiti, no matter the cost.
                                Oh good grief, get real. I have a big problem with this proposal of turning a natural disaster into a golden opportunity to punish the evil American hegemony.

                                This argument is no different than Jesse Jackson's proposal of reparations to black Americans for Antebellum slave ownership, and equally idiotic.

                                We're Haiti's wealthy neighbor. And we're the strongest power on the planet that frequently plays the role of moral authority when our leadership has the backbone to use it. For those reasons, we should be giving aid to Haiti. And $100 million is an appropriate starting amount.

                                I think it's very disgraceful to use a natural catastrophe as an opportunity for voicing your chip on your shoulder about your country, AMC.
                                Last edited by gregg729; 01-15-2010, 06:24 PM.
                                PAUL THOMPSON FOR HOBEY!www.thompsonforhobey.com

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