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Your Political Stance - 2014 Edition

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  • Re: Your Political Stance - 2014 Edition

    Originally posted by joecct View Post
    Do you have a Graham Chapman jacket and pipe handy?
    Now you mention it...
    Cornell University
    National Champion 1967, 1970
    ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
    Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

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    • Re: Your Political Stance - 2014 Edition

      Originally posted by Kepler View Post
      Yesterday's goooooone.....
      ....wit'he wiiiiiiiiiiiind.

      Originally posted by FreshFish View Post
      it is true that I am not at all in favor of a totalitarianism that purports to be for my own good (as defined by people who consider themselves to be smarter than me). i truly do not understand why so many people here would forfeit liberty so quickly based on a dream that government compulsion is actually good for us in today's world, because (they claim) we are now incapable of recognizing our own best interests otherwise.

      Many of us do not need to be forcibly compelled to help those less fortunate than ourselves, we gladly volunteer our time, talent, and treasure to do so.
      I'd also like to go back to a simpler time, but it doesn't exist - this is 2014, not 1814. Hell, if I had been a 27 year-old in 1814, based on calculated income inflation, my entire family would probably be privileged, rich landowners/slaveholders - so as far as I'm concerned, eliminate the slaves and - Wooooooo! Yes Please! .

      But this is 2014 and the 21st century, my parents and their two vacation homes have sharted away my generation's shot at an upper-middle class existence, and so I've decided to embrace reality. The US has had its moment, and now like the UK in 1917, we're on a long, slow, century-long decline to playing second-fiddle to China. #ThanksBoomers and #ThanksChina.

      Comment


      • Re: Your Political Stance - 2014 Edition

        Even today, there are large gaping holes in US and global society that could use volunteers. When volunteerism has taken care of a significant amount world's problems...then we can talk about creating more opportunities for them.
        Go Gophers!

        Comment


        • Re: Your Political Stance - 2014 Edition

          Originally posted by FadeToBlack&Gold View Post
          I think FF dreams of going back to an era when the US was in its salad days
          You might think that, however I do realize that none of us want to "go back" because there were too many things from those days we'd no longer countenance. No, I don't want to restore slavery as an institution, no I do not want o take the right to vote away from women (I'm not sure whether an unmarried adult woman even had a right to own property or not). Also, I am way too fond of indoor plumbing, modern sanitation, refrigeration, and the like, to be nostalgic for a simpler time either (if I were, I'd be living with the Amish, not posting on a college hockey website).

          I do think however that there is far too much complacency these days regarding a few basic freedoms which we take for granted, that are very much under attack. How far away are we from allowing national governments to censor the internet? There was a proposal that the US cede internet oversight to the UN (which fortunately was shot down -- this time ! -- by public outcry. next time??)

          What i found attractive about the Founders ideals was the dispersal of power using a system of checks and balances, and setting up different power structures to compete with each other. It seems to me that to allow too much power to be concentrated in too few hands is always a danger, for every generation, and each generation needs to rethink the appropriate level of balance.


          My test scores all indicate I'm moderate, slightly to the right. I do think we are unbalanced these days, and I'd prefer we move to the middle. I do NOT want to go all the way over to the other extreme.
          "Hope is a good thing; maybe the best of things."

          "Beer is a sign that God loves us and wants us to be happy." -- Benjamin Franklin

          "Being Irish, he had an abiding sense of tragedy, which sustained him through temporary periods of joy." -- W. B. Yeats

          "People generally are most impatient with those flaws in others about which they are most ashamed of in themselves." - folk wisdom

          Comment


          • Re: Your Political Stance - 2014 Edition

            When it comes to anyone's "political stance," I think any two-pole simplification of "right" vs "left" or "progressive" vs "conservative" conceals more than it reveals.

            There was a test somewhere that gave a broader and more nuanced view than the one that Priceless used to start this thread.

            On that test, when it comes to environmental issues, for example, I get about 82% "Green Party" score correlation.

            For political issues, a very high "Libertarian" score. People are people, both petty and generous. Put them in a position of power, no matter who they are, and their selfish urges typically will speak to them more loudly in that setting than they would otherwise. That's natural, normal, and to be expected.....and also guarded against!

            For social issues, if it were to be scored correctly, I'd be very high on the "Apathy" scale: I really don't care about most social issues very much one way or the other, and typically this attitude is conflated with a high "Libertarian" score as well.
            "Hope is a good thing; maybe the best of things."

            "Beer is a sign that God loves us and wants us to be happy." -- Benjamin Franklin

            "Being Irish, he had an abiding sense of tragedy, which sustained him through temporary periods of joy." -- W. B. Yeats

            "People generally are most impatient with those flaws in others about which they are most ashamed of in themselves." - folk wisdom

            Comment


            • Re: Your Political Stance - 2014 Edition

              Extending the abstraction of political position beyond 2-D, here is a "vosem chart" depiction in 3-D, along with a quiz and presumably evaluation (I haven't taken it yet). Here is a protracted explanation.

              Edit: Upon taking it, I wound up squarely in the Liberal octant (tolerant cultural, activist fiscal, anti-corporate).
              Last edited by Kepler; 07-28-2014, 01:13 PM.
              Cornell University
              National Champion 1967, 1970
              ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
              Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

              Comment


              • Re: Your Political Stance - 2014 Edition

                Originally posted by Kepler View Post
                Extending the abstraction of political position beyond 2-D, here is a "vosem chart" depiction in 3-D, along with a quiz and presumably evaluation (I haven't taken it yet). Here is a protracted explanation.

                Edit: Upon taking it, I wound up squarely in the Liberal octant (tolerant cultural, activist fiscal, anti-corporate).

                Where did you see the tolerant cultural, activist fiscal, anti-corporate?
                Code:
                As of 9/21/10:         As of 9/13/10:
                College Hockey 6       College Football 0
                BTHC 4                 WCHA FC:  1
                Originally posted by SanTropez
                May your paint thinner run dry and the fleas of a thousand camels infest your dead deer.
                Originally posted by bigblue_dl
                I don't even know how to classify magic vagina smoke babies..
                Originally posted by Kepler
                When the giraffes start building radio telescopes they can join too.
                He's probably going to be a superstar but that man has more baggage than North West

                Comment


                • Re: Your Political Stance - 2014 Edition

                  Originally posted by dxmnkd316 View Post
                  Where did you see the tolerant cultural, activist fiscal, anti-corporate?
                  You have to tease out the dimensions because they're not strictly stated. The first two, social and fiscal, come straight from the Nolan chart definitions. The "depth" dimension, corporate, basically works out to whether you trust or distrust corporate solutions. The idea is to disentangle two different dimensions of economic policy that are conflated in the Nolan quiz. In Nolan government and corporate power are set against each other, while this measure sees attitudes towards government and corporate power as separate dimensions. For example, an Authoritarian favors both strong government and corporate power, while a Libertarian distrusts both government and corporate power.

                  The three dimensions (IMHO) are:

                  Social: permissive to socially conservative

                  Fiscal: pro-government to anti-government

                  Corporate: pro-corporate to anti-corporate

                  The octants are:

                  Liberal: permissive, pro-government, anti-corporate
                  New Labour: permissive, pro-government, pro-corporate
                  Anarcho-syndicalist: permissive, anti-government, anti-corporate
                  Paleo-conservative: permissive, anti-government, pro-corporate
                  Totalitarian: socially conservative, pro-government, anti-corporate
                  Authoritarian: socially conservative, pro-government, pro-corporate
                  Libertarian: socially conservative, anti-government, anti-corporate
                  Conservative: socially conservative, anti-government, pro-corporate

                  I would say the Democratic party maps to New Labour while the Republican party maps to Conservative.
                  Last edited by Kepler; 07-28-2014, 02:46 PM.
                  Cornell University
                  National Champion 1967, 1970
                  ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
                  Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

                  Comment


                  • Re: Your Political Stance - 2014 Edition

                    With Election Day so close now, if you could have voted / did vote in earlier Presidential elections, who would have gotten / did get your vote, and why?

                    1952 Stevenson v Eisenhower

                    1956 Stevenson v Eisenhower

                    1960 Kennedy v Nixon

                    1964 Johnson v Goldwater

                    1968 Humphrey v Nixon v Wallace

                    1972 McGovern v Nixon

                    1976 Carter v Ford

                    1980 Carter v Reagan

                    1984 Mondale v Reagan

                    1988 Dukakis v GHW Bush

                    1992 Clinton v GHW Bush v Perot

                    1996 Clinton v Dole

                    2000 Gore v GW Bush

                    2004 Kerry v GW Bush

                    2008 Obama v McCain

                    2012 Obama v Romney
                    "Hope is a good thing; maybe the best of things."

                    "Beer is a sign that God loves us and wants us to be happy." -- Benjamin Franklin

                    "Being Irish, he had an abiding sense of tragedy, which sustained him through temporary periods of joy." -- W. B. Yeats

                    "People generally are most impatient with those flaws in others about which they are most ashamed of in themselves." - folk wisdom

                    Comment


                    • 1952 Eisenhower
                      1956 Eisenhower
                      1960 Kennedy
                      1964 Johnson
                      1968 Humphrey
                      1972 Humphrey
                      1976 Reagan
                      1980 Reagan
                      1984 GHW Bush
                      1988 GHW Bush
                      1992 Clinton
                      1996 Clinton
                      2000 GW Bush
                      2004 GW Bush
                      2008 Romney
                      2012 Romney
                      a legend and an out of work bum look a lot alike, daddy.

                      Comment


                      • Re: Your Political Stance - 2014 Edition

                        For those elections that occurred before I was born / before I could vote, I used my impressions and my youthful outlook on the world.

                        1952 Eisenhower was in charge of the entire Allied effort in Europe, not just US Army. We won decisively. There's this pesky Korea situation left over to wrap up. DDE

                        1956 Things are going really well. His Interstate Expressway System sounds like a good idea. Why mess with a good thing? DDE

                        1960 Kennedy was exciting, energetic, idealistic. Nixon is dour. JFK.

                        1964 Did you see that TV commercial with a young girl and a daisy? Goldwater identified himself as an extremist. LBJ

                        1968 Wallace's "states' rights" platform is a joke, it's just disguised racism. Yuck. Humphrey is the champion of the working man and I'm a working man. HHH

                        1972 It might be fun to be a hippy, but who wants to put a hippy in charge of the US government? Nixon's first term was acceptable enough. RMN.

                        1976 All Ford did was veto bills. Carter seems earnest, idealistic, well-intentioned. JEC.
                        Historical note: I helped out as a volunteer for the Carter campaign. I would have voted for him too were I old enough.

                        1980 However decent a person he is, Carter is clearly overmatched by the job. and those d*mn*d Iranians are making us look stupid. Reagan did a fine job as governor of CA. RWR.
                        Historical note: the Iranians released the hostages about the same time that Reagan was inaugurated; he had barely started in office and the hostages were freed.
                        Note # 2: My first actual Presidential vote.


                        1984 "It's 'Morning in America'!" Things are going really well, why change? RWR.

                        1988 Things are still going well, why change? GHW Bush seems really well-qualified from his resume. Dukakis looked ridiculous in the tank picture. GHWB.

                        1992 GHW Bush is doing a fine enough job, the Berlin wall came down. GHWB.
                        Historical note: Perot received so many votes that Clinton won with less than 45% of the popular vote.

                        1996 Things are going pretty well, why change? WJC

                        2000 I didn't like Bush, I really disliked Gore. Hold your nose while voting, GWB.
                        Historical note: If Joe Lieberman had been the candidate for President rather than Vice-President, I would definitely have voted for him. He seems one of the very few politicians ever to actually have core principles and follow them consistently.

                        2004 Bush surprised me, he did a little better than I expected during his first term. Kerry's only talent seems to be marrying rich widows. GWB.

                        2008 The Matt Lauer interview: "yeah, I'd raise tax rates even if it led to reduced revenues, it's the 'fair' thing to do." The response to Joe the Plumber: "we gotta spread the wealth around." and then those Greek columns in Denver. that was too much for me, no way I'm going to vote for Elmer Gantry redux, a slick-talking con man is not want I want. Yet McCain lost his mind during the financial crisis, impulsive and scatter-brained. Even holding my nose, no way I'm voting for either one of these two. Any way we can say "none of the above, please send us two new candidates instead?" I basically voted "Present", chose neither.

                        2012 I had first-hand experience of Romney from the Salt Lake City Olympics, that was an amazing turnaround. I know someone who worked with Romney at Bain who has great respect for his character, business savvy, and leadership skills. The US government is so big and disorganized and complicated it's nearly ungovernable. We need someone with his expertise to help fix it. Restoring economic growth should be our first priority. WMR.
                        Last edited by FreshFish; 11-03-2014, 12:57 PM.
                        "Hope is a good thing; maybe the best of things."

                        "Beer is a sign that God loves us and wants us to be happy." -- Benjamin Franklin

                        "Being Irish, he had an abiding sense of tragedy, which sustained him through temporary periods of joy." -- W. B. Yeats

                        "People generally are most impatient with those flaws in others about which they are most ashamed of in themselves." - folk wisdom

                        Comment


                        • Re: Your Political Stance - 2014 Edition

                          I can't project to elections prior to my time; which "me" would I pick?

                          80: Reagan looks like an Orange County sock puppet, Carter is ethical but inept. John Anderson, Independent.
                          84: Reagan is an Orange County sock puppet, Mondale told the brutal, honest truth. Walter Mondale, Democratic.
                          88: Bush picked a cretin for a veep, Dukakis has no discernable governing ability. Ron Paul, Libertarian.
                          92: Clinton wants to enact everything I believe in. Bill Clinton, Democratic.
                          96: Clinton is the first successful president since Eisenhower. Bill Clinton, Democratic.
                          00: Dubya is a cretin, Gore is in over his head. Harry Browne, Libertarian.
                          04: Dubya is the most incompetent president in 100 years. John Kerry, Democratic.
                          08: Obama wants to enact everything I believe in; McCain picked a cretin for veep. Barack Obama, Democratic.
                          12: OK, so Obama is actually center-right, he still beats Monty Burns. Barack Obama, Democratic.
                          Cornell University
                          National Champion 1967, 1970
                          ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
                          Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

                          Comment


                          • Re: Your Political Stance - 2014 Edition

                            I'll just assume I'm 27 and harbor my current views across all of these races.

                            '52: Eisenhower (Stevenson II wasn't a bad candidate, but he was just too professorial next to a proven leader in Ike)
                            '56: Eisenhower (For the most part, he'd proven to be a pragmatist and a moderate. The economy was humming along. Dems stupidly recycled a previous failed candidate. Why change?)
                            '60: Kennedy (There was a substantial recession in the latter half of Ike's second term. Nixon looked miserable in his public appearances.)
                            '64: LBJ (He was a vile SOB, but Goldwater was a loose cannon - essentially Dubya with a higher IQ, which actually makes him more frightening)
                            '68: Nixon (Humphrey was LBJ 2.0 - pass, thanks)
                            '72: Nixon (The Trickster gets a bad rap today. Yes, the Watergate and VP bribe scandals were buffoonish, but his first term was better than Democrats want people to think)
                            '76: Write-in Reagan (if not for 2004, this would have to be the worst election in past 50 years)
                            '80: Anderson (it would take some further research and convincing, but I probably would've voted for him)
                            '84: Reagan (*slurrrrrrp*....Mmmm, Kool-Aid)
                            '88: Bush Sr. (because Dukakis seemed like a buffoon)
                            '92: Clinton (It's the economy, stupid)
                            '96: Clinton (because Dole's campaign was stillborn from the start)
                            '00: GWB (because the Tin Man makes my skin crawl)
                            '04: Write-in "None of the Above" (I still vomit at the thought of this election - I was about three months shy of being old enough to vote in it)

                            Elections in which I actually voted:

                            '08: Obama (because Palin Derangement Syndrome)
                            '12: Wrote-in "None of the Above" (because Hope & Change was a campaign promise, and Romney is the Republican Kerry)

                            Comment


                            • Re: Your Political Stance - 2014 Edition

                              2012:
                              Originally posted by dxmnkd316 View Post
                              My Political Views
                              I am a center-right social libertarian
                              Right: 1.92, Libertarian: 5.28



                              My Foreign Policy Views
                              Score: -2.25



                              My Culture War Stance
                              Score: -3.57
                              2014:
                              Originally posted by dxmnkd316 View Post
                              My Political Views
                              I am a center-right social libertarian
                              Right: 2.2, Libertarian: 4.15

                              Political Spectrum Quiz


                              My Foreign Policy Views
                              Score: -0.98

                              Political Spectrum Quiz


                              My Culture War Stance
                              Score: -2.23

                              Political Spectrum Quiz
                              2017:
                              My Political Views
                              I am a left social libertarian
                              Left: 3.94, Libertarian: 4.07

                              Political Spectrum Quiz


                              My Foreign Policy Views
                              Score: -3.92

                              Political Spectrum Quiz


                              My Culture War Stance
                              Score: -6.6

                              Political Spectrum Quiz
                              Code:
                              As of 9/21/10:         As of 9/13/10:
                              College Hockey 6       College Football 0
                              BTHC 4                 WCHA FC:  1
                              Originally posted by SanTropez
                              May your paint thinner run dry and the fleas of a thousand camels infest your dead deer.
                              Originally posted by bigblue_dl
                              I don't even know how to classify magic vagina smoke babies..
                              Originally posted by Kepler
                              When the giraffes start building radio telescopes they can join too.
                              He's probably going to be a superstar but that man has more baggage than North West

                              Comment


                              • Re: Your Political Stance - 2014 Edition

                                Seems I am also drifting left, especially on economics. This time around, I forced myself not to mark any answer 'Neutral', which could be part of it.

                                Originally posted by FadeToBlack&Gold View Post
                                My Political Views (2014)
                                I am a centrist moderate social libertarian
                                Right: 0.77, Libertarian: 2.46

                                Political Spectrum Quiz
                                My Political Views (2017)
                                I am a center-left social libertarian
                                Left: 2.36, Libertarian: 3.51

                                Political Spectrum Quiz

                                Comment

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