The Power of SCOTUS V: The Final Frontier

[Fighting Sioux 23]

Re: The Power of SCOTUS V: The Final Frontier

I guess I disagree. They specifically tiptoed around that concept because they didn't want to rule on that. Only the case on hand. Either way though, it will come up again.

I tend to agree with unofan. The Court just last term (Fisher) affirmed that Affirmative Action is okay, provided that it meets the proper strict scrutiny test. Given the issue and how controversial it is, they wouldn't have written the opinion in this way to show anything other than that Affirmative Action is still okay.

[FreshFish]

Re: The Power of SCOTUS V: The Final Frontier

they wouldn't have written the opinion in this way to show anything other than that Affirmative Action is still okay.

Affirmative action was never "okay" and Scalia was scathingly clear on that point. It is clearly in black and white inconsistent with the 14th amendment.

The real problem is that the concept of affirmative action is based on a noble and admirable quality and no reasonable person could disagree with its stated goals. That is the problem that vexes the Court: not only is it well-intentioned, not only does it attempt to redress gross prior wrongs, today there also is a large embedded industry that relies on it for sustenance.

It is merely an inferior solution to a vexing problem. You do not end discrimination by engaging in reverse discrimination. There always has been a far better alternative available to address the problem and actually try to solve it in a realistic and practical manner. Affirmative action does not help those it purports to help while it also harms those who had no role in the original problem.

Today's college students were all born 25 to 30 years after the Civil Rights Act was passed. How come they are still paying for mistakes made by their great-grandparents?

Even O'Connor wanted to end affirmative action in 25 years from the [not sure of date] case. Eventually if it is working there should be no more need for it.

[Priceless]

Re: The Power of SCOTUS V: The Final Frontier

I was in an accident but was wearing my seat belt and it saved my life. It worked. Guess I don't have to wear my seat belt anymore.

[dxmnkd316]

Re: The Power of SCOTUS V: The Final Frontier

I was in an accident but was wearing my seat belt and it saved my life. It worked. Guess I don't have to wear my seat belt anymore.

Feeling simplistic this morning, are we?

[St. Clown]

Re: The Power of SCOTUS V: The Final Frontier

Scalia and Breyer usually flip on criminal cases. I understand why Scalia does, I've never understood why Breyer does.

Alito is the biggest cop *** kisser on the bench. I still have yet to see him side with a criminal defendant. There have been a few 8-1 decisions with him as the lone dissenter in criminal cases.

Do the justices talk with one another about the vote before it's official placed? I only ask because if it looks like there will be a 9-0 decision, has Alito offerred to cast a dissenting vote in order to write an opinion on the matter? I don't know much about the guy other than he was appointed by Bush.

[goldy_331]

Re: The Power of SCOTUS V: The Final Frontier

Feeling simplistic this morning, are we?

When doesn't he?

[Fighting Sioux 23]

Re: The Power of SCOTUS V: The Final Frontier

Do the justices talk with one another about the vote before it's official placed? I only ask because if it looks like there will be a 9-0 decision, has Alito offerred to cast a dissenting vote in order to write an opinion on the matter? I don't know much about the guy other than he was appointed by Bush.

Alito could always write a concurring opinion if he actually agreed with the result, but not the opinion itself.

And yes, the Justices definitely talk to one another before the opinion comes out.

[Priceless]

Feeling simplistic this morning, are we?

When talking to people in these threads I find the simple approach works much better than a prolonged dissertation on the matter at hand.

[LynahFan]

Re: The Power of SCOTUS V: The Final Frontier

When talking to people in these threads I find the simple approach works much better than a prolonged dissertation on the matter at hand.

I get where you're coming from re: simplicity, but that analogy was just stupid. Car accidents are random, nearly completely independent events. For your analogy to work, we'd have to live in a society that was randomly in danger of slipping back into slavery, segregation, and Jim Crow at any time but for the "safety belt" that affirmative action provides. Not your best effort.

[dxmnkd316]

Re: The Power of SCOTUS V: The Final Frontier

When talking to people in these threads I find the simple approach works much better than a prolonged dissertation on the matter at hand.

Point taken.

[Priceless]

I get where you're coming from re: simplicity, but that analogy was just stupid. Car accidents are random, nearly completely independent events. For your analogy to work, we'd have to live in a society that was randomly in danger of slipping back into slavery, segregation, and Jim Crow at any time but for the "safety belt" that affirmative action provides. Not your best effort.

Without the protection of the Civil Rights Act (which we're slowly chipping away at) yes, quite a few states would slip back to Jim Crow status.

[unofan]

Affirmative action was never "okay" and Scalia was scathingly clear on that point. It is clearly in black and white inconsistent with the 14th amendment.

Scalia doesn't like it, but he recognizes it's the law, however begrudgingly.

Does the Equal Protection Clause forbid a state from banning a practice that the clause barely - and only provisionally - permits?

That's directly from Scalia's concurrence. He acknowledges it is permitted, if only barely.

[unofan]

Do the justices talk with one another about the vote before it's official placed? I only ask because if it looks like there will be a 9-0 decision, has Alito offerred to cast a dissenting vote in order to write an opinion on the matter? I don't know much about the guy other than he was appointed by Bush.

Your guess is as good as mine as to what they discuss in conference. But historically, lone dissents are based on strongly held personal beliefs about the law, not token votes for the other side.

Alito is a former u.s. attorney, assistant ag, and assistant solicitor general before going to the bench.

[FreshFish]

Re: The Power of SCOTUS V: The Final Frontier

Without the protection of the Civil Rights Act (which we're slowly chipping away at) yes, quite a few states would slip back to Jim Crow status.

and you have data to support this??

It really sounds like you are the one displaying unfounded prejudice against people you don't know and have never met!

Don't forget, the state that shows the highest level of "discrimination" in voting patterns is Massachusetts.



The most virulant and nasty discrimination I hear and see are mostly anti-Semitic. Jews are still the most convenient scapegoats and whipping boys. Anti-Semitism these days is far more severe and way way more widespread than racial animus, by far.


I seriously doubt there is much "racial" prejudice these days. The ethnic prejudices I see and hear expressed are directed more at Hispanics, not blacks.

[dxmnkd316]

Re: The Power of SCOTUS V: The Final Frontier

and you have data to support this??

Well, the whole Clive Bundy thing doesn't really help your argument right now....