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2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bull!!

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  • Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

    Originally posted by Russell Jaslow View Post
    And now it's official. Marussia also enters administration.

    http://en.espnf1.com/marussia/motors...ry/180949.html

    Who's next? Lotus? Sauber? Force India?
    Based on the headlines, I'd bet Lotus, even though it used to be Renault. Force India seems to have weathered their storm, but could be wrong. Sauber- well, they seem to be able to just chug along while struggling.

    Sure does speak to a rather large problem in F1.

    Comment


    • Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

      Ho Hum. Another Saturday and another Mercedes 1-2.

      Telegraph article on F1. Like the last line. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/mot...s-to-ruin.html

      It’s simpler than that, says Aversa: “I always say F1’s technology is futuristic but its governance is medieval.”
      CCT '77 & '78
      4 kids
      5 grandsons (BCA 7/09, CJA 5/14, JDL 8/14, JFL 6/16, PJL 7/18)
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      ”Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.”
      - Benjamin Franklin

      Banned from the St. Lawrence University Facebook page - March 2016 (But I got better).

      I want to live forever. So far, so good.

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      • Originally posted by joecct View Post
        Ho Hum. Another Saturday and another Mercedes 1-2.

        Telegraph article on F1. Like the last line. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/mot...s-to-ruin.html
        F1 is definitely your typical European Machiavellian way of running things.

        As for the race, I agree with Matchett. With reliability concerns once again threatening Mercedes, anything can happen tomorrow.
        Russell Jaslow
        [Former] SUNYAC Correspondent
        U.S. College Hockey Online

        Comment


        • Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

          Didn't see the race yet....Bernie has suggested the rich teams send some cash to the poor teams to help them stay afloat. I suggest BERNIE send some of HIS money to the poor teams to help them stay afloat (and fill out the grid per whatever contractual obligations there are for him to meet), his net worth is 4.2 billion. In the end I really don't feel bad for the small underfunded teams, it's their choice to toss their hat into the ring and play the game.
          Wisconsin Hockey: 1, 3, 5, 7, 9, 11 WE WANT MORE!
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          Originally Posted by Wisko McBadgerton:
          "Baggot says Hughes and Rockwood are centering the top two lines...
          Timothy A --> Great hockey mind... Or Greatest hockey mind?!?"

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          • Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

            Originally posted by Timothy A View Post
            Didn't see the race yet....Bernie has suggested the rich teams send some cash to the poor teams to help them stay afloat. I suggest BERNIE send some of HIS money to the poor teams to help them stay afloat (and fill out the grid per whatever contractual obligations there are for him to meet), his net worth is 4.2 billion. In the end I really don't feel bad for the small underfunded teams, it's their choice to toss their hat into the ring and play the game.
            Outside of the top two places (which was exciting for a lap), the rest of the racing was really, really good.

            For the better drivers, the wheel to wheel action was amazing. Alonso really showed that he's REALLY tough, but incredibly fair. Constantly challenging for positions, but never coming close to touching. Vettel was really good, too- making some great passes. The real interest at the end- when Hamilton and Rosberg came to lap a nice battle for the last few points spots.

            As for the lower teams- throw them a bone, for God's sake. A little sharing the massive wealth will keep the fields big and interesting. I'm not really looking forward to seeing 3 cars from each big team but none of the smaller teams.

            Comment


            • Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

              I thought the race was good. That track really is a good one. Several places to attempt passes and it looks good on TV all things considered.

              I'm not sure what to do with F1 and the spending. I want more than just a McLaren, Ferrari, Mercedes field but on the other hand I don't think just handing money to any small team is the way to go either. I guess if I was running things I would...

              1. Open up the rules as far as the engines are concerned. Allow in season changes, but keep the limit on # of them. Same thing with the transmissions.
              2. Open up the areo rules some (I'm not a aerodynamic expert but I think the current rules are kind of restricting in a bad way).
              3. Provided that the above two items are done, then I am OK with either a spending cap/revenue sharing/luxary tax. I prefer luxary taxes but I am unsure how to do it in the world of F1.

              Basically my goals would be to 1. reward smart engineering not just throwing $ at the car, and 2. limit spending or at least penalize too much spending.
              Last edited by MattS; 11-03-2014, 02:11 PM.
              My Four Favorite teams:
              RIT and anyone who is beating Canisius
              Cornell and anyone who is beating Harvard

              If tyranny and oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. - James Madison

              I am not afraid of terrorism, and I want the Government to stop being afraid on my behalf. I understand that it will not be possible to stop all terrorist acts. I am not afraid!!!!

              Comment


              • Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

                Originally posted by MattS View Post
                I thought the race was good. That track really is a good one. Several places to attempt passes and it looks good on TV all things considered.

                I'm not sure what to do with F1 and the spending. I want more than just a McLaren, Ferrari, Mercedes field but on the other hand I don't think just handing money to any small team is the way to go either. I guess if I was running things I would...

                1. Open up the rules as far as the engines are concerned. Allow in season changes, but keep the limit on # of them. Same thing with the transmissions.
                2. Open up the areo rules some (I'm not a aerodynamic expert but I think the current rules are kind of restricting in a bad way).
                3. Provided that the above two items are done, then I am OK with either a spending cap/revenue sharing/luxary tax. I prefer luxary taxes but I am unsure how to do it in the world of F1.

                Basically my goals would be to 1. reward smart engineering not just throwing $ at the car, and 2. limit spending or at least penalize too much spending.
                I think a lot of the aero packages are more restricted by the 100l fuel requirement than the rules. Drag is such a big deal now that they can't just add downforce without keeping the drag low enough to finish the race.

                And I'm a fan of the fuel limit + the flow limit. To the point that they should not have an RPM lower limit- give the designers some room to play around with some of the trim, since they can make more power at lower speeds due to the lower aero losses. Theoretically, some of this can trickle down to real road cars. Although a fuel economy Ferrari or AMG Mercedes isn't something anyone thinks of. Renault, on the other hand- if it's applicable, both Renault and Nissan will benefit by the technology.

                Comment


                • Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

                  Originally posted by alfablue View Post
                  I think a lot of the aero packages are more restricted by the 100l fuel requirement than the rules. Drag is such a big deal now that they can't just add downforce without keeping the drag low enough to finish the race.

                  And I'm a fan of the fuel limit + the flow limit. To the point that they should not have an RPM lower limit- give the designers some room to play around with some of the trim, since they can make more power at lower speeds due to the lower aero losses. Theoretically, some of this can trickle down to real road cars. Although a fuel economy Ferrari or AMG Mercedes isn't something anyone thinks of. Renault, on the other hand- if it's applicable, both Renault and Nissan will benefit by the technology.
                  I was thinking more along the lines of eliminating diffusers and the winglets, etc. on the aero side.

                  I agree with you. I have no issue with the fuel limit and flow limit. I should maybe have been clearer. I don't necessary have an problem with the rules surrounding what can or cannot be done to the engines, but I do have an issue that the manufacturers cannot change them (drastically) during the season.
                  My Four Favorite teams:
                  RIT and anyone who is beating Canisius
                  Cornell and anyone who is beating Harvard

                  If tyranny and oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. - James Madison

                  I am not afraid of terrorism, and I want the Government to stop being afraid on my behalf. I understand that it will not be possible to stop all terrorist acts. I am not afraid!!!!

                  Comment


                  • Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

                    Originally posted by Timothy A View Post
                    Didn't see the race yet....Bernie has suggested the rich teams send some cash to the poor teams to help them stay afloat. I suggest BERNIE send some of HIS money to the poor teams to help them stay afloat (and fill out the grid per whatever contractual obligations there are for him to meet), his net worth is 4.2 billion. In the end I really don't feel bad for the small underfunded teams, it's their choice to toss their hat into the ring and play the game.
                    Looks like CVC is going to put up the money to guarantee a base pay to the lower tier teams. The upper tier teams already get a bonus fee just for showing up, above and beyond whatever Constructor's points money they earn.
                    Russell Jaslow
                    [Former] SUNYAC Correspondent
                    U.S. College Hockey Online

                    Comment


                    • Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

                      So the preliminary list of teams for 2015 is out:

                      Infiniti Red Bull Racing
                      Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team
                      Scuderia Ferrari
                      Lotus F1 Team
                      McLaren Honda
                      Sahara Force India F1 Team
                      Sauber F1 Team
                      Scuderia Toro Rosso
                      Williams Martini Racing
                      Manor F1 Team
                      Caterham F1 Team
                      Interesting even if it is preliminary. So it appears as if Marussia is done (maybe Stefan GP can get their spot?). Caterham is still surviving although they have not paid the fee for next season yet which is due at the end of the month. And Manor is entering! I wonder if either Manor (possible) or Caterham (doubtful) will make the grid.

                      I also read that Caterham is "planning" on racing in Abu Dhabi. Of course I am "planning" on attending this race. Although I am just like Caterham....I don't have the money to attend but I can still plan on it.


                      Also Formula E is hiring. They are in need of an "International Travel Consultant" and a "Security Manager"! No, I'm serious! If interested send your CV to: hr@formulae.com
                      Last edited by MattS; 11-05-2014, 12:21 PM.
                      My Four Favorite teams:
                      RIT and anyone who is beating Canisius
                      Cornell and anyone who is beating Harvard

                      If tyranny and oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. - James Madison

                      I am not afraid of terrorism, and I want the Government to stop being afraid on my behalf. I understand that it will not be possible to stop all terrorist acts. I am not afraid!!!!

                      Comment


                      • Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

                        Originally posted by MattS View Post
                        So the preliminary list of teams for 2015 is out:



                        Interesting even if it is preliminary. So it appears as if Marussia is done (maybe Stefan GP can get their spot?). Caterham is still surviving although they have not paid the fee for next season yet which is due at the end of the month. And Manor is entering! I wonder if either Manor (possible) or Caterham (doubtful) will make the grid.

                        I also read that Caterham is "planning" on racing in Abu Dhabi. Of course I am "planning" on attending this race. Although I am just like Caterham....I don't have the money to attend but I can still plan on it.


                        Also Formula E is hiring. They are in need of an "International Travel Consultant" and a "Security Manager"! No, I'm serious! If interested send your CV to: hr@formulae.com
                        Just got a news update from GPTours- Manor is Marussia. So it's not a new team, just the old name.

                        But the bad news- both Caterham and Manor have canceled crash testing of the 2015 cars. So while someone put up $500k Saturday, it's still pretty unclear that they will field cars.

                        Comment


                        • Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

                          Originally posted by alfablue View Post
                          Just got a news update from GPTours- Manor is Marussia. So it's not a new team, just the old name.

                          But the bad news- both Caterham and Manor have canceled crash testing of the 2015 cars. So while someone put up $500k Saturday, it's still pretty unclear that they will field cars.
                          Ah, I did not know that about Manor/Marussia. I assumed Manor was the GP3 team stepping up as a different team as I forgot about Marussia being Manor originally.
                          My Four Favorite teams:
                          RIT and anyone who is beating Canisius
                          Cornell and anyone who is beating Harvard

                          If tyranny and oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. - James Madison

                          I am not afraid of terrorism, and I want the Government to stop being afraid on my behalf. I understand that it will not be possible to stop all terrorist acts. I am not afraid!!!!

                          Comment


                          • Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

                            Originally posted by alfablue View Post
                            Just got a news update from GPTours- Manor is Marussia. So it's not a new team, just the old name.

                            But the bad news- both Caterham and Manor have canceled crash testing of the 2015 cars. So while someone put up $500k Saturday, it's still pretty unclear that they will field cars.
                            Can they run 2014 cars and not worry about crash testing?

                            I don't think anyone has put up money yet, as they have till the end of the month to file their 2015 entry fee.

                            Per Matt's post, the Caterham administrator sounds extremely confident that they will run at Abu Dhabi, so he must know a savior has been found.
                            Russell Jaslow
                            [Former] SUNYAC Correspondent
                            U.S. College Hockey Online

                            Comment


                            • Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

                              Originally posted by Russell Jaslow View Post
                              Can they run 2014 cars and not worry about crash testing?

                              I don't think anyone has put up money yet, as they have till the end of the month to file their 2015 entry fee.

                              Per Matt's post, the Caterham administrator sounds extremely confident that they will run at Abu Dhabi, so he must know a savior has been found.
                              If they are the same cars, maybe.

                              But that also suggests that their goal is just to field cars. By now, I would have hoped that they would be beyond that- espcially Marussia, since they scored points, and look to finish in the money (unless Sauber has a great finish).

                              Comment


                              • Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

                                Originally posted by alfablue View Post
                                If they are the same cars, maybe.

                                But that also suggests that their goal is just to field cars. By now, I would have hoped that they would be beyond that- espcially Marussia, since they scored points, and look to finish in the money (unless Sauber has a great finish).
                                I agree. I was just wondering if they are going into pure survival mode.

                                The other question is whether they can reschedule the crash tests. There have been times when teams have waited till the last minute to get their crash testing completely ... or passed because they failed the first time.
                                Russell Jaslow
                                [Former] SUNYAC Correspondent
                                U.S. College Hockey Online

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