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2012 Presidential Election Part II -- Charlotte, a National Treasure or sede vacante

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  • Re: 2012 Presidential Election Part II -- Charlotte, a National Treasure or sede vaca

    Originally posted by Kepler View Post
    Romney has finally be given his perfect nickname.
    I agree. It's perfect.
    **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

    Originally Posted by dropthatpuck-Scooby's a lost cause.
    Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

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    • Re: 2012 Presidential Election Part II -- Charlotte, a National Treasure or sede vaca

      Here is the clip from TDS I mentioned last night...



      I can already here Fishy and Minnfan seething
      "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
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      "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
      -INCH

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      • Re: 2012 Presidential Election Part II -- Charlotte, a National Treasure or sede vaca

        Originally posted by Handyman View Post
        I can already here Fishy and Minnfan seething
        I wouldn't worry. Fishy will immediately crossref it against Freep and just post a pithy and irrelevant counter-accusation. MinnFan... well, frankly, why would you care?
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        • Re: 2012 Presidential Election Part II -- Charlotte, a National Treasure or sede vaca

          Originally posted by Handyman View Post
          Here is the clip from TDS I mentioned last night...



          I can already here Fishy and Minnfan seething
          If that doesn't sum it up nothing will. Fantastic.

          I expect to see my fellow righties go on a diatribe about the wonders of supply side any minute now.
          **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

          Originally Posted by dropthatpuck-Scooby's a lost cause.
          Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

          Comment


          • Re: 2012 Presidential Election Part II -- Charlotte, a National Treasure or sede vaca

            In other news, a herpa-derp derps.
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            • Re: 2012 Presidential Election Part II -- Charlotte, a National Treasure or sede vaca

              Originally posted by Rover View Post
              So am I to take the unwillingness of our righty friends to address the fact that wealthy people take tax cuts and invest it overseas as a concession that this indeed happens and therefore top level tax cuts along the lines of Romney-Ryan proposal are useless for stimulating the American economy? They might do wonders for the Chinese economy but that's not the focus of the discussion here.

              Whether they undo the tax reductions or not, your litmus test that it depends on where they spend it might be a good start to reaching an agreement between the parties. If the CEO of a company agreed to invest all his/her money in the US, are you saying you'd oppose raising the tax rate on them? Pretty sure you'd get the conversation started with that proposal.

              To a guy making $20k, you don't spend your money 'wisely' either so I don't think what people do with the money left after taxes ishould be the heaviest weighted variable for the tax rate itself.

              Good news is the computers we are using for this dialog are constructed in the US, comprised entirely of US made components. Otherwise, we are stimulating the wrong economy.

              I've never heard anybody say that 100% of every dollar not taken via taxes would go directly into US hands. Heck, if we give it to the government they can't say that either. By your logic, we shouldn't have to pay any taxes, because the money doesn't go exclusively to US interests. That would further stimulate the conversation.
              I believe in life, and I believe in love, but the world in which I live in keeps trying to prove me wrong.

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              • Originally posted by pirate View Post
                Whether they undo the tax reductions or not, your litmus test that it depends on where they spend it might be a good start to reaching an agreement between the parties. If the CEO of a company agreed to invest all his/her money in the US, are you saying you'd oppose raising the tax rate on them? Pretty sure you'd get the conversation started with that proposal.

                To a guy making $20k, you don't spend your money 'wisely' either so I don't think what people do with the money left after taxes ishould be the heaviest weighted variable for the tax rate itself.

                Good news is the computers we are using for this dialog are constructed in the US, comprised entirely of US made components. Otherwise, we are stimulating the wrong economy.

                I've never heard anybody say that 100% of every dollar not taken via taxes would go directly into US hands. Heck, if we give it to the government they can't say that either. By your logic, we shouldn't have to pay any taxes, because the money doesn't go exclusively to US interests. That would further stimulate the conversation.
                Some good points and some nonsense. I'll address the good points and leave the nonsense to stand on its own...

                Tax breaks should definitely be slanted towards investment back into the US economy. So the question becomes, what's our starting point? Our starting point is going back to the tax rates during the last time the budget was balanced and the economy was humming. That would be the 1990's. With that established as our baseline, now you can do some tweaking. For example, student loan interest deductions, as well as mortage interest deductions for domestic owned properties are tailored towards investing in the US economy, so they fit the criteria. Top level rate reductions? No. Business tax cuts? Well, that depends. If you want to go to GE and say for every year you increase US based employment you get a corresponding break on your tax bill, I'm all for that. Just cut their rate in half with no offsetting benefit? No. Tax breaks have to stop being used as a pay off for campaign contributors, and more to grow the economy. States have to do this all the time if they're smart.
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                • Re: 2012 Presidential Election Part II -- Charlotte, a National Treasure or sede vaca

                  Originally posted by Rover View Post
                  Tax breaks have to stop being used as a pay off for campaign contributors, and more to grow the economy.
                  This can never happen until corporate money is removed from elections, and that can never happen until either (1) this Court is reconfigured, or (2) we amend the Constitution to take popular sovereignty back from the plutocrats.

                  (2) is impossible because it's blocked by the very problem we need to solve. So, we're waiting on (1). Until then, welcome back to 1880.
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                  • Re: 2012 Presidential Election Part II -- Charlotte, a National Treasure or sede vaca

                    "Corporations are people." - Mitt Romney
                    **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

                    Originally Posted by dropthatpuck-Scooby's a lost cause.
                    Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

                    Comment


                    • Re: 2012 Presidential Election Part II -- Charlotte, a National Treasure or sede vaca

                      Originally posted by Rover View Post
                      Some good points and some nonsense. I'll address the good points and leave the nonsense to stand on its own...

                      Tax breaks should definitely be slanted towards investment back into the US economy. So the question becomes, what's our starting point? Our starting point is going back to the tax rates during the last time the budget was balanced and the economy was humming. That would be the 1990's. With that established as our baseline, now you can do some tweaking. For example, student loan interest deductions, as well as mortage interest deductions for domestic owned properties are tailored towards investing in the US economy, so they fit the criteria. Top level rate reductions? No. Business tax cuts? Well, that depends. If you want to go to GE and say for every year you increase US based employment you get a corresponding break on your tax bill, I'm all for that. Just cut their rate in half with no offsetting benefit? No. Tax breaks have to stop being used as a pay off for campaign contributors, and more to grow the economy. States have to do this all the time if they're smart.
                      Mr Rover, that was a lucid, intelligent and well thought out response. Over-ruled!!

                      Hey, if you are telling me anybody down there is willing to put some basic logic into this issue, I'm for it as well.

                      I don't read a lot of logic on here. I read a lot of political volleyball where one side (and I include you here) or the other wouldn't agree we should do anything if it was the other party's idea. You say I had nonsense in my response...only in response to the nonsense you started with.

                      One challenge to your approach on corporate taxes..can be that often a company will agree to keep employment at a certain level in order to qualify for a state tax reduction because the state has done the math...some people, less enlightened than you obviously, scream "Corporate Welfare" when that happens. Heck, we may even have a few regular posters that know the issue is more complicated but respond to every instance such as this as corporate welfare or paying off people. Well, it may be corporate welfare to some, but it also keeps people off welfare while contributing something for those who are unfortunate enough to need welfare. Could it have been more had the company paid 100% of the possible taxes? Sure, but that scenario wouldn't play out, the company would just go to the second state on their list.

                      It is why I liken political parties to organized religion...you have to believe only one gospel and all others must be debunked...there can't be middle ground...either Jesus was or wasn't the son of god for instance, and the lines are drawn. You can't be a good catholic and walk around saying maybe the muslims are right.

                      So you sure can't walk around in congress and say, "you know, we probably could raise taxes to a lesser extent if at the same time we worked to lessen waste in government". Or you could say it up until your party refused to support you in your next election and you were put on zero committees.

                      Before you or OP start calling me names for not agreeing completely with you on every issue, I really don't care. Nothing I say on here will change any opinions, but sometimes I can't come up with a song association so I walk into the church. Kinda like arguing with the Jehovah's Witnesses at your door...doesn't accomplish anything but it is fun to try to get them to see they might not have all the answers.
                      I believe in life, and I believe in love, but the world in which I live in keeps trying to prove me wrong.

                      Comment


                      • Re: 2012 Presidential Election Part II -- Charlotte, a National Treasure or sede vaca

                        Pirate

                        Good points. I would add one more -- if a State / municipality gives a "break" to a corporation its because it wants the employees of that corporation living and spending (and paying taxes) in that location. Further, if your taxes are lower than a neighbor, you may poach a few businesses and people from the neighbor. I wish my governor would realize this.
                        CCT '77 & '78
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                        1 granddaughter (EML 4/18)

                        ”Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.”
                        - Benjamin Franklin

                        Banned from the St. Lawrence University Facebook page - March 2016 (But I got better).

                        I want to live forever. So far, so good.

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                        • Re: 2012 Presidential Election Part II -- Charlotte, a National Treasure or sede vaca

                          Originally posted by joecct View Post
                          Pirate

                          Good points. I would add one more -- if a State / municipality gives a "break" to a corporation its because it wants the employees of that corporation living and spending (and paying taxes) in that location. Further, if your taxes are lower than a neighbor, you may poach a few businesses and people from the neighbor. I wish my governor would realize this.
                          This doesn't solve any problem, it just moves it around, and in the end is a "**** my neighbor" policy.

                          Comment


                          • Re: 2012 Presidential Election Part II -- Charlotte, a National Treasure or sede vaca

                            Originally posted by Foxton View Post
                            This doesn't solve any problem, it just moves it around, and in the end is a "**** my neighbor" policy.
                            Yep. To quote the late Tip O'Neil "All politics is local." If it means that I improve my tax base at your expense - so be it. My people, not your people, vote for me.
                            CCT '77 & '78
                            4 kids
                            5 grandsons (BCA 7/09, CJA 5/14, JDL 8/14, JFL 6/16, PJL 7/18)
                            1 granddaughter (EML 4/18)

                            ”Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.”
                            - Benjamin Franklin

                            Banned from the St. Lawrence University Facebook page - March 2016 (But I got better).

                            I want to live forever. So far, so good.

                            Comment


                            • Re: 2012 Presidential Election Part II -- Charlotte, a National Treasure or sede vaca

                              Originally posted by pirate View Post
                              Mr Rover, that was a lucid, intelligent and well thought out response. Over-ruled!!

                              Hey, if you are telling me anybody down there is willing to put some basic logic into this issue, I'm for it as well.

                              I don't read a lot of logic on here. I read a lot of political volleyball where one side (and I include you here) or the other wouldn't agree we should do anything if it was the other party's idea. You say I had nonsense in my response...only in response to the nonsense you started with.

                              One challenge to your approach on corporate taxes..can be that often a company will agree to keep employment at a certain level in order to qualify for a state tax reduction because the state has done the math...some people, less enlightened than you obviously, scream "Corporate Welfare" when that happens. Heck, we may even have a few regular posters that know the issue is more complicated but respond to every instance such as this as corporate welfare or paying off people. Well, it may be corporate welfare to some, but it also keeps people off welfare while contributing something for those who are unfortunate enough to need welfare. Could it have been more had the company paid 100% of the possible taxes? Sure, but that scenario wouldn't play out, the company would just go to the second state on their list.

                              It is why I liken political parties to organized religion...you have to believe only one gospel and all others must be debunked...there can't be middle ground...either Jesus was or wasn't the son of god for instance, and the lines are drawn. You can't be a good catholic and walk around saying maybe the muslims are right.

                              So you sure can't walk around in congress and say, "you know, we probably could raise taxes to a lesser extent if at the same time we worked to lessen waste in government". Or you could say it up until your party refused to support you in your next election and you were put on zero committees.

                              Before you or OP start calling me names for not agreeing completely with you on every issue, I really don't care. Nothing I say on here will change any opinions, but sometimes I can't come up with a song association so I walk into the church. Kinda like arguing with the Jehovah's Witnesses at your door...doesn't accomplish anything but it is fun to try to get them to see they might not have all the answers.
                              By an odd coincidence, I don't care that you don't care. But thanks for thinking of me. A little obsession goes a long way. BTW, I'm planning to knock on your door around 6:30 some morning, okay?
                              Last edited by Old Pio; 09-21-2012, 12:06 AM.
                              2011 Poser of the Year & Pulitzer Prize winning machine gunner.

                              Comment


                              • Re: 2012 Presidential Election Part II -- Charlotte, a National Treasure or sede vaca

                                Originally posted by Kepler View Post
                                In other news, a herpa-derp derps.
                                You wouldn't be such a smart a*s if Perry were Muslim. Well, not for long at any rate. But then, ripping on Christians is funny (especially Mormons). But ripping on head choppers is "offensive."
                                Last edited by Old Pio; 09-21-2012, 12:04 AM.
                                2011 Poser of the Year & Pulitzer Prize winning machine gunner.

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