Convention junkies can obsess details here!

[Patman]

Re: Convention junkies can obsess details here!

If GM had gone into bankruptcy GM would no longer exist. They needed a loan that NO ONE was going to give them or they were not going to survive.

You do understand that people were voided out of their stake based upon politics and not law, yes?

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: Convention junkies can obsess details here!

You do understand that people were voided out of their stake based upon politics and not law, yes?

Aaah, so? I was screwed along with millions of other Americans out of my money by thieves and scoundrels. What's the diff?

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Convention junkies can obsess details here!

Aaah, so? I was screwed along with millions of other Americans out of my money by thieves and scoundrels. What's the diff?

The difference is that the company had a legal obligation to pay off the bondholders with whatever they could. They didn't. In turn the government changed the rules on who gets first lien in that particular situation.

Oh well, just another example of the Golden Rule: He who has the gold makes the rules.

[Kepler]

Re: Convention junkies can obsess details here!

Glass–Steagall was repealed by politics, too.

If you want to steal, use a gun. If you want to steal A LOT, use a Senator.

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: Convention junkies can obsess details here!

Glass–Steagall was repealed by law, too.

If you want to steal, use a gun. If you want to steal A LOT, use a Senator.

Ding. Ding. Ding. Ding. We have a winner.

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Convention junkies can obsess details here!

Glass–Steagall was repealed by politics, too.

If you want to steal, use a gun. If you want to steal A LOT, use a Senator.

Once again, there's a big difference between shareholders and bondholders.

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: Convention junkies can obsess details here!

Once again, there's a big difference between shareholders and bondholders.

That can be changed as well.

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Convention junkies can obsess details here!

That can be changed as well.

And then, you can have countless numbers of unsuccessful bond auctions, both private and public.

[Rover]

Re: Convention junkies can obsess details here!

I see the knuckledragger caucus is out here once again peeing themselves because the auto bailout was successful! I realize you guys wanted that industry exported to China also, but no such luck.

But, just so no lie goes unchallenged, lets take 'em one at a time.

Caveman theory #1: Obama auto restructing illegal. (Fishy's rule of law comment). Bankruptcy was approved by federal court. If it were illegal, they wouldn't have approved it, no?

Caveman theory #2: Bondholders got screwed. (Flag, Patman). Bondholders were going to take it in the shorts regardless. However yes they did get less pennies on the dollar than the pennies on the dollar they would have gotten from melting down the plants and selling off the furniture. A much larger stakeholder benefited though. The American taxpayer.

Cavemen theory #3: GM would have survived a normal bankrupcy (Fishy again). As has been said, no private industry would lend them money for continuing operations, so they would have gone under. Hence, no "normal" bankruptcy would have applied. If there was such money available, why didn't a company like...oh, I don't know....Bain Capital provide it?

But, this is all irrelavent. All you need to do is talk to Rep. Paul Ryan, who clearly didn't think this was all too problematic when he supported it!!!

[Bob Gray]

Re: Convention junkies can obsess details here!

I see the knuckledragger caucus is out here once again peeing themselves because the auto bailout was successful! I realize you guys wanted that industry exported to China also, but no such luck.

But, just so no lie goes unchallenged, lets take 'em one at a time.

Caveman theory #1: Obama auto restructing illegal. (Fishy's rule of law comment). Bankruptcy was approved by federal court. If it were illegal, they wouldn't have approved it, no?

Caveman theory #2: Bondholders got screwed. (Flag, Patman). Bondholders were going to take it in the shorts regardless. However yes they did get less pennies on the dollar than the pennies on the dollar they would have gotten from melting down the plants and selling off the furniture. A much larger stakeholder benefited though. The American taxpayer.

Cavemen theory #3: GM would have survived a normal bankrupcy (Fishy again). As has been said, no private industry would lend them money for continuing operations, so they would have gone under. Hence, no "normal" bankruptcy would have applied. If there was such money available, why didn't a company like...oh, I don't know....Bain Capital provide it?

But, this is all irrelavent. All you need to do is talk to Rep. Paul Ryan, who clearly didn't think this was all too problematic when he supported it!!!

You Ryan apologist you!

[FreshFish]

Re: Convention junkies can obsess details here!

GM would have survived a normal bankrupcy (Fishy again). As has been said, no private industry would lend them money for continuing operations, so they would have gone under. Hence, no "normal" bankruptcy would have applied.

I see the name-caller brigade is out in force today, trying to use slander when reason fails.

GM did not "need" to be lent money to continue operations; they had enough cash on hand to operate as long as they were relieved from pension obligations (which has in fact since happened, using taxpayer money).

and whether the bailout "worked" or not is still to be determined; there are a lot of unsold GM cars sitting in dealer showrooms.

and finally, it is despicable and irresponsible for you to pretend that anyone "wanted" GM to fail. We all wanted it to succeed if it could. The question is at what cost and for whom to benefit.

The only person who seems gleefully to delight in another's suffering around here is you. I haven't seen anyone else be as mean-spirited to others outside of Foxton in a thread about religion. You even brag about how you rip into people at work. If anyone were to behave like that here, they wouldn't be on the payroll much longer.

[Rover]

Re: Convention junkies can obsess details here!

You even brag about how you rip into people at work. If anyone were to behave like that here, they wouldn't be on the payroll much longer.

I'm sure the standards in the food service industry that you work in are quite high Fishy! People get what they deserve, starting with knuckledraggers. When you guys get some ideas that don't benefit China more than the US get back to me.

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Convention junkies can obsess details here!

I'm sure the standards in the food service industry that you work in are quite high Fishy! People get what they deserve, starting with knuckledraggers. When you guys get some ideas that don't benefit China more than the US get back to me.

So it's OK to change the rules so long as it benefits you? I haven't heard that before, only any other libstain out there. The ACLU, the feminist movement, the unions...

[Gurtholfin]

Re: Convention junkies can obsess details here!

I haven't seen anyone else be as mean-spirited to others outside of Foxton in a thread about religion.

I suppose that "*******," "libstain," & "dip****" are just cute little nicknames signifying endearment.

There's other big meanies around here besides the two left-leaning ones that you've pointed out.

Just sayin'.

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: Convention junkies can obsess details here!

I suppose that "*******," "libstain," & "dip****" are just cute little nicknames signifying endearment.

There's other big meanies around here besides the two left-leaning ones that you've pointed out.

Just sayin'.

Yeah, there's even a big hockey meanie over on the D1 board who wants to kick me off of USCHO.