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2012 Elections - Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death....

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  • #91
    Re: 2012 Elections - Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death....

    how does AZ2 make any sense geographcally? You've got a big piece of AZ2 inside AZ1 and only connected to the rest of AZ2 by a canyon.

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    • #92
      Re: 2012 Elections - Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death....

      I'm curious as to how others react to Obama's speech at the Associated Press luncheon this past Tuesday...it seemed a real odd tone to adopt so early in the year. Clearly it was a campaign speech, one also that burns bridges before they are even built. (to oversimplify, I think it is fair to say that Obama basically said that Republicans represent every bad thing that is wrong in the country today.)

      Why so early in the year? Why so strident?

      Is he frustrated and angry and doesn't care who knows it? Is he running scared and figures that the best defense is a good offense? Does he figure that once the campaign is over, those people whose votes he will need to pass any legislation will forgive and forget? Does he figure that, once the campaign is over, he'll be able to bypass Congress completely with recess appointments and executive orders not subject to Congressional review? Is he so singularly focused only on the election that thoughts of what might follow don't even enter his mind?

      While I'm no fan of Obama, this speech seemed to me uncharacteristic of his tendencies to date, something seems to have changed, and I have no clue what might be going on with him, and I would like to hear other people's viewpoints, perhaps they notice things that I'm missing?




      PS I also thought his attempt to influence the press so blatantly was pretty creepy.....in the question and answer that followed the speech (not in the transcript linked above), here is one report of what he said, where he is quoted is in quotation marks in the excerpt below:
      In the Q-and-A he offered criticism that "bears on your reporting": "I think that there is oftentimes the impulse to suggest that if the two parties are disagreeing, then they're equally at fault and the truth lies somewhere in the middle." An "equivalence is presented" that is unfortunate. It "reinforces . . . cynicism." But the current debate is not "one of those situations where there's an equivalence." Journalists are failing to "put the current debate in some historical context."
      in other words, he seems to be saying to the Associated Press reporters, "if you cover the campaign by trying to appear to be 'even-handed' you actually are doing the nation a disservice because I'm right and they are wrong."
      Last edited by FreshFish; 04-06-2012, 11:40 AM.
      "Hope is a good thing; maybe the best of things."

      "Beer is a sign that God loves us and wants us to be happy." -- Benjamin Franklin

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      "People generally are most impatient with those flaws in others about which they are most ashamed of in themselves." - folk wisdom

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      • #93
        Re: 2012 Elections - Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death....

        Given that the Reps have ran on "Obama is the worst person ever" for the last few years, why exactly would it be shocking that he's firing back in a campaign speech? It's not really early anymore either. It's April. He should be spinning up his ground game over the next 2-3 months to overwhelm Romney like he did McCain.

        Following the election, those Republicans aren't voting for anything with his name on it anyway, which he's *finally* learning about two years too late. So it really doesn't matter if they're offended by his words, since most seem to be offended by his existence.
        "I went over the facts in my head, and admired how much uglier the situation had just become. Over the years I've learned that ignorance is more than just bliss. It's freaking orgasmic ecstasy".- Harry Dresden, Blood Rites


        Western Michigan Bronco Hockey- 2012 Mason Cup Champions

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        • #94
          Re: 2012 Elections - Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death....

          Originally posted by bronconick View Post
          Given that the Reps have ran on "Obama is the worst person ever" for the last few years, why exactly would it be shocking that he's firing back in a campaign speech? It's not really early anymore either. It's April. He should be spinning up his ground game over the next 2-3 months to overwhelm Romney like he did McCain.

          Following the election, those Republicans aren't voting for anything with his name on it anyway, which he's *finally* learning about two years too late. So it really doesn't matter if they're offended by his words, since most seem to be offended by his existence.
          This. I find FreshFish confusion on the matter confusing.
          **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

          Originally Posted by dropthatpuck-Scooby's a lost cause.
          Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

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          • #95
            Re: 2012 Elections - Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death....

            Originally posted by BassAle View Post
            how does AZ2 make any sense geographcally? You've got a big piece of AZ2 inside AZ1 and only connected to the rest of AZ2 by a canyon.
            That certainly is a bit odd looking. But it looks like that bubble coming east basically just captures the Hopi Reservation. Given the long history of acrimony between the Hopis and Navajo (whose reservation surrounds the Hopis), I'd guess it was an effort to not have the Hopi vote swamped by the larger Navajo vote around them. Just a guess.

            The new maps don't have that bubble though. You can see them here:
            http://azredistricting.org/Maps/Final-Maps/default.asp
            Originally posted by Priceless
            Good to see you're so reasonable.
            Originally posted by ScoobyDoo
            Very well, said.
            Originally posted by Rover
            A fair assessment Bob.

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            • #96
              Re: 2012 Elections - Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death....

              Originally posted by bronconick View Post
              Given that the Reps have ran on "Obama is the worst person ever" for the last few years, why exactly would it be shocking that he's firing back in a campaign speech? It's not really early anymore either. It's April. He should be spinning up his ground game over the next 2-3 months to overwhelm Romney like he did McCain.

              Following the election, those Republicans aren't voting for anything with his name on it anyway, which he's *finally* learning about two years too late. So it really doesn't matter if they're offended by his words, since most seem to be offended by his existence.
              Ever since Obama got in office, his contempt for those who don't see things like he does has never been far under the surface, and comes out every now and then. No surprise to me he's continuing to attack his opponents. The campaign never really totally stops anymore. It just gets worse at times when an election comes closer.
              Originally posted by Priceless
              Good to see you're so reasonable.
              Originally posted by ScoobyDoo
              Very well, said.
              Originally posted by Rover
              A fair assessment Bob.

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              • #97
                Re: 2012 Elections - Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death....

                Pretty much. I might keep my TV off outside of college and pro football this fall. It's going to be uglier than usual, and that's not counting the Super-PAC's doing whatever they want since they're "officially" forbidden from even communicating with the campaigns, meaning they'll go way over the line, and whichever candidate will be "Well, we're not allowed to tell them what to do."

                Swiftboats en masse and 20x worse.
                "I went over the facts in my head, and admired how much uglier the situation had just become. Over the years I've learned that ignorance is more than just bliss. It's freaking orgasmic ecstasy".- Harry Dresden, Blood Rites


                Western Michigan Bronco Hockey- 2012 Mason Cup Champions

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                • #98
                  Re: 2012 Elections - Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death....

                  Originally posted by FreshFish View Post
                  I'm curious as to how others react to Obama's speech at the Associated Press luncheon this past Tuesday...it seemed a real odd tone to adopt so early in the year. Clearly it was a campaign speech, one also that burns bridges before they are even built. (to oversimplify, I think it is fair to say that Obama basically said that Republicans represent every bad thing that is wrong in the country today.)
                  I had the opposite reaction -- he's getting out in front of the Fall debate early to frame it. I thought it was a great campaign speech and the equivalent of a rally to the troops during a primary. And in contrast to the kind of hatred dished out in the GOP debates, it was quite mild.

                  Obama tried to build bridges for the first two years of his administration and the GOP not only didn't deal in good faith but used his attempts to negotiate with them to undercut him and push their own agenda. He wised up last winter and has been cleaning their clock ever since. It's very similar to what happened with Clinton.

                  He's daring them to own Ryan and they're falling into the trap. If the Dems can use this to set up a broad campaign to unseat a lot of Republicans and deliver a Congress that can get things done in contrast to the current bunch of suicide bombers, so much the better for the country.
                  Last edited by Kepler; 04-06-2012, 01:20 PM.
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                  • #99
                    Re: 2012 Elections - Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death....

                    Originally posted by Bob Gray View Post
                    Ever since Obama got in office, his contempt for those who don't see things like he does has never been far under the surface
                    I guess your theory is if you repeat something enough times maybe you'll convince somebody.

                    Obama seems about as disdainful as every other president during my lifetime.* The fact that the right gets their panties in a twist every time he speaks says everything about them, not about him.

                    (* except Carter, who always seemed to be bending over backwards to accommodate and understand. Which was wonderful for a Sunday school teacher but terrible for a president. And Ford, who always looked pretty embarrassed to be there.)
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                    • Re: 2012 Elections - Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death....

                      Originally posted by bronconick View Post
                      Following the election, those Republicans aren't voting for anything with his name on it anyway, which he's *finally* learning about two years too late. So it really doesn't matter if they're offended by his words, since most seem to be offended by his existence.
                      Starting about the time Newt became Speaker, the GOP's narrative has been that they are shocked!, appalled!, troubled! and offended! by anything with a "D" after it. Their criticisms are completely independent of content; they've been running an endless smear campaign for 18 straight years. They went into Search And Destroy mode so long ago that an entire generation of dittoheads has grown up without any concept of national good, just partisan elbowing.

                      The Republicans have become a Troll Party. Aside from the pursuit of power for its own sake, they've had no reason to exist for decades. They're going to be screwed if conservatives ever figure it out.

                      On the other hand, it took liberals 25 years to learn the same lesson about the Democratic Party and take it back from the hacks. So the right isn't due to start growing up until around 2019.
                      Last edited by Kepler; 04-06-2012, 01:38 PM.
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                      • Re: 2012 Elections - Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death....

                        Originally posted by Bob Gray View Post
                        Ever since Obama got in office, his contempt for those who don't see things like he does has never been far under the surface, and comes out every now and then. No surprise to me he's continuing to attack his opponents. The campaign never really totally stops anymore. It just gets worse at times when an election comes closer.
                        Oh, please. He's bent over for McConnell and Bone Man and it got him nowhere.
                        **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

                        Originally Posted by dropthatpuck-Scooby's a lost cause.
                        Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

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                        • Re: 2012 Elections - Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death....

                          Originally posted by Kepler View Post
                          The Republicans have become a Troll Party. Aside from the pursuit of power for its own sake, they've had no reason to exist for decades. They're going to be screwed if conservatives ever figure it out.
                          Really? You think all 6 of us could make a difference?
                          If you don't change the world today, how can it be any better tomorrow?

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                          • Re: 2012 Elections - Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death....

                            The TEA Party had a chance... ...until the Republicans decided to claim it.

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                            • Re: 2012 Elections - Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death....

                              Originally posted by LynahFan View Post
                              Really? You think all 6 of us could make a difference?
                              6? You must be counting me...
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                              • Re: 2012 Elections - Fear is the mind killer. Fear is the little death....

                                Originally posted by flagdude08 View Post
                                the tea party had a chance... ...until sarah palin decided to claim it.
                                fyp
                                **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

                                Originally Posted by dropthatpuck-Scooby's a lost cause.
                                Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

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