Tax Season 2012: Work No Longer Pays

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Tax Season 2012: Work No Longer Pays

OMG. High school Latin *wasn't* complete waste of my time, 'cause now I get to correct someone on a message board! The ides of April is on April 13, not 15th. File that away - you, too, might have a use for it 23 years after you learned it....

Thanks; you may have just given me the information to separate me from a Millionaire audition test pass and fail.

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Tax Season 2012: Work No Longer Pays

Friendly reminder to get your taxes in by today.

[Kepler]

Re: Tax Season 2012: Work No Longer Pays

OMG. High school Latin *wasn't* complete waste of my time, 'cause now I get to correct someone on a message board! The ides of April is on April 13, not 15th. File that away - you, too, might have a use for it 23 years after you learned it....

Holy ef. I never learned that in high school Latin.

[Kepler]

Re: Tax Season 2012: Work No Longer Pays

Actually, yes, they are. If you make the donation to reduce the public debt, you can take it off next year's taxes in your itemised deductions.

Thus increasing the debt.

[Kepler]

Re: Tax Season 2012: Work No Longer Pays

Paying too little. Paying too much will suck today, but paying too little will suck for years in the future (when you will have to pay too much to cover the interest on the giant pile of debt).

Yeah, paying too little. The IRS made a mistake on the first tax return I ever filed and even though I proved it and they withdrew their claim I swear my SSN is flagged forever.

As the comic said, "if you ever feel lonely, stop paying your taxes."

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Tax Season 2012: Work No Longer Pays

Thus increasing the debt.

I'm not sure if the AMT cancels it out or not...

[FreshFish]

Re: Tax Season 2012: Work No Longer Pays

So, today, half of us have Benjamin Dover as our alter ego....

A little historical perspective:

The Alternative Minimum Tax was imposed in 1969 because 115 households investing in municipal bonds reportedly paid little or no federal income tax. This tax ... now affects four million households. [In] 2013, it is set to hit 27 million more .... In 40 years, a tax on 115 households will have grown to ... 31 million.

The personal income tax, brought courtesy of the 16th Amendment, ... began in 1913 with a top rate of 7% and hit only those with a taxable income of $500,000 or more. (According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics inflation calculator, that would be $11.5 million now.) Today, roughly half of American families pay the personal income tax.

Maine imposed an income tax in 1969, and the tax that once only hit folks earning more than $308,000 in today's dollars now hits Mainers with a rate of 8.5% and kicks in at $19,950.

Over 20 years ago, the State of Connecticut introduced a "temporary" income tax to cover a "short-term" budget shortfall. After raising the rate multiple times, the state income tax now affects nearly everyone with income and is the primary source of state revenue. In the same time period, according to a UConn study published last year, there has been no net job growth in CT and the public sector has expanded in size (while they did not say it, if you "do the math" there must have been a loss of private sector jobs during that time period). The tax hits single filers with income over $13,000 and married filing jointly at $24,000.

[Priceless]

Re: Tax Season 2012: Work No Longer Pays

So, today, half of us have Benjamin Dover as our alter ego....

Tell us, what is the unbiased source of this information?

[Kepler]

Re: Tax Season 2012: Work No Longer Pays

The tax burden is actually historically low.

a large majority of American households — about two out of three — pays less than 15 percent of income to the federal government, through either income taxes or payroll taxes

Right now you are in clover on taxation if you are:

(1) Poor. (I don't think this is a consolation.)

(2) Rich. (Lower rates and more exemptions and deductions.)

(3) Super rich. (Top marginal rate half of what it was for much of the 20th century).


The Middle Class has a relatively low tax burden up front but we pay for it by subsidizing the wealthy's tax breaks and also because we're the ones who will be on the hook to pay for all the stuff that's been falling to pieces since the Reaganites declared Jesus wanted the rich to have a tax holiday.

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Tax Season 2012: Work No Longer Pays

Tell us, what is the unbiased source of this information?

Tell us, what is the unbiased source of your Huffington Post drivel?

[FreshFish]

Re: Tax Season 2012: Work No Longer Pays

The tax burden is actually historically low.

That is only the federal income tax. It leaves out how much all of us have to pay so that corporations can collect their corporate income tax bill from us; property taxes, all those various taxes that show up on our utility and cellphone bills, sales taxes, state income taxes, etc. etc. etc. Also any statistics regarding "the rich" are further biased because of a change in how business owners organize their companies for tax purposes, historical comparisons are invalid because they don't recognize the widespread change from separate taxpaying entities to pass-through entities.

Since many of us own shares in US corporations through our 401k plans, most of us are paying substantially higher federal income taxes than we realize, we just aren't aware of it because we don't see it; just like we don't see the various taxes broken out at the gas pump when we fill up the tank (er, maybe at today's prices I should say "top off" the tank?).

The core problem is too much spending by all governments with too little "return" to show for it. Because it is human nature always to want "more, more, more" we will never ever be able to resolve deficit problems on the revenue side alone.

[Priceless]

Re: Tax Season 2012: Work No Longer Pays

Tell us, what is the unbiased source of your Huffington Post drivel?

I was curious and wanted to read more of his fascinating piece. Ya know, since he's such an ardent liberal.

And when I quote someone, I generally link to the source...

ETA: If I were to quote the Huffington Post, the source of that information would be (drumroll please) the Huffington Post! Hard to figure that out, I know...

[FreshFish]

Re: Tax Season 2012: Work No Longer Pays

"how to you get to be a millionaire?"

Have an income of $250,000 and vote for Obama's re-election.

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Tax Season 2012: Work No Longer Pays

Since many of us own shares in US corporations through our 401k plans, most of us are paying substantially higher federal income taxes than we realize...

Can you elaborate on this?

[FreshFish]

Re: Tax Season 2012: Work No Longer Pays

Can you elaborate on this?

"This" being how high federal corporate income tax rates (US corporate income tax rates are now the highest in the "developed" nations, as Japan just lowered theirs) by necessity must lead to lower after-tax corporate profits, necessarily leading either to lower dividend payouts, fewer stock buybacks, or a reduced rate of share price appreciation.

Corporations do not "pay" income taxes, they merely collect them, so that the burden of the tax is borne in aggregate by customers (higher prices), suppliers (lower prices), employees (reduced wages and benefits), executives (lower bonuses), and shareholders (as just noted).

Plenty of empirical studies by academic and government economists have all validated this statement; I'm not going to track down and post links. Once upon a time, people stored findings in "articles" and "books" of which I have paper copies (or scanned copies in PDF). If there were a handy way to upload articles from my archives that would be different.