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  • Re: Global War on Terror III: Dick Cheney's Hague ICC Vacation

    Originally posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
    He's already declared war on Iran and Russia. Bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb IRAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    You're in fine form today. Didn't know presidential candidates (non-sitting) can declare war.
    Originally posted by Priceless
    Good to see you're so reasonable.
    Originally posted by ScoobyDoo
    Very well, said.
    Originally posted by Rover
    A fair assessment Bob.

    Comment


    • Re: Global War on Terror III: Dick Cheney's Hague ICC Vacation

      Originally posted by Bob Gray View Post
      That one was already destroyed, so I guess it's back to earth. And really we've done more to deserve destruction than Alderaan, eh? Reading the wiki about Alderaan, we could learn a lot from them.
      It sounds like the Emperor was going to pull an Israel with the survivors and compound a genocide by stealing somebody else's planet for them. The parallels become more and more eerie.
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      • Re: Global War on Terror III: Dick Cheney's Hague ICC Vacation

        Originally posted by Kepler View Post
        Physical embassies are obsolete, but I think they are still have great symbolic value.

        Obviously, they have to be sufficiently protected. I heard something about embassies having either A (Marines), B (DOS), or C (Contractors) security and Benghazi was a C. That does not seem like a very good idea to me for any place in the Middle East or Africa.
        In the end, the host country has to bear responsibility, as we can't station armies in every country to protect all our embassies. Since these Muslim countries are either unable or unwilling to do what needs to be done to protect our embassies, we pull out until we're confident of their willingness/ability to provide protection.
        Originally posted by Priceless
        Good to see you're so reasonable.
        Originally posted by ScoobyDoo
        Very well, said.
        Originally posted by Rover
        A fair assessment Bob.

        Comment


        • Re: Global War on Terror III: Dick Cheney's Hague ICC Vacation

          Originally posted by Bob Gray View Post
          You're in fine form today. Didn't know presidents can declare war.
          FYP. Check out the Constitution.

          Comment


          • Re: Global War on Terror III: Dick Cheney's Hague ICC Vacation

            Originally posted by Kepler View Post
            It sounds like the Emperor was going to pull an Israel with the survivors and compound a genocide by stealing somebody else's planet for them. The parallels become more and more eerie.
            You mean a democratically elected Emperor would show great restraint as terrorists regularly attack his nation even though he could wipe them out if there was no concern for the civilian toll? I'm missing the parrallels here. I think you've gotten them flipped around.
            Originally posted by Priceless
            Good to see you're so reasonable.
            Originally posted by ScoobyDoo
            Very well, said.
            Originally posted by Rover
            A fair assessment Bob.

            Comment


            • Re: Global War on Terror III: Dick Cheney's Hague ICC Vacation

              Originally posted by FlagDUDE08 View Post
              FYP. Check out the Constitution.
              That's a fuzzy line these days.
              Originally posted by Priceless
              Good to see you're so reasonable.
              Originally posted by ScoobyDoo
              Very well, said.
              Originally posted by Rover
              A fair assessment Bob.

              Comment


              • Re: Global War on Terror III: Dick Cheney's Hague ICC Vacation

                Originally posted by Bob Gray View Post
                In the end, the host country has to bear responsibility, as we can't station armies in every country to protect all our embassies. Since these Muslim countries are either unable or unwilling to do what needs to be done to protect our embassies, we pull out until we're confident of their willingness/ability to provide protection.
                I agree that if the host country cannot guarantee the physical safety of the embassy personnel or grounds then we should not have an embassy there. The question then becomes what do you do when the host country guarantees that safety and then something happens? I think it is best to see whether the host country (1) publicly and strongly condemns the attack, (2) makes a good faith effort to find the perpetrators including sharing all information they have with us, and (3) helps us in our effort to ensure it does not happen again.

                I think we are going to be dealing with a lot of problems with both sincerity and competence among the factions of these new governments. Just pulling out and leaving them to stew in their own juices is a recipe for failed states and Taliban-like fundy movements. As irritating as it is, we have to stay engaged.

                Short of turning the entire region into a parabolic mirror, that is. I imagine there will be calls for that eventually.
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                • Re: Global War on Terror III: Dick Cheney's Hague ICC Vacation

                  Originally posted by Bob Gray View Post
                  You mean a democratically elected Emperor would show great restraint as terrorists regularly attack his nation even though he could wipe them out if there was no concern for the civilian toll? I'm missing the parrallels here. I think you've gotten them flipped around.
                  Um. Joke?
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                  • Re: Global War on Terror III: Dick Cheney's Hague ICC Vacation

                    Originally posted by FlagDUDE08 View Post
                    Oh, so now it's different because it didn't happen on that day? Quit changing your story.
                    It seems like you're having a conversation with yourself. You know that ugly person who keeps mocking you by mimicking your every move? That's called a "mirror" and there's no need to take out your frustrations with that person on me.
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                    • Re: Global War on Terror III: Dick Cheney's Hague ICC Vacation

                      Originally posted by Kepler View Post
                      I agree that if the host country cannot guarantee the physical safety of the embassy personnel or grounds then we should not have an embassy there. The question then becomes what do you do when the host country guarantees that safety and then something happens? I think it is best to see whether the host country (1) publicly and strongly condemns the attack, (2) makes a good faith effort to find the perpetrators including sharing all information they have with us, and (3) helps us in our effort to ensure it does not happen again.

                      I think we are going to be dealing with a lot of problems with both sincerity and competence among the factions of these new governments. Just pulling out and leaving them to stew in their own juices is a recipe for failed states and Taliban-like fundy movements. As irritating as it is, we have to stay engaged.

                      Short of turning the entire region into a parabolic mirror, that is. I imagine there will be calls for that eventually.
                      Having U.S. embassy staff in their country or not isn't going to make or break them. If they become a failed state (to the extent they haven't already), it's not because we have an embassy there or not. I do agree that if a country takes all the right steps then you don't yank an embassy. But, I have little faith that these countries can take all the right steps and ensure our embassy's safety. There are ways to stay engaged without providing a sitting duck target for the next tantrum the populace of a given Muslim country decides to throw.
                      Originally posted by Priceless
                      Good to see you're so reasonable.
                      Originally posted by ScoobyDoo
                      Very well, said.
                      Originally posted by Rover
                      A fair assessment Bob.

                      Comment


                      • Re: Global War on Terror III: Dick Cheney's Hague ICC Vacation

                        Originally posted by Kepler View Post
                        Um. Joke?
                        Sorry for looking for the parallels you said there were.
                        Originally posted by Priceless
                        Good to see you're so reasonable.
                        Originally posted by ScoobyDoo
                        Very well, said.
                        Originally posted by Rover
                        A fair assessment Bob.

                        Comment


                        • Re: Global War on Terror III: Dick Cheney's Hague ICC Vacation

                          Originally posted by Bob Gray View Post
                          Having U.S. embassy staff in their country or not isn't going to make or break them. If they become a failed state (to the extent they haven't already), it's not because we have an embassy there or not. I do agree that if a country takes all the right steps then you don't yank an embassy. But, I have little faith that these countries can take all the right steps and ensure our embassy's safety. There are ways to stay engaged without providing a sitting duck target for the next tantrum the populace of a given Muslim country decides to throw.
                          I am more sympathetic to your point than you probably expect, particularly since I know plenty of foreign service officers. I would love to see us find a way of keeping communication lines open without also putting our people at risk.
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                          Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

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                          • Re: Global War on Terror III: Dick Cheney's Hague ICC Vacation

                            Originally posted by Kepler View Post
                            I am more sympathetic to your point than you probably expect, particularly since I know plenty of foreign service officers. I would love to see us find a way of keeping communication lines open without also putting our people at risk.
                            I think we're largely on the same page. I've had relatives in foreign places that are far from safe, so I understand your sentiments. Really, in a lot of the Middle Eastern countries, I don't know how we can be certain that our embassy will be safe. Egypt and Libya are the poster children, but this could have happened other places.
                            Originally posted by Priceless
                            Good to see you're so reasonable.
                            Originally posted by ScoobyDoo
                            Very well, said.
                            Originally posted by Rover
                            A fair assessment Bob.

                            Comment


                            • Re: Global War on Terror III: Dick Cheney's Hague ICC Vacation

                              Originally posted by Bob Gray View Post
                              I think we're largely on the same page. I've had relatives in foreign places that are far from safe, so I understand your sentiments. Really, in a lot of the Middle Eastern countries, I don't know how we can be certain that our embassy will be safe. Egypt and Libya are the poster children, but this could have happened other places.
                              We didn't learn from the last time we had a Communist president. Why should we expect that we've learned anything this time? They'll probably stay.

                              Comment


                              • Re: Global War on Terror III: Dick Cheney's Hague ICC Vacation

                                Several weeks ago I said that in the realm of international relations, I'd rather that the US be feared / respected and not care whether we were liked or not.

                                Probably not the best day to speculate on how much Obama's 2009 "can't we all be friends" speech in Cairo contributed to these events.....
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