The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

when 47% of the population doesn't pay into begin with?

BS.

Everyone under 100,000 per year that has a job pays 12% in payroll taxes (except under the new stimulus which is 4.5% and 6% so 10.5%). Everyone also pays Medicare taxes which is 2.9%. If you're going to include SS and Medicare in the FIX plan like Ryan is then you have to include the fact that everyone who has a job pays into the solution already.

This whole line of "they don't pay any income tax" is crap. They do. We have the poor income tax and it's the 6% (4.5%) they pay in and the 6% they don't get from their employer cause their employer pays in. So, EVERYONE who works is paying ~13% in Federal Taxes. Of course you get a 10.5% tax rate cut after ~100,000 dollars of income. And since the Republicans use that money to pay for Wars and the Democrats use it for things like NCLB it's all the same pool of money. Thus, EVERYONE who has income pays taxes.

How about making your corporate friends pay ANYTHING in taxes (rather than sucking us dry with corporate welfare).

That sounds like more Scooby Fantasy Land talk. Better dial it back.

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

Just a theory.

[leswp1]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

Funniest response to article-So if we want to stop the cons from breeding, someone better make condoms easier to operate. Either that, or tell them scary, but simple, stories about the women-parts.

How do people think of these things?

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

Personally I liked:

So their war on science was pre-emptive. Pretty shrewd.

From page two, this guy wins the Comments:

I guess that makes Sarah Palin "Queen Amygdala."

[Bob Gray]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

Yeah, yeah, that's me. Capt. Fantasy Land.

Recognition sounds like a step in your recovery. I salute you for this.

[leswp1]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

Personally I liked:



From page two, this guy wins the Comments:

Heh, I didn't get that far.

[MinnFan]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

How about any of a number of other countries that have far higher tax rates? Or are you saying that America is some special phenomenon whereby it's subject to some economic law that taxes collected always = 19% of GDP?

The 19% solution
Take a look at the graph (from the OMB) on the right side. Revenue is pretty flat compared to GDP and thats with tax rates of 70+% at times.

[MinnFan]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

How about making your corporate friends pay ANYTHING in taxes (rather than sucking us dry with corporate welfare).

I'm all for taking away all corporate subsidies. I hate rent seeking. It would allow us to lower corporate tax rates and be more competitive overall.

Of course, you're going to have to get the Dems to play ball as they are actually providing most of the subsidies now for "green" programs. They also get the majority of lobby money.

[MinnFan]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

BS.

Everyone under 100,000 per year that has a job pays 12% in payroll taxes (except under the new stimulus which is 4.5% and 6% so 10.5%). Everyone also pays Medicare taxes which is 2.9%. If you're going to include SS and Medicare in the FIX plan like Ryan is then you have to include the fact that everyone who has a job pays into the solution already.

This whole line of "they don't pay any income tax" is crap. They do. We have the poor income tax and it's the 6% (4.5%) they pay in and the 6% they don't get from their employer cause their employer pays in. So, EVERYONE who works is paying ~13% in Federal Taxes. Of course you get a 10.5% tax rate cut after ~100,000 dollars of income. And since the Republicans use that money to pay for Wars and the Democrats use it for things like NCLB it's all the same pool of money. Thus, EVERYONE who has income pays taxes.

I know we've had this discussion before, but that money goes to specific programs and has nothing to do with running the gov't. In fact, the income tax revenue is now paying for those programs. So I ask again, what percentage of the population should pay for the running of the federal gov't?

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

They also get the majority of lobby money.

Firstly, that's obviously not what that chart says (even though the article tries to slip it in). It takes a set of large contributers (probably carefully selected -- note the laughable bias and silly language of the article, "leftist," blah blah blah, Jesus, who talks that way outside the Echo Chamber? -- and notes Dems get more from those sources. Notice they are unions and such. Let's make a list of the top financial firms, the top energy companies, the top aerospace companies, the top pharm companies (actually, that one's probably about equally corrupt) and see where that money goes. The "leftist" narrative is, after all, that the GOP is bought and paid for by the top 1%. I'd say that's unarguably true. The only real question is whether the Dems are also bought and paid for by the top 1%.

Secondly, I don't understand why corporations pay taxes at all. I would zero out all corporate tax rates and then tax the ef out of high income earners. Let capital flow and create jobs. Collect the money from the people who have it.

[MinnFan]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

Firstly, that's obviously not what that chart says (even though the article tries to slip it in). It takes a set of large contributers (probably carefully selected -- note the laughable bias and silly language of the article, "leftist," blah blah blah, Jesus, who talks that way outside the Echo Chamber? -- and notes Dems get more from those sources. Notice they are unions and such. Let's make a list of the top financial firms, the top energy companies, the top aerospace companies, the top pharm companies (actually, that one's probably about equally corrupt) and see where that money goes. The "leftist" narrative is, after all, that the GOP is bought and paid for by the top 1%. I'd say that's unarguably true. The only real question is whether the Dems are also bought and paid for by the top 1%.

I was trying more to point out that both sides get plenty of corporate money.

Secondly, I don't understand why corporations pay taxes at all. I would zero out all corporate tax rates and then tax the ef out of high income earners. Let capital flow and create jobs. Collect the money from the people who have it.

I'd do the same thing, but I'd tax the resources that are taken out of the economy (sales) instead of the work that is put into it (income).

[Priceless]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

The only real question is whether the Dems are also bought and paid for by the top 1%.

The billionaires on the Forbes 400 list have given more than $30 million to politicians and political action committees since 2006, along with millions more in soft money to politically active groups. Although Forbes 400 members give about 15% more money to Republicans than Democrats, they fund groups across the political spectrum.

Link

My favorite is Bill Gates. He's given money to just about everyone.

[Bakunin]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

I'm wondering if it's possible to come up with a revenue neutral way to tax behaviors that aren't productive and eliminate the income tax altogether (since working is clearly a productive behavior).

What are the worst behaviors we as a society are guilty of?

Here's a few off the top of my head:
- consuming too much energy (solution: tax energy consumption at a higher rate)
- overeating / consuming unhealthy foods in excess (solution: tax all junk food/soft drinks)
- polluting / contributing to global climate change (solution: tax on emissions including CO2)
- buying a lot of crap we don't actually need (solution: national sales tax)

I could've cited alcohol and tobacco use, but both are already taxed heavily.

[MinnFan]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

I'm wondering if it's possible to come up with a revenue neutral way to tax behaviors that aren't productive and eliminate the income tax altogether (since working is clearly a productive behavior).

What are the worst behaviors we as a society are guilty of?

Here's a few off the top of my head:
- consuming too much energy (solution: tax energy consumption at a higher rate)
- overeating / consuming unhealthy foods in excess (solution: tax all junk food/soft drinks)
- polluting / contributing to global climate change (solution: tax on emissions including CO2)
- buying a lot of crap we don't actually need (solution: national sales tax)

I could've cited alcohol and tobacco use, but both are already taxed heavily.

They problem you have is who defines what isn't productive. For example, its takes a lot of energy to make steel. Is that now not productive?

[unofan]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

I was trying more to point out that both sides get plenty of corporate money.

I'd do the same thing, but I'd tax the resources that are taken out of the economy (sales) instead of the work that is put into it (income).

Because that isn't regressive at all, when rich people can simply not spend money while poor people have to spend everything just to live.

The luxury tax no longer exists because it didn't hurt rich people, it hurt the people who made the luxury goods as their sales dried up.

Nice solution there, really. And don't use this as another opportunity to bring up a link to the Fair Tax for the upteenth dozen time. That's the biggest crock of **** ever.