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  • #16
    Something seems off about all this...

    RMU has a $38M endowment, which is small, but not nothing
    RMU raised $100M ahead of schedule for their centennial
    The budget concerns have been ongoing and discussed several times publicly since the start of COVID shutdowns (they talk mostly about football/basketball revenue lost)
    RMU has been successful on both sides, even winning conference titles and hosting national tournaments
    One of their corporate partners is the local pro men's club

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    • #17
      Call Lynchburg, VA and see if Liberty wants to make the jump. They have the barn.
      CCT '77 & '78
      4 kids
      5 grandsons (BCA 7/09, CJA 5/14, JDL 8/14, JFL 6/16, PJL 7/18)
      1 granddaughter (EML 4/18)

      ”Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.”
      - Benjamin Franklin

      Banned from the St. Lawrence University Facebook page - March 2016 (But I got better).

      I want to live forever. So far, so good.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by TonyTheTiger20 View Post

        This would be tremendous and welcome news.
        I took some time to read the relevant DI bylaws and it looks like the same grace period applies, unless I am interpreting the following incorrectly:

        31.3.4.4.3 Grace Period. A conference shall remain eligible for automatic qualification for two years following the date of the withdrawal of the institution(s) that causes the conference's membership to fall below six institutions that sponsor the sport and conduct conference competition together, provided the conference maintains at least five Division I members. (Adopted: 8/5/04, Revised: 1/15/11 effective 8/1/11)
        The way I read it, as long as the CHA doesn't lose another member and fall to four they maintain their AQ until at least 23-24.

        EDIT: Comparing the DI book to DIII there is an additional provision that may mean the CHA goes without the AQ if they don't find a sixth member by next season if I am reading it correctly.

        The manual states:

        31.3.4.2 Requirements -- National Collegiate Championship. [#] To be eligible for automatic qualification in a National Collegiate Championship, a member conference must meet the following general requirements: (Adopted: 1/9/06 effective 8/1/06)

        (a) Have at least six active members that sponsor the applicable sport in any division (Note: A provisional member in the process of becoming an NCAA member may not be used to meet the requisite number.);

        (b) The six active members must have conducted conference competition together for the preceding two years in the applicable sport;

        (c) There shall be no waivers of the two-year waiting period; and

        (d) Any new member added to a conference that is eligible for an automatic bid shall be immediately eligible to represent the conference as the automatic qualifier.
        That point (b) I bolded is not something in the DIII manual so I'm not familiar with how it is applied. It seems like they could have the grace period and keep the AQ for the next two seasons, but lose it for one season (23-24) if perhaps they play next season with only five but get a sixth for 22-23. Like I said I've waded outside what I'm used to so I don't want to speculate any further...

        If anyone wants to read the source doc further, it is here: https://web3.ncaa.org/lsdbi/reports/getReport/90008
        Last edited by Scott_TG; 05-26-2021, 05:37 PM.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by joecct View Post
          Call Lynchburg, VA and see if Liberty wants to make the jump. They have the barn.
          1. Dear sweet God, no.
          2. They don't. Have talked to a few ACHA people and they like being able to beat up on everyone. All of Liberty's athletic teams do this.

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          • #20
            I still personally prefer a 16 team tournament with regular season champs also getting autobids.

            Comment


            • #21
              Obviously, bad news. RMU was as competetive as any in CHA. Really on the way up.

              As for conferences, why not merge CHA and NEWHA. Instead of two barely there conferences, one that could turn out a competitive team or two come tournament time. And it alleviates any time pressure for expanding the tournament.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Lindsay View Post
                I just wish the smart people in the room would say “we just don’t care about hockey” rather than gobbledygook.
                True, the larger press release is just coded language for budget cuts and revenue actions across the university. I am guessing that hockey was the loser because it was likely the biggest line item that could be cut, given the current menu of RMU sports teams (few schools dare to cut football or hoops). The language about the hockey facility suggests other cost issues may have compounded the losses; one wonders if that complex will eventually be sold.

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                • #23
                  Big picture, this event makes me grateful for LIU and Stonehill adding hockey in recent/near future years. Women’s hockey has always been steps forward, steps backward and hopefully trending forward.

                  But that doesn’t change the sadness I feel on a lot of fronts, for the people involved, the livelihoods, the CHA, women’s hockey in Pittsburgh. What the does LIU hockey mean to someone in Pittsburgh? Not a whole lot.

                  Paul Colontino is a guy who has spent 21ish years building 3 different women's hockey programs. He is an excellent women’s head hockey coach. Was at Hurst for year 2 and 3 of that program, helped start up North Dakota, back to Hurst for the absolute peak (so far ) of that program, and then off to RMU in 2011. First year at RMU and his crew stunned Hurst in the
                  CHA Championship, winning their first ever title in a game they had no business winning. In his decade at RMU, he got that program ranked as high as number 5 I believe. He
                  managed to find and coach up talent, and they played with pride and confidence every time I watched them. That program, under Colontino, was a complete thorn in the side of both Hurst and Cuse, and made the league better for it.
                  I don’t know what is next for him, but should he still desire to be coaching women’s college hockey I hope he finds his next opportunity as soon as he’s ready. He was a GA my first year at Mercyhurst, by my recollection any program would be lucky to have him.

                  I went to a game at RMU’s rink a few years back. The band was there, the mascot, there was a promo happening, not a big crowd but enough, and it was a great game. It felt like a program that was valued by its school and as a CHA fan, I loved that because that is what every D1 hockey player deserves. You saw the pride in the program in the post game write ups, the fact that they often posted video of both teams highlights on their website (very gracious), their hype videos, the small but passionate Twitter media types fandom they had, the talent they kept recruiting, national program players here and there, the personality in their Twitter person...how I dreaded reading “jam it like a jay bird Jaycee Gebhard” followed by yet another goal announcement! And you see the pride they had in their program based on sad reactions of players today.

                  And anyone paying attention to the program (obvs not the board of trustees) would know about the McLaughlin Bittle family, both alums of the men’s and women’s programs, Brianne - from little RMU- an Olympian...and both of them 2 of the biggest ambassadors of that school in local girls hockey and beyond. Both still coaching girls/women , one locally and one seemingly headed back to the Olympics. Both legacies of the RMU programs, continuing to shape hockey in that city. How did the school not see the value in what they had? Who dropped the puck when USA Canada played at the Penguins practice facility, stands packed with little girl hockey players and old lady hockey players? McLaughlin. Why would RMU just opt out of the hockey scene in Pittsburgh?


                  When I look for value in that program, I see the opportunity someone like a Michaela Boyle had there. I knew it was trouble for the rest of the CHA as soon as I learned of the transfer and sure enough it was. It was gratifying to read about how positive the change had been for her. I feel badly for her and her teammates who now have to split up. I feel for them and past alums who won’t know the joy of getting to go back to their alma mater and witness a new team of Colonials, new group of young women being invested in, being given an opportunity to be D1 athletes, women’s hockey players at RMU.

                  To end I’ll say this. I love the CHA. It will be fine. Whether it’s mergers, realignments, a sixth team, or life as a 5 team league, they’ll be fine. But they’d be better with RMU.
                  Last edited by Lindsay; 05-26-2021, 11:42 PM.

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                  • #24
                    Sorry for the worlds longest post. Feeling sad for RMU women’s hockey and wondering how their board didn’t see the value in fighting to keep them.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by robertearle View Post
                      As for conferences, why not merge CHA and NEWHA. Instead of two barely there conferences, one that could turn out a competitive team or two come tournament time.
                      Historically, this isn't fair to the CHA. The CHA has won games in the NCAAs (okay, Mercyhurst has); the NEWHA is still a dream that someone had. Moving forward, do you really want to saddle the Lakers, Syracuse, and Penn State with a schedule filled up with the likes of Post and St. Michael's? I don't see how that is going to produce a more competitive CHA champ.

                      "... And lose, and start again at your beginnings
                      And never breathe a word about your loss;" -- Rudyard Kipling

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by ARM View Post
                        Historically, this isn't fair to the CHA. The CHA has won games in the NCAAs (okay, Mercyhurst has); the NEWHA is still a dream that someone had. Moving forward, do you really want to saddle the Lakers, Syracuse, and Penn State with a schedule filled up with the likes of Post and St. Michael's? I don't see how that is going to produce a more competitive CHA champ.
                        They're the ones about to lose their autobid, aren't they? The win for NEWHA is they get a measure of legitimacy for recruiting, the win for CHA is they maintain a bid into the tournament.

                        otherwise, if I'm Syracuse, I'm thinking ECAC, and if I'm Penn State may be throwing some weight to a Big Ten happening, etc etc.(maybe with Mercyhurst as an "adjunct" member. They already do that with Notre Dame for men's hockey, and Johns Hopkins for Lacrosse.)

                        None of it what anyone might have chosen, but this is where they are now.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by robertearle View Post

                          ....... if I'm Syracuse, I'm thinking ECAC, ..........
                          ECAC runs their schedule with each team having a travel partner for each weekend. Syracuse/RIT make an excellent pair from a travel perspective, Syracuse/Mercyhurst or Syracuse/Penn State from a hockey perspective. 14 team League is doable from a schedule standpoint, 13 team would not be great.

                          Or lets really blow up the womens scene, IVY's Split from the ECAC and have their 6 team league (this screws Cornell from a travel perspective), Syracuse, Penn State, RIT and
                          Mercyhurst join the non-IVY teams in a 10 team league, CCT/SLU, RPI/Union, Syracuse/Colgate, Mercyhurst/RIT and Quinny/Penn State the travel partners. Lindenwood to the WCHA???

                          Or the ECAC could absorb 4 teams from the CHA and split into 2 conferences, 6 team IVY (Cornell/Prinny become travel partners) and 10 team Non-Ivy and run some type of cross schedule between the 2 conferences. Post season gets a bit tricky but each conference could have their own tournament and the 2 winners meet for the NC$$ Auto bid.
                          Last edited by vicb; 05-27-2021, 05:34 AM.
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                          • #28
                            https://victorypress.org/2021/05/27/...ckey-programs/

                            You guys are too pragmatic. Already carving up the landscape, moving on. And that’s fine, carry on, I’m just not there yet! I’m still in Bobby Mo post mortem mode.
                            Last edited by Lindsay; 05-27-2021, 09:18 AM.

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                            • #29
                              http://burghhockey.com/gajtka-rmus-m...-hockey-teams/

                              It seems they want to be a basketball school and that’s their right for sure. It’s also being suggested that the issue is a need for capital investment in the ice rink as one reason for cutting hockey.

                              They put a lot of money into basketball’s facility ($50 million, all fundraised) rather than perhaps something more modest that left funds to address hockey’s capital needs too. It’s an interesting debate to me. Do you attempt to go big in one sport, or have modest but respectable facilities and try to gain your edge another way, in multiple sports? Obviously there are schools that can do it all, spend big everywhere; RMU is saying they aren’t one of them.

                              Another poster mentioned RMU’s endowment. It’s similar to Hurst’s but I have a hard time imagining Hurst building a $50 million dollar sports facility. This part of the statement about wanting to “align with schools our size” is a bit of gut punch as a result, but maybe Hurst is the outlier.

                              in the facilities arms race, in this scenario hockey became a casualty. Hard not to yearn for a day when common sense prevailed and modest yet still adequate facilities were considered palatable to the powers that be, at small institutions. If it was an “age and state of the ice rink” issue, could they have some sort of partnership with the rink at Cranberry, like what Lindenwood does? It’s a humble solution, but nothing wrong with it. If a $50 million dollar facility is going to be a standard for what a D1 facility should be, to the detriment of other capital projects, how is this sport going to grow? Just a shame altogether.

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Lindsay View Post
                                http://burghhockey.com/gajtka-rmus-m...-hockey-teams/

                                It seems they want to be a basketball school and that’s their right for sure. It’s also being suggested that the issue is a need for capital investment in the ice rink as one reason for cutting hockey.

                                They put a lot of money into basketball’s facility ($50 million, all fundraised) rather than perhaps something more modest that left funds to address hockey’s capital needs too. It’s an interesting debate to me. Do you attempt to go big in one sport, or have modest but respectable facilities and try to gain your edge another way, in multiple sports? Obviously there are schools that can do it all, spend big everywhere; RMU is saying they aren’t one of them.

                                Another poster mentioned RMU’s endowment. It’s similar to Hurst’s but I have a hard time imagining Hurst building a $50 million dollar sports facility. This part of the statement about wanting to “align with schools our size” is a bit of gut punch as a result, but maybe Hurst is the outlier.

                                in the facilities arms race, in this scenario hockey became a casualty. Hard not to yearn for a day when common sense prevailed and modest yet still adequate facilities were considered palatable to the powers that be, at small institutions. If it was an “age and state of the ice rink” issue, could they have some sort of partnership with the rink at Cranberry, like what Lindenwood does? It’s a humble solution, but nothing wrong with it. If a $50 million dollar facility is going to be a standard for what a D1 facility should be, to the detriment of other capital projects, how is this sport going to grow? Just a shame altogether.
                                Isn't Robert Morris hand-in-hand with the Pittsburgh Penguins on some level? I thought I read that somewhere. If so, is there something legal keeping the Penguins from helping out the only D-1 hockey in Pittsburgh, or is it too late for that?

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