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  • #16
    Originally posted by Lord_Zubin View Post

    according to the complete campus list on the suny website Bing, Albany, Buffalo and Stony Brook are considered university centers wheras the current sunyac schools are all considered university colleges so i don't think oswegos name change from "state university of new york college at oswego" to "state university of new york at oswego" really means all that much
    Exactly.

    Buffalo State is now considered a university, but SUNY is not calling them a University Center. Like it was mentioned earlier, some of this definition difference comes from whether the school is a research and/or medical school.

    Nobody else is going D1 in SUNY. Let's just end the conversation now.
    Russell Jaslow
    [Former] SUNYAC Correspondent
    U.S. College Hockey Online

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Lord_Zubin View Post

      according to the complete campus list on the suny website Bing, Albany, Buffalo and Stony Brook are considered university centers wheras the current sunyac schools are all considered university colleges so i don't think oswegos name change from "state university of new york college at oswego" to "state university of new york at oswego" really means all that much
      I don’t know how much the distinction really matters at the end of the day. There is research happening at the SUNY colleges and you can get advanced degrees at most of them. They are also larger than some “universities” by enrollment. The difference in naming is partly how SUNY chooses to market its state colleges to differentiate them from its university centers (I.e. focus on teaching and undergraduate experience versus graduate school and research).

      The SUNYAC schools are certainly large enough to go D1 if SUNY wanted them to do so; whether it chooses to label them as colleges or universities is irrelevant for that purpose.
      #OneKnight

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      • #18
        Originally posted by KnightsOfTheRound View Post

        I don’t know how much the distinction really matters at the end of the day. There is research happening at the SUNY colleges and you can get advanced degrees at most of them. They are also larger than some “universities” by enrollment. The difference in naming is partly how SUNY chooses to market its state colleges to differentiate them from its university centers (I.e. focus on teaching and undergraduate experience versus graduate school and research).

        The SUNYAC schools are certainly large enough to go D1 if SUNY wanted them to do so; whether it chooses to label them as colleges or universities is irrelevant for that purpose.
        I mean they do explicitly state that the university centers "top priorities" is research while also providing doctoral progams, whereas the rest of them aren't and instead are "focused on student success" and dont have doctoral programs. Since research often brings a lot of money in for schools Id imagine that's quite the distinction and explains why those 4 are d1 and the rest are d3.
        Oswego 22' and 23' Student Section Leader 2022-2024. If you heard a weird or offensive chant during an Oswego Hockey Broadcast during that time... odds are my friend Tim and I started it.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Lord_Zubin View Post

          I mean they do explicitly state that the university centers "top priorities" is research while also providing doctoral progams, whereas the rest of them aren't and instead are "focused on student success" and dont have doctoral programs. Since research often brings a lot of money in for schools Id imagine that's quite the distinction and explains why those 4 are d1 and the rest are d3.
          Exactly.

          In fact, that is part of the criteria for the Big Ten to accept schools in this crazy realignment era. They won't just take any big institution with a big football program. You also have to have a certain level of research programs for the Big Ten to consider you. That's also why a few years ago the Pac-12 was looking to add Texas, because they were a major research institution. Stony Brook has a massive medical center with one of the largest hospitals on Long Island that has done some groundbreaking research. There is no SUNY college that comes close to that sort of setup. And SUNY wanted these university centers to be D1 to be able to "compete" amongst the other research and medical institutions around the country from a marketing standpoint. (Interestingly, the University of Rochester also has a massive medical and hospital setup -- now the largest employer in the area -- and has also done massive amounts of research in all areas -- including the Manhattan Project. But that school has always been happy keeping their sports program at the D3 level.)

          And the research grants bring in way more money than even the most successful sports programs do.
          Last edited by Russell Jaslow; 09-13-2023, 07:09 AM.
          Russell Jaslow
          [Former] SUNYAC Correspondent
          U.S. College Hockey Online

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          • #20
            Well there goes the bulls$it about travel time and costs....
            Oswego State 1980 Grad
            (attended in one way or another from 1968-1988, don't ask..... )

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            • #21
              Originally posted by ColdInRomney View Post
              Well there goes the bulls$it about travel time and costs....
              It's just one sport. Overall, they save a ton of money. Hate to admit that, but it's the truth.

              You need to take your blinders off and understand hockey is just one sport in an overall athletic department.
              Russell Jaslow
              [Former] SUNYAC Correspondent
              U.S. College Hockey Online

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Russell Jaslow View Post

                It's just one sport. Overall, they save a ton of money. Hate to admit that, but it's the truth.

                You need to take your blinders off and understand hockey is just one sport in an overall athletic department.
                Yes, exactly. This reminds me of the guy who couldn't believe Biden won the election since all his neighbors had Trump signs in their yards.

                I've seen the numbers on the savings; they're legit.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by Russell Jaslow View Post

                  It's just one sport. Overall, they save a ton of money. Hate to admit that, but it's the truth.

                  You need to take your blinders off and understand hockey is just one sport in an overall athletic department.
                  Exactly. For the many sports in which they will be in the Empire 8, their travel cost will likely be similar to a version of the SUNYAC that doesn’t include Plattsburgh and Potsdam. Their hockey travel may be getting worse, but the money they save by not driving to the North Country for basically every sport outweighs that by far.

                  I’m very aware that Plattsburgh is geographically an outlier for just about any conference, so if a few more dominoes had fallen and the SUNYAC folded, Plattsburgh would have a real hard time finding another multi-sport conference.
                  Plattsburgh CARDINALS
                  SUNYAC Champ x24: 78, 79, 82, 83, 85, 87, 88, 90, 92, 93, 97, 98, 99, 00, 01, 02, 04, 08, 09, 11, 12, 15, 17, 23
                  ECACW Champ x11: 81, 82, 87, 92, 06, 07, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17
                  NEWHL Champ x5: 18, 19, 20, 22, 23
                  NCAA DIII Champ x10-ish: 87, 92, 01, 07, 08, 14, 15, 16, 17, 19
                  NCAA DIII Runner-up x4-ish: 86, 90, 06, 08
                  NCAA DII Runner-up x2: 81, 82

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by CARDS_rule_the_Burgh View Post

                    Exactly. For the many sports in which they will be in the Empire 8, their travel cost will likely be similar to a version of the SUNYAC that doesn’t include Plattsburgh and Potsdam. Their hockey travel may be getting worse, but the money they save by not driving to the North Country for basically every sport outweighs that by far.

                    I’m very aware that Plattsburgh is geographically an outlier for just about any conference, so if a few more dominoes had fallen and the SUNYAC folded, Plattsburgh would have a real hard time finding another multi-sport conference.
                    Liberty League?
                    CCT '77 & '78
                    4 kids
                    5 grandsons (BCA 7/09, CJA 5/14, JDL 8/14, JFL 6/16, PJL 7/18)
                    1 granddaughter (EML 4/18)

                    ”Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.”
                    - Benjamin Franklin

                    Banned from the St. Lawrence University Facebook page - March 2016 (But I got better).

                    I want to live forever. So far, so good.

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                    • #25
                      For what it is worth, Utica has an undergrad enrollment of 2678 . And I believe Oswego is around 8000. I cannot see the benefit of turning your entire Athletic program D2 to have a men’s D1 program

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by lakont55 View Post
                        For what it is worth, Utica has an undergrad enrollment of 2678 . And I believe Oswego is around 8000. I cannot see the benefit of turning your entire Athletic program D2 to have a men’s D1 program
                        They wouldn’t be the smallest school to have D2 athletics and a D1 hockey team.

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