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  • Originally posted by net presence View Post



    PSUChamps... I see you have yet to respond/address the information I provided regarding the prevalence of post-infection myocarditis and lung scarring, along with the information that clearly and definitively proves that your conspiracy theory about hospitals and doctors making more money by attributing non-Covid deaths as Covid, is complete B.S. C'mon, I'd really like to hear you respond with specifics about what I've provided.
    Seriously? Have your not read (or choose not to) the stories about how hospitals were getting extra money for putting people on ventilators?

    Fact check: Medicare pays hospitals more money for COVID-19 patients (usatoday.com)

    Oh wow what do you know.....

    Florida Man Killed in Crash Listed as COVID-19 Death, Raising Doubts Over Health Data (newsweek.com)

    I could care less what your "experts" say. Does it happen to "some"? Sure? The majority? Not even close. I know of at least a dozen people who have tested positive and are living a normal life post COVID. I know ZERO people who are on their last leg post COVID. I had a relative die of a heart attack but had COVID antibodies so they classified it COVID to get more $$. They're was no freaking "lung scarring" or freaking "post-infection myocarditis". That's not some article, thats real life.

    Originally posted by net presence View Post
    Next, I'm genuinely sorry to hear about your health issues. And, I hope your surgery went as well as can be. However, I'm curious as to how you determined that "the number of 'critical' patients is not as bad as 'they' make it sound either." First, how do you know for sure which patients you saw in the ER were deemed "critical" by the staff? Did you speak to the doctors that were caring for each of those individuals? If so, then they committed numerous HIPPA violations. If you didn't speak to the doctors, did you diagnose the various patients' situations simply on appearances? How much they were sneezing or coughing? Seriously, without speaking to either the individual patients or their doctors or nurses, how can you possibly know how ill they were?
    How did I determine it? Because my doctors told me they were shutting down all non-emergency surgeries at URMC due to the lack of help and increasing number of patients. My nurse in the post-op, as I stated, was just coming back from COVID herself. She normally worked the COVID floor at URMC. When it was brought up in conversation SHE told me first hand how most patients are coming in to the hospital and the slightest hint of breathing problems they admit them. Though they normally don't need anything more than a little O2. Do some still get sick very sick? Yes, they probably would with the common flu too. Again, this isn't out of some magazine, this is real life.

    Originally posted by net presence View Post
    Next, my family has what I would characterize as fairly good health insurance through my wife's employer. We pay at least $5,000 out of pocket each year and have for the last 5-8 years. It might've gone up to $6,000 this year, not to mention we have to pay a certain percentage of surgery costs as well and, I have had three different joints completely replaced in the last 18 months. So, let me ask you this in regards to your thoughts about how our health care system compares to Canada's (and other western industrialized nations). Let's say that to pay for single-payer health care, anyone making $100,000 gross each year would have to pay an extra $2,000 in federal taxes. But, after paying that, you literally never spent another penny for any medical related expense. Doesn't that mean my family's net income would rise by $3,000-$4,000 ? And, since over 70% of our economy is consumer based, wouldn't the economy benefit significantly from millions of individuals and families having another $2,000-$5,000 to spend (or save, or pay down debt) each year? Seems as though it might.
    I too have some very good (for the price) health insurance through my employer. I pay $220 bi-weekly and then $25 co-pays for Doctor visits, $5 and $10 for medications (normally generic), $75 for each hospital trip, $40 for any Ultrasound/X-Ray...and Ill continue to the next part...

    Originally posted by net presence View Post
    Now, I realize your response will likely be another right-wing talking point about the supposedly long wait times for certain tests or procedures (as that's what you've done in other recent posts). Funny, I have numerous friends who are Canadian and when I ask them about that, their response is that it rarely takes as long as is rumored. Oftentimes, it's a matter of the population being much smaller and being far less dense. Which in turn, means individuals are often a fair distance from the needed facilities/doctors and it's harder for people to get to those places.
    Ah Yes, lets bring the Right Wing, Left Wing, Trumpian, Riding with Biden crap into it....for 1, I disagree 100% with how people vote in the US nor to I agree with anything political because people can't think their own way these days. You're either one way or the other, and you have to be that way. US Politics is trash, period.

    So now that we got that out of the way, you can talk to whom every you want. I have a son of a Canadian on my travel team. His father actually played NHL hockey for years. I also lived 15 minutes from the Canadian/NY border growing up. Talking with Canadians was a lot more than having "numerous" friends. Once again, I had a friend who needed a tonsillectomy. It was a 9 month wait. They paid cash, came down to CVPH in Plattsburgh and had it done within 30 days (this was about 10 years ago). They lived in LaChene Qb. My grandfather was the MRI technologist at CVPH since day when until he retired some 15 years ago. I think he would also know how many Canadians come down for simple procedures. But hey, I guess if I don't have one of your cool little links it can't be true because Big Brother Media didn't say so. Again, real life.

    More real life. My son broke his wrist in a tournament in Montreal 2 years ago (PK Suban rink) when he took a slap shot off of the wrist (goalie-sometimes he forgets to catch the puck). We took him to Montreal General to get X-Rays....HOURS....the worse hospital Ive ever been to. And that includes just about every major hospital in NY, Reno Nevada, San Francisco, and Vermont. But sorry, nor expert article, just real life. Maybe it was just "my" experience sure, but seeing how they are rated a 2.5 out of 5 stars....

    Originally posted by net presence View Post
    Also, you do realize that from 1946 thru 1961, the effective tax rate on the 1% and corporations was about 90%. That's right, 90%... And, there weren't nearly as many tax loopholes for the 1% and corporations to avoid paying their fair share. JFK reduced those rates to around 50% in 1961. But things really changed when Ronald Reagan (who I voted for in 1984) was elected in 1980 and enacted "trickle down" economics. For the last 40 years, the 1% and corporations had their effective tax rates reduced to less than 30%. With those loopholes created by the legislators whose campaigns were paid for by those same corporations and the 1%. And yes, some of those were/are Democrats. The bigger picture point being, if we even increased the effective tax rates for the 1% and corporations to 40% -- to include eliminating the tax loopholes and off-shore tax havens -- we'd have enough in the federal coffers to not only have free health care for all, we could also pay for two years of free college or trade school, forgive a certain amount of college debt, actually have the federal government pay the states the agreed upon amount for special education, help the states fund teacher pay so that they make a salary that is commiserate with the importance of their positions in our society, and probably increase the military budget... I recommend you watch the Netflix specials "Capital in the twenty-first century" and, "Saving Capitalism". You just might learn a thing or two...
    I will not argue with ANYONE that the US HealthCare system needs a massive overhaul. Another first hand life example.....

    My uncle is the founder of one of the first mobile ultrasound/x-ray/MRI businesses on the East Coast. He got his degree through the military and went to work at a local hospital in Rochester NY. After being a grunt and arguing with his boss, he picked up and built his own business. He began to challenge the hospital when he exposed the fact they were charging different prices of the SAME procedure based off of your insurance (one of the reasons he left). So he took his talents, bought his own ultrasound machine, loaded it up in his Windstar Minivan and traveled from Rochester, to Albany, to Watertown on a 7 day weekly basis. He now out of his office as his multi-million dollar business has become self sufficient and he doesnt even have to work anymore. He does it to pass the time. He works (here's that word again) FIRST HAND with insurance companies and how they pay/get charged for procedures. He charges a FRACTION of what hospitals charge.

    Medications. (another REAL LIFE story). My mother is one of 7 kidney transplant recipients in my family. Again, we have decent health care (tho Wegmans - yes the grocery store - has better). After our last contract during the Obamacare her medication co-pays nearly doubled (thanks Obamacare). Wait times at our local hospitals ER went from walk-ins to HOURS because every Tom, Dick, and Harry was in there trying to get their high fix or the little scrap they got from falling out of their chair drunk. Yes, REAL LIFE. I would take convicts to the ER all the time with K2 overdoses and see the full ER rooms, when pre-Obamacare the ER's weren't ever that full.

    Do I think any able to work, and working American citizen (sorry you have to be a legal citizen) should be given health care? Yes. Should all children under 17 be afforded health care? Absolutely. Should the crack dealer who just got shot in a drug bust be given free health care? Nope.

    Combine that with the fact doctors/hospitals are getting sued for the dumbest things ever, little to no caps on pharmaceuticals, and crap like the price gouging based off of your insurance type all raises the cost through the roof. I am not going to raise my premiums up to help cover the slug leaching off of the system. And I am not talking about the disabled or those who physically CAN NOT hold a job, even if its McDonalds. Ive been working since day 1 of this pandemic. I've received ZERO aid from the government other than the one stimulus check everyone (even some of my convicts that are doing life) got. Yet I have a fellow co-worker whos wife is making nearly DOUBLE her regular pay when she WAS working thanks to the handouts, and we wonder why some people don't want to go back to work. SOME...I know SOME people the extra money doesnt cover, but for some it not only covers, but adds. Welcome to the USofA....
    Remy Babineaux
    remyb616@gmail.com
    D3FHL Web Page

    Comment


    • Originally posted by MELIN27 View Post
      There's a reason Americans come across the border to Canada to get drugs too. I don't see only seven cases of COVID. Our numbers are much higher than that. Wish it were only seven.
      You're right its not 7...PEI is at 12 right now.... :rollseyes:

      Canada has a 1.2% contraction rate.
      The USA has a 4.9% contraction rate.

      So no, your numbers are not that high.

      Around 0.03% of your population has died from COVID (if you believe the true numbers).
      The USA has a 0.09% death rate.

      I will not argue about the drugs. Wait are we talking the green leafy kind or? The pharmaceutical companies have us by the ...... here in the US. Beyond redonkulous. You wont get an argument with me there.
      Remy Babineaux
      remyb616@gmail.com
      D3FHL Web Page

      Comment


      • Originally posted by PSUChamps2001 View Post

        You're right its not 7...PEI is at 12 right now.... :rollseyes:

        Canada has a 1.2% contraction rate.
        The USA has a 4.9% contraction rate.

        So no, your numbers are not that high.

        Around 0.03% of your population has died from COVID (if you believe the true numbers).
        The USA has a 0.09% death rate.

        I will not argue about the drugs. Wait are we talking the green leafy kind or? The pharmaceutical companies have us by the ...... here in the US. Beyond redonkulous. You wont get an argument with me there.
        Please explain what a "contraction rate" is in this context...

        PEI, a back-water if there ever was one, has had 89 cases, and is trying to slam the door before it becomes South Dakota.

        Gotta love you Scotty Atlas/Stefanik fans. Mensa must be actively recruiting you all.
        Last edited by Fishman'81; 12-13-2020, 12:51 AM.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by PSUChamps2001 View Post

          Seriously? Have your not read (or choose not to) the stories about how hospitals were getting extra money for putting people on ventilators?

          Fact check: Medicare pays hospitals more money for COVID-19 patients (usatoday.com)

          Oh wow what do you know.....

          Florida Man Killed in Crash Listed as COVID-19 Death, Raising Doubts Over Health Data (newsweek.com)

          I could care less what your "experts" say. Does it happen to "some"? Sure? The majority? Not even close. I know of at least a dozen people who have tested positive and are living a normal life post COVID. I know ZERO people who are on their last leg post COVID. I had a relative die of a heart attack but had COVID antibodies so they classified it COVID to get more $$. They're was no freaking "lung scarring" or freaking "post-infection myocarditis". That's not some article, thats real life.



          How did I determine it? Because my doctors told me they were shutting down all non-emergency surgeries at URMC due to the lack of help and increasing number of patients. My nurse in the post-op, as I stated, was just coming back from COVID herself. She normally worked the COVID floor at URMC. When it was brought up in conversation SHE told me first hand how most patients are coming in to the hospital and the slightest hint of breathing problems they admit them. Though they normally don't need anything more than a little O2. Do some still get sick very sick? Yes, they probably would with the common flu too. Again, this isn't out of some magazine, this is real life.



          I too have some very good (for the price) health insurance through my employer. I pay $220 bi-weekly and then $25 co-pays for Doctor visits, $5 and $10 for medications (normally generic), $75 for each hospital trip, $40 for any Ultrasound/X-Ray...and Ill continue to the next part...



          Ah Yes, lets bring the Right Wing, Left Wing, Trumpian, Riding with Biden crap into it....for 1, I disagree 100% with how people vote in the US nor to I agree with anything political because people can't think their own way these days. You're either one way or the other, and you have to be that way. US Politics is trash, period.

          So now that we got that out of the way, you can talk to whom every you want. I have a son of a Canadian on my travel team. His father actually played NHL hockey for years. I also lived 15 minutes from the Canadian/NY border growing up. Talking with Canadians was a lot more than having "numerous" friends. Once again, I had a friend who needed a tonsillectomy. It was a 9 month wait. They paid cash, came down to CVPH in Plattsburgh and had it done within 30 days (this was about 10 years ago). They lived in LaChene Qb. My grandfather was the MRI technologist at CVPH since day when until he retired some 15 years ago. I think he would also know how many Canadians come down for simple procedures. But hey, I guess if I don't have one of your cool little links it can't be true because Big Brother Media didn't say so. Again, real life.

          More real life. My son broke his wrist in a tournament in Montreal 2 years ago (PK Suban rink) when he took a slap shot off of the wrist (goalie-sometimes he forgets to catch the puck). We took him to Montreal General to get X-Rays....HOURS....the worse hospital Ive ever been to. And that includes just about every major hospital in NY, Reno Nevada, San Francisco, and Vermont. But sorry, nor expert article, just real life. Maybe it was just "my" experience sure, but seeing how they are rated a 2.5 out of 5 stars....



          I will not argue with ANYONE that the US HealthCare system needs a massive overhaul. Another first hand life example.....

          My uncle is the founder of one of the first mobile ultrasound/x-ray/MRI businesses on the East Coast. He got his degree through the military and went to work at a local hospital in Rochester NY. After being a grunt and arguing with his boss, he picked up and built his own business. He began to challenge the hospital when he exposed the fact they were charging different prices of the SAME procedure based off of your insurance (one of the reasons he left). So he took his talents, bought his own ultrasound machine, loaded it up in his Windstar Minivan and traveled from Rochester, to Albany, to Watertown on a 7 day weekly basis. He now out of his office as his multi-million dollar business has become self sufficient and he doesnt even have to work anymore. He does it to pass the time. He works (here's that word again) FIRST HAND with insurance companies and how they pay/get charged for procedures. He charges a FRACTION of what hospitals charge.

          Medications. (another REAL LIFE story). My mother is one of 7 kidney transplant recipients in my family. Again, we have decent health care (tho Wegmans - yes the grocery store - has better). After our last contract during the Obamacare her medication co-pays nearly doubled (thanks Obamacare). Wait times at our local hospitals ER went from walk-ins to HOURS because every Tom, Dick, and Harry was in there trying to get their high fix or the little scrap they got from falling out of their chair drunk. Yes, REAL LIFE. I would take convicts to the ER all the time with K2 overdoses and see the full ER rooms, when pre-Obamacare the ER's weren't ever that full.

          Do I think any able to work, and working American citizen (sorry you have to be a legal citizen) should be given health care? Yes. Should all children under 17 be afforded health care? Absolutely. Should the crack dealer who just got shot in a drug bust be given free health care? Nope.

          Combine that with the fact doctors/hospitals are getting sued for the dumbest things ever, little to no caps on pharmaceuticals, and crap like the price gouging based off of your insurance type all raises the cost through the roof. I am not going to raise my premiums up to help cover the slug leaching off of the system. And I am not talking about the disabled or those who physically CAN NOT hold a job, even if its McDonalds. Ive been working since day 1 of this pandemic. I've received ZERO aid from the government other than the one stimulus check everyone (even some of my convicts that are doing life) got. Yet I have a fellow co-worker whos wife is making nearly DOUBLE her regular pay when she WAS working thanks to the handouts, and we wonder why some people don't want to go back to work. SOME...I know SOME people the extra money doesnt cover, but for some it not only covers, but adds. Welcome to the USofA....

          PSUChamps.... No B.S., an obviously detailed and well-intentioned post with some things we both agree on. We agree health care should be a right for all of our citizens. Although, I would also add asylum seekers and legal aliens here with appropriate work visas as well. We also agree about the unethical differences in charges for procedures based on what insurance you have (or don't), along with way the pharmaceutical industry has taken advantage of our system. Trust me, my family has significant monthly prescription costs as well. My oldest boy has Crohn's disease and has to take a Humera shot twice a month at about $1,200 per shot. My daughter has significant anxiety and depression issues that require numerous prescriptions as well. And, my wife and I each have 5 or 6 medications we'll be on for the foreseeable future. My question to you is, if single-payer health care isn't the solution, then please explain what is. Because most people with any experience and/or expertise within the medical/insurance industries don't believe a legitimate solution exists within the current system.

          Next, just curious, if you and I aren't willing to pay for the crack dealer who just got shot in the drug bust, who do you think will pay for it. Because he sure as hell isn't paying for it. Especially if he ends up behind bars. And yes, those unpaid costs still ultimately get passed on to those of us that do have insurance and do pay our bills. Of course, I would argue that goes back to my points on fair and appropriate taxation on corporations and the 1%. Again, if we raise the effective tax rates to 40% or higher, raise capital gains taxes to the same as the median tax rate for the middle class, AND enact laws that prevent off-shoring of significant monies to avoid paying those taxes, the federal government would have more than enough monies to pay hospitals to cover the costs of their unpaid services. Finally, I'm sorry but I've spent my fair amount of time in our local ERs the last 10 years and our wait times aren't significantly different than they were pre-Obamacare. Was that legislation perfect? Far from it. But, it was a start. I also didn't see my premiums go up nearly as much as you apparently did during the same time frame. Those are my real life experiences. The question is then, whose "real life" experiences are the ones we should judge these societal issues by? That's why I tend to trust the actual experts in the various fields involved in our differences of opinion and why I believe if one is going to have a strong opinion either way, you ought to be able to provide legitimate supporting evidence from legitimate sources on the topic involved.

          In regards to your attempt to support your initial claim that doctors are intentionally listing non-Covid deaths as Covid in order for them and/or their hospitals to make more money. I agree that if the actual crash was determined to have been what caused the motorcyclist to die, his death shouldn't have been initially listed as Covid for the cause. Of course, if you read the entire article, toward the end it's stated that the final cause of death is determined by the coroner. Insinuating that the true cause was changed prior to the final paperwork being submitted.

          Regardless, let's say it wasn't. First, how can you definitively say that the attending physician's reason for listing Covid as the cause of death was nefarious? Maybe, just maybe, it was an honest mistake. And, even if it wasn't an honest mistake and the physician did do it maliciously, that's one example out of a possible 300,000 deaths... I appreciate your effort but, hopefully even you would admit that that one (possible...not proven definitively but, possible) situation isn't proof of some widespread conspiracy to line individual doctors or hospitals' pockets.

          To your link that shows that Medicare pays hospitals more for Covid patients -- whether they live or die. My contention wasn't that they didn't receive more money for Covid patients. My contention was that your assertion that there is some wide-ranging conspiracy of doctors/hospitals listing Covid as the cause of death when it wasn't, thus leading to some massive overcount of Covid deaths nationally is simply not the case and the facts prove that.

          Cudos to your uncle and his success in building his own business. I spent 23 years in the military myself and ran my own small business for 15 years before I closed it up to be at home more during the week so my wife could take a promotion to a district manager in her company that would force her to travel overnight during the week. No offense, as I take you at your word the various experiences that you and/or your family members or friends have experienced are true. However, those individual situations don't prove that 10-15% of people who test positive for Covid aren't developing post-infection myocarditis or lung scarring. If it wasn't an actual issue/concern, why is almost every Power 5 conference requiring a cardiac MRI and lung scan prior to being cleared to play?

          I'm glad you've been able to continue to work during the pandemic. In our case, our son's Crohn's disease, along with my daughter's asthma, puts them at higher risk of severe symptoms if they become infected. Thankfully, my wife's employer has allowed her to work primarily from home the entire pandemic. Unfortunately, I'm an independent contractor who hasn't been able to return to work until very recently as the pandemic had put my job on hold since things were first paused last March. Not going to lie, it's been awfully nice to be able to collect unemployment since April. Still, if the feds don't get another relief bill passed before the current situation expires after Christmas, and I'm unable to work as much as I usually would after that date, things will get challenging.

          Comment


          • Hospitals inflating numbers for $. I guess some of the mid-west and southern hospitals and doctors were late to the party? They only started inflating their numbers after watching hospitals in the "hot zones" inflate theirs for months. Is this an indictment of for profit medical care?

            I am not familiar with the U.S. medical system beyond buying my kid student coverage. What happens when you retire if you don't have a pension package with your employer?(presume some pensions include it?) Do you have to pay for your coverage? What if you're not that healthy?

            Comment





            • Originally posted by net presence View Post


              PSUChamps.... No B.S., an obviously detailed and well-intentioned post with some things we both agree on. We agree health care should be a right for all of our citizens. Although, I would also add asylum seekers and legal aliens here with appropriate work visas as well. We also agree about the unethical differences in charges for procedures based on what insurance you have (or don't), along with way the pharmaceutical industry has taken advantage of our system. Trust me, my family has significant monthly prescription costs as well. My oldest boy has Crohn's disease and has to take a Humera shot twice a month at about $1,200 per shot. My daughter has significant anxiety and depression issues that require numerous prescriptions as well. And, my wife and I each have 5 or 6 medications we'll be on for the foreseeable future. My question to you is, if single-payer health care isn't the solution, then please explain what is. Because most people with any experience and/or expertise within the medical/insurance industries don't believe a legitimate solution exists within the current system.
              Nothing short of a total overhaul needs to be done for the entire. The Abbavie CEO makes 21.1 MILLION dollars. They are worth 33.27 BILLION in just 7 years. So while you are paying $1,200 per shot, these people are soaking in the sun. After my transplant I will be taking nearly $200 in meds (in co-pays) for the rest of my life. Antirejection drugs are MUCH cheaper in Canada I'm guessing because the Canadian GOVT has put restrictions on what pharmaceuticals can charge. My son has both ADHD (for 8 years now) and was just diagnosed with anxiety/depression. I am very content paying my $220 bi-weekly family plan, and $5/$10 co-pays on medications. Our last contract, due to Obamacare, our premiums went up nearly 35%. If it continued, it would have went up even more.

              Originally posted by net presence View Post
              Next, just curious, if you and I aren't willing to pay for the crack dealer who just got shot in the drug bust, who do you think will pay for it. Because he sure as hell isn't paying for it. Especially if he ends up behind bars. And yes, those unpaid costs still ultimately get passed on to those of us that do have insurance and do pay our bills. Of course, I would argue that goes back to my points on fair and appropriate taxation on corporations and the 1%. Again, if we raise the effective tax rates to 40% or higher, raise capital gains taxes to the same as the median tax rate for the middle class, AND enact laws that prevent off-shoring of significant monies to avoid paying those taxes, the federal government would have more than enough monies to pay hospitals to cover the costs of their unpaid services. Finally, I'm sorry but I've spent my fair amount of time in our local ERs the last 10 years and our wait times aren't significantly different than they were pre-Obamacare. Was that legislation perfect? Far from it. But, it was a start. I also didn't see my premiums go up nearly as much as you apparently did during the same time frame. Those are my real life experiences. The question is then, whose "real life" experiences are the ones we should judge these societal issues by? That's why I tend to trust the actual experts in the various fields involved in our differences of opinion and why I believe if one is going to have a strong opinion either way, you ought to be able to provide legitimate supporting evidence from legitimate sources on the topic involved.


              What do we do for the crack dealer? You wont like my answer. Sew it up yourself. And ah yes, the "behind bars" comment as always. That's a whole different conversation. Convicts get better care than the 65 year old retired military vet who worked their whole life. I've taken an inmate to URMC for a lung transplant, while the little girl who's been waiting for years got passed over. I see inmates take all types of medications 3 times a day, free of charge, while the mom who is working 3 jobs to pay for her sons medication still struggles. We send inmates to Ithaca (CMC) all the time on emergency trips for being constipated. Yes, thats correct. Cant poop, call the ambulance (at $1,500 a trip just for the ride) to be told you're constipated. I've taken convicts to CMC when they've stuck pencils and forks up their *eggplant emoji* . Swallowed items and had to have them surgically removed....and thats not even counting all the K2 overdoses.

              Maybe you live in some backwoods rural area where there are no major cities, but all cities saw a major increase in ER times after Obamacare.

              Long Wait Times in California ERs Blamed on Obamacare | Newsmax.com
              Editorial: Obamacare boosts ER patients, wait times – Orange County Register (ocregister.com)
              Barack Obama (washingtonexaminer.com)

              There's three of your wonderful articles for you....

              Originally posted by net presence View Post
              In regards to your attempt to support your initial claim that doctors are intentionally listing non-Covid deaths as Covid in order for them and/or their hospitals to make more money. I agree that if the actual crash was determined to have been what caused the motorcyclist to die, his death shouldn't have been initially listed as Covid for the cause. Of course, if you read the entire article, toward the end it's stated that the final cause of death is determined by the coroner. Insinuating that the true cause was changed prior to the final paperwork being submitted.


              Who does the county coroner work for? Hmm thats right. The government. But again, you keep thinking there's no coloration between the two.


              Originally posted by net presence View Post
              Regardless, let's say it wasn't. First, how can you definitively say that the attending physician's reason for listing Covid as the cause of death was nefarious? Maybe, just maybe, it was an honest mistake. And, even if it wasn't an honest mistake and the physician did do it maliciously, that's one example out of a possible 300,000 deaths... I appreciate your effort but, hopefully even you would admit that that one (possible...not proven definitively but, possible) situation isn't proof of some widespread conspiracy to line individual doctors or hospitals' pockets.


              How? We had a co-worker who lives here in NY (mind you my family member that passed was in Louisiana). Same thing. Died of COVID on his death certificate, but had a stroke. There are examples all over the US. Again, sure SOME people do get sick from COVID and unfortunately do pass due to the breathing issues ect. Those SAME people would have been in the similar, if not the same boat, if they got the common flu.

              Originally posted by net presence View Post
              your link that shows that Medicare pays hospitals more for Covid patients -- whether they live or die. My contention wasn't that they didn't receive more money for Covid patients. My contention was that your assertion that there is some wide-ranging conspiracy of doctors/hospitals listing Covid as the cause of death when it wasn't, thus leading to some massive overcount of Covid deaths nationally is simply not the case and the facts prove that.


              Heres another REAL LIFE story for you. Elmira Correctional Facility had an outbreak of nearly 600 positive cases when they tested their inmates. 14...FOURTEEN..of those 600 positive cases were symptomatic. 1 has cancer, 1 is on dialysis, 1 is type 1 diabetic, and the rest had no major underlying conditions. Again, FOURTEEN of those 600 were symptomatic. Do you think NYS paid to have them retested? No. Another funny twist to the plot. All tests were mailed to our Department of Corrections Academy building. Here in NY the Governor places your region/area into color zones (where you are restricted on movement, dining, hair salons, ect). Due to the increase in the COVID positives at Elmira CF, that region was put on lock down. NO inmate is RETESTED once they say they are positive (because rapid tests are so accurate). So you want me to believe the numbers?

              Originally posted by net presence View Post
              Cudos to your uncle and his success in building his own business. I spent 23 years in the military myself and ran my own small business for 15 years before I closed it up to be at home more during the week so my wife could take a promotion to a district manager in her company that would force her to travel overnight during the week. No offense, as I take you at your word the various experiences that you and/or your family members or friends have experienced are true. However, those individual situations don't prove that 10-15% of people who test positive for Covid aren't developing post-infection myocarditis or lung scarring. If it wasn't an actual issue/concern, why is almost every Power 5 conference requiring a cardiac MRI and lung scan prior to being cleared to play?
              Ah yes the infamous infection myocarditis, the same infamous infection that can be caused by the common strep throat, staff infection, yeast infections, Hepatitis, Herpes (cold sores), oh and even better ANTIBIOTICS like penicillin. Your right, only COVID could have caused people to come down with that disease. There is NO way someone could have had it already because of all those other rare things I listed right? Remember when COVID first came out. Symptoms, FEVER. Then it was FEVER, COUGH. Then it was FEVER, COUGH, BODY ACHE. Then it was FEVER, COUGH, BODY ACHE, SORE THROAT. Then it was FEVER, COUGH, BODY ACHE, SORE THROAT, VOMITING. There are so many darn "symptoms" now, basically if you're breathing you could have COVID. NCAA Florida Basketball player Keyontae Johnson just collapsed yesterday during his game. He had COVID over the summer. I guess COVID must have been the cause of him collapsing too right? I mean thats already what they are going with. Not just COVID, but much of America would be shocked if they had an overall body scan every year. Hell my last live donor just found out himself that his kidneys aren't at 100% and thus can not donate. He would have had NO clue if he hadn't taken the blood test for me. So no, I don't believe all these cases are ONLY COVID related when it comes to the myocarditis or lung scarring.

              Originally posted by net presence View Post
              I'm glad you've been able to continue to work during the pandemic. In our case, our son's Crohn's disease, along with my daughter's asthma, puts them at higher risk of severe symptoms if they become infected. Thankfully, my wife's employer has allowed her to work primarily from home the entire pandemic. Unfortunately, I'm an independent contractor who hasn't been able to return to work until very recently as the pandemic had put my job on hold since things were first paused last March. Not going to lie, it's been awfully nice to be able to collect unemployment since April. Still, if the feds don't get another relief bill passed before the current situation expires after Christmas, and I'm unable to work as much as I usually would after that date, things will get challenging.
              I mean cool you get to stay home and protect your family I guess, but you wont get sympathy from me there. My son too has asthma, and my oldest had pnemonia 3 years ago and struggles when she comes down with the smallest of respiratory infections. And then you have me. Stage 5 End Stage Renal Disease, Type 2 Diabetic (thanks to my kidneys working at 10% total). Three major surgeries since July. Bloodwork bi-weekly. I could choose to stop working, but Im not.

              Youre right, I am grateful to still be working through the pandemic, yet several dozen co-workers (civilian side) were paid FULL pay on taxpayers dollars to stay home as they were deemed non-essential. And you wont like this answer either (but you'll get use to the fact I dont ever really care what people think), but yes it sucks you're out of the work you WANT to do, and while this doesnt work for all Americans as some people live in the sticks (literally), McDonalds is always hiring. Walmart needs people all the time. Lowes, Home Depot (ask Fish jk). Now having said that, that doesnt mean you shouldn't receive aid, and you seem to have a decent head on your shoulders and not trying to "work the system". Point is there are A LOT more people "working/living" off of the system then honest educated working people like yourself.
              Remy Babineaux
              remyb616@gmail.com
              D3FHL Web Page

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              • Originally posted by MELIN27 View Post
                Hospitals inflating numbers for $. I guess some of the mid-west and southern hospitals and doctors were late to the party? They only started inflating their numbers after watching hospitals in the "hot zones" inflate theirs for months. Is this an indictment of for profit medical care?
                Yea I will go with that.

                Originally posted by MELIN27 View Post
                I am not familiar with the U.S. medical system beyond buying my kid student coverage. What happens when you retire if you don't have a pension package with your employer?(presume some pensions include it?) Do you have to pay for your coverage? What if you're not that healthy?
                You can buy COBRA coverage. My pension does not include medical. I still have to pay for it. I can cash in unused sick time/vacation time at the end of my 25 years and put it towards medical until you reach 62. Mind you you can technically retire at 46 years of age. That leaves a large gap that needs to be paid for. This is just for NYS employees. Not sure how other states work.

                Again, believe me you will get no argument that the US System needs a maassive overhaul. Unfortunately any type of Obamacare (Socialistic Health Care) systems are nothing more than a band aid on an open wound. I would LOVE to see every deserving American covered with out Insurance Comp raising premiums through the roof. Again, I will not be for raising my premiums to help the slug living off the system get the SAME medical coverage as I get. Call me racist, call me unAmerican, dont care. I work with system abusers every day behind the walls. The stuff these people get boggles my mind. The mom who's crying for Christmas money because she just went and bought herself a $400 tatoo and $400 in junk food on her snap card. Again, a different discussion.
                Remy Babineaux
                remyb616@gmail.com
                D3FHL Web Page

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                • Originally posted by Fishman'81 View Post

                  Isn't 7th grade back in session in Green Bay yet..?
                  Actually, H. Steve, seventh grade behavior is ad hominem attacks. Maybe one of these days you will answer the questions at hand.

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                  • Originally posted by Sir Nubs View Post

                    Actually, H. Steve, seventh grade behavior is ad hominem attacks. Maybe one of these days you will answer the questions at hand.
                    You're right: it was unfair to the 7th grade girls to compare them to you. I'm going with 4th grade now, or maybe 3rd.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by net presence View Post


                      First, the number of available hospital beds in a particular region is not the issue. It's far more about the reality that the significant increase in community spread is significantly affecting the availability of nurses, doctors, and other medical personnel to care for all of the various issues at a hospital.

                      Obviously, everyone individual person's physiology is unique. And, that determines how each person's body reacts to becoming infected. Please provide your specific suggestions on how mayors and governors should respond in a different way, not using "blanket solutions", that take into account how literally every individual's body reacts in it's own, unique way.

                      Actually, if you want your opinion to be considered seriously, you actually do need to provide supporting information. And, since this is a medical topic, that supporting info should/needs to be from legitimate science/medical sources. I'm sorry but, in the real world we don't agree with the assertion that the entire media industry is now no longer publishing any news, but rather is simply providing their personal opinions. Also, considering the topic at hand, there are plenty of articles/papers that are actually written by the doctors/scientists who did the research, and not by a "media person with some sort of bias". So yeah, I'm going to continue to insist that if you want to be taken seriously, you need to provide supporting evidence.

                      Believe me, I admit I'm wrong FAR more often in these forums than anyone who appears to be on the opposite sides of the issues I'm debating/arguing about. Finally, if you pass actual laws that prevent corporations and the 1% from moving that money to off-shore tax havens and, actually enforce those laws, those people/corporations wouldn't be able to get away with it now would they? The problem is, the people paying for the campaigns of the majority of our elected representatives are the ones benefiting from the laws (or lack thereof) that allow those same individuals/corporations to get away with not paying their fair share/required taxes. The point is, it's a very solvable problem.
                      I am in no way suggesting I have a better idea than the blanket solution. I am only as smart as I am.

                      I don't bother to provide support because as with my facts about numbers of beds here in Maryland, anything I provide is dismissed when it does not support the oppositions narrative.

                      These people did not become rich by accident. They will find the loop holes no matter what laws are passed. Which will leaves us right where we are right now. On this subject I actually have a solution for lack of funds. The United States gives away money to countries it has no business giving the money to. Back in 2017 the US gave away over a Billion dollars to Kenya and Ethiopia. Hundreds of millions to South Sudan, Nigeria, Uganda, Tanzania, Yemen, Mozambique and Congo. Now while being nice is fine none of those countries have a direct effect on the United States. Not giving that money away would have billions available do do many different thing here in this country.
                      The Titanic only had one Captain..........
                      "You're holding your mouth wrong." Jim Cole
                      "Don't take any wooden nickels." Ray Rouse
                      9 Time World Champion Boston Red Sox ('03,'12,'15,'16,'18,2004, '07, '13, '18)

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                      • Originally posted by Fishman'81 View Post

                        You're right: it was unfair to the 7th grade girls to compare them to you. I'm going with 4th grade now, or maybe 3rd.
                        Just keep deflecting with ad hominem and not directly answer and it becomes more and more obvious to everyone here.

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                        • And now back to you regularly scheduled program ;-)))............I've been trolling the D1 threads,better than nothing.......as you were.....

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                          • I would love for there to be some REAL DIII hockey to talk about. :-)
                            The Titanic only had one Captain..........
                            "You're holding your mouth wrong." Jim Cole
                            "Don't take any wooden nickels." Ray Rouse
                            9 Time World Champion Boston Red Sox ('03,'12,'15,'16,'18,2004, '07, '13, '18)

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by sacole13 View Post
                              I would love for there to be some REAL DIII hockey to talk about. :-)
                              Any more Trine vs. Adrian analysis? If not, what else would there be to talk about?
                              Steve
                              Penn State Class of '95
                              Plattsburgh State Class of '99

                              If corn oil is made from corn, and vegetable oil is made from vegetables, then what is baby oil made from?

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                              • WIAC is coming back.......................... https://www.uscho.com/2020/12/15/wia...on-feb-1-2021/

                                The Titanic only had one Captain..........
                                "You're holding your mouth wrong." Jim Cole
                                "Don't take any wooden nickels." Ray Rouse
                                9 Time World Champion Boston Red Sox ('03,'12,'15,'16,'18,2004, '07, '13, '18)

                                Comment

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