Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

[yooper(UP) hockey]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

I'm really intrigued to see what kind of interlocking the B1GHC, WCHA and CCHA have in mind...

If the WCHA holds firm on saying play all of us or none of us...I would think that would result in each WCHA playing Minny or Wisco 4 out of 5 season in a two game series...that gives the B1GTWO 8 games a season against the WCHA.

If the CCHA had a similar arrangement with the 4 remaining big ten schools, they could get a series against 1 of the four every season rotating...not sure how much the smaller schools would really want to go to PSU but who knows?

How does this work when University of Alabama Huntsville joins the CCHA? Michigan, MSU and OSU play UAH

[aparch]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

How does this work when University of Alabama Huntsville joins the CCHA? Michigan, MSU and OSU play UAH

Does UAH join the CCHA before or after ND and Miami bail?

[fangers]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

My personal opinion about OSU hockey is that the hockey dollar in Columbus is stupendously diluted by the presence of the Bluejackets.

I submit that if Omaha had a NHL team, that UNO would have the same issues OSU does. It's also worth mentioning here that the Omaha metro is about 100,000 people bigger than the Columbus metro as well.

OSU plays in one of the few college hockey arenas bigger than ours and they average 3829 per home date.

The Bluejackets are currently averaging, in the same city, in the same arena, 13,278 per game.!!!!

If this doesn't buttress my argument here, nothing would. That said, I don't know what OSU did, attendance-wise, prior to the Bluejackets. But, I'd sure like to see what affect the Bluejackets being gonzo would have on OSU attendance, now. I sincerely doubt that the BTHC thing changes the fortunes of war for them at all. Probably Penn State, if ably lead, should surpass them in short order.

What I am talking about here is why I see UNO as a sleeping giant that is being awakened. It's the 4rd largest metro area in the country after Minneapolis, Boston, and Denver with college hockey and UNO plays in the 2nd largest arena (destined to change) in the nation at 16,680, and, unlike OSU, UNO has had tons of crowds north of 10,000 because, in the winter time, the only thing they are competing with around here is Creighton Basketball. And, UNO hockey will win a national Championship (or even multiple championships) before either Creighton or UNL ever win a g****** thing, if ever, in basketball. Neither have ever won a thing and never will. The smart fans around here recognize this and have been willing to, and, will rally around the UNO flag. I can and have seen it happening. The local media coverage of UNO hockey around here by television and the paper now is at an all time high.

I don't think who OSU plays will affect anything since Columbus is a "Major League" sports town and fans will vote that way every time with their sports dollar, given the chance. I don't think the Big 10 understands college hockey culture at all.

Your logic is flawed on several points.

#1 - OSU and the Blue Jackets do not play at the same arena.

#2 - There is very little overlap between the current OSU and the Blue Jackets fan bases, so I don't think the Blue Jackets really hurt them significantly. OSU students are regular Blue Jacket fans. OSU has an on-campus facility yet draws very few students (out of 40,000 plus student), and they need to do a better job of getting more of those students in the building. They do very well vs. Michigan, and I think that they would expect to get better numbers now that they playin other Big 10 schools and competing for Big 10 title. But they school needs to market hockey better.

[fangers]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

Does UAH join the CCHA before or after ND and Miami bail?

Don't think it matters to UAH because without getting in a conference doubt they continue at DI.

[Tipsy McStagger]

It will be to accommodate the Big Ten's need to have four teams always in the NCAA tourney. For example, the .500 rule will go bye, bye.

Are you serious? Please tell me you aren't serious.

[yooper(UP) hockey]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

Does UAH join the CCHA before or after ND and Miami bail?

Either way the CCHA is going to be along way from being a top notch confrence in two years from now.

[MichFan]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

Ohio State has the most to gain from the BTHC. They SHOULD be able to get better recruits which should lead to more wins at the expense of Michigan, Minnesota and Wisconsin.

I couldn't disagree more. Ohio State is the most screwed by this.

The bottom line is that Ohio is not a hockey state and doesn't have a ton of local talent as a natural recruiting base. Not only will Ohio State always trail Michigan, Michigan State, Minnesota, and Wisconsin in that regard, but they will also trail Penn State. Pittsburgh and Philadelphia are legit hockey towns with longstanding fan bases. Can you say that for Columbus? You certainly can't say it for Cleveland or Cincinnati.

And no, this isn't an anti-Ohio rant by a Michigan fan. I have nephews in Columbus who played AA hockey. I know what the scene is like there. Even if kids touch hockey in the first place, a lot of the good ones leave when they get older because they're pushed towards "real" sports (in the local mind) like football or basketball.

The worst natural recruiting base means that Ohio State will likely be a perennial cellar dweller in the Big Ten. Sure, some kids might be willing to play hockey at Ohio State just to play in the Big Ten...just like some kids are willing to play football at Indiana just to play in the Big Ten. And the results will be the same: finishing mid-conference once every ten years will be an achievement. At least in the CCHA, Ohio State could expect to finish middle of the pack every year.

If you're from Michigan and want to play in the Big Ten and you're good enough, you're going to Michigan or Michigan State. If you're from Minnesota and want to play in the Big Ten and you're good enough, you're going to Minnesota or Wisconsin. Ohio State will get the leftovers, at best. It's as simple as that.

Yes, it will help them at the gate. More games against Big Ten teams with recognized names equals more casual fans in the seats equals more money. But Ohio State already has tons of money. More athletic money than any other school except Texas, as a matter of fact. If throwing money at a problem would make Ohio State better at hockey, they would have done it long ago. I'm sure that the athletic department is thrilled about being in a BTHC because they will have more revenue to offset expenses, but it won't make a beans of difference on the ice.

[Gurtholfin]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

I couldn't disagree more. Ohio State is the most screwed by this.

The bottom line is that Ohio is not a hockey state and doesn't have a ton of local talent as a natural recruiting base. Not only will Ohio State always trail Michigan, Michigan State, Minnesota, and Wisconsin in that regard, but they will also trail Penn State. Pittsburgh and Philadelphia are legit hockey towns with longstanding fan bases. Can you say that for Columbus? You certainly can't say it for Cleveland or Cincinnati.

And no, this isn't an anti-Ohio rant by a Michigan fan. I have nephews in Columbus who played AA hockey. I know what the scene is like there. Even if kids touch hockey in the first place, a lot of the good ones leave when they get older because they're pushed towards "real" sports (in the local mind) like football or basketball.

The worst natural recruiting base means that Ohio State will likely be a perennial cellar dweller in the Big Ten. Sure, some kids might be willing to play hockey at Ohio State just to play in the Big Ten...just like some kids are willing to play football at Indiana just to play in the Big Ten. And the results will be the same: finishing mid-conference once every ten years will be an achievement. At least in the CCHA, Ohio State could expect to finish middle of the pack every year.

If you're from Michigan and want to play in the Big Ten and you're good enough, you're going to Michigan or Michigan State. If you're from Minnesota and want to play in the Big Ten and you're good enough, you're going to Minnesota or Wisconsin. Ohio State will get the leftovers, at best. It's as simple as that.

Yes, it will help them at the gate. More games against Big Ten teams with recognized names equals more casual fans in the seats equals more money. But Ohio State already has tons of money. More athletic money than any other school except Texas, as a matter of fact. If throwing money at a problem would make Ohio State better at hockey, they would have done it long ago. I'm sure that the athletic department is thrilled about being in a BTHC because they will have more revenue to offset expenses, but it won't make a beans of difference on the ice.

One caveat to this is that Coach Oz has good connections for recruiting in Western Canada. There's no reason to think that their recruits need to come from Minnesota or Michigan.

He also has a proven track record of getting kids ready for the next level, especially defensemen.

Finally, not sure how easy it is to get the BTN in Moose Jaw, but if it can be gotten, that allows those kids to be seen back home.

I got to know Mark a bit while he was here in Madison and I wouldn't bet against him. Very focused guy to say the least.

[HarleyMC]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

One caveat to this is that Coach Oz has good connections for recruiting in Western Canada. There's no reason to think that their recruits need to come from Minnesota or Michigan.

He also has a proven track record of getting kids ready for the next level, especially defensemen.

Finally, not sure how easy it is to get the BTN in Moose Jaw, but if it can be gotten, that allows those kids to be seen back home.

I got to know Mark a bit while he was here in Madison and I wouldn't bet against him. Very focused guy to say the least.

In September 2008 the Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission officially approved a request by Shaw Communications to allow carriage of the Big Ten Network in Canada on digital cable television which includes service to British Columbia and Alberta, with smaller systems in Saskatchewan (Moose Jaw), Manitoba, Northwestern Ontario and Hamilton, Ontario.

EDIT: BTN also became available on Rogers Communications in Ontario and New Brunswick in 2009 and Cogeco Cable last year.

[Fighting Sioux 23]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

What I am talking about here is why I see UNO as a sleeping giant that is being awakened. It's the 4rd largest metro area in the country after Minneapolis, Boston, and Denver with college hockey

Not so fast...

Albany (RPI, Union), Rochester (RIT), Buffalo (Niagara), Providence (Providence), Columbus (Ohio State), and Pittsburgh (Robert Morris) are all bigger metro areas than Omaha. That isn't even including Detroit.

One caveat to this is that Coach Oz has good connections for recruiting in Western Canada. There's no reason to think that their recruits need to come from Minnesota or Michigan.

He also has a proven track record of getting kids ready for the next level, especially defensemen.

Finally, not sure how easy it is to get the BTN in Moose Jaw, but if it can be gotten, that allows those kids to be seen back home.

I got to know Mark a bit while he was here in Madison and I wouldn't bet against him. Very focused guy to say the least.

Exactly. As I've said before, Minnesota, Michigan and Wisconsin are going to get the same kids that they always got. Where the BTHC will help Ohio State is that kids that may have chosen to go to Duluth or Miami before, may now choose Ohio State. Plus having a coach with solid recruiting connections into Canada will be enormous.

Again, I'm not saying Ohio State will definitely be a power. They have to invest and recruit wisely and be a smart program, but the Big Ten will allow them the resources to do this. That is why they have the most to gain, not that they will definitely gain the most.

Given that, if I were a Michigan, Minnesota or Wisconsin fan, I would be hoping with all hope that they don't. They need doormats, or they will get beat up within their league and you'll only see 1 or 2 Big Ten schools in the NCAA Tournament on a yearly basis. Ohio State's potential success equals Michigan or Minnesota or Wisconsin's potential mediocrity. The same could be said for Penn State. That's why, at least IMO, Michigan, Minnesota, Michigan State and Wisconsin have the most to lose w/the BTHC. They were doing fine in their own conferences. We'll see what happens in the B1G.

[I Want Shegos]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

While I agree that Ohio State will be behind those other Big 10 schools, I think being in that conference could tip some of those prospects who would go to the middle of the road CCHA schools to choose Ohio State instead.

[Craig P.]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

People here that think schools with big rinks will only come to Alaska to play every 4 years are fooling themselves. The exempt games the program receives means playing two additional home games. $$$$$ ...

Or they could just play the two home games and not pay the costs to travel to Alaska.

[Craig P.]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

Yes, this is consistent with NCAA rules in other sports for traveling to Hawaii and Alaska. In football, any school that travels to Hawaii is allowed to schedule 13 games for that season (instead of the usual 12). Basketball has a similar exemption. Whether or not you're in the same conference as the school in Hawaii or Alaska is irrelevant - if you travel there, you get the exemption.

If you travel there and play a team from there. If you go there for a tournament, you only get a tournament exemption when you're playing other teams—something that bit Merrimack in the *** a few years back (where they were only able to exempt one of their two games in Alaska because they'd already used their once-in-four-years exemption and had to cancel a game IIRC with Michigan).

[SoCalSiouxFan]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

That's why, at least IMO, Michigan, Minnesota, Michigan State and Wisconsin have the most to lose w/the BTHC. They were doing fine in their own conferences. We'll see what happens in the B1G.

With Lucia's contract extention, Minnesota will be doing fine for years to come.

I understand your point. The recent decline in interest and in ticket sales for Gopher hockey can be attrubuted to the UM not any fault of the WCHA. Unless being too good for UM can be considered a WCHA fault.

[Craig P.]

Re: Big Ten Hockey Conference Pt II - The Exodus

The largest portion for the current RPI is opponents opponents Winning%

Having the largest multiplier doesn't make a particular component make the largest contribution. You have to look at the degree of variation in that component in conjunction with the multiplier to determine which (if any) is the most significant.