Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

UMaine Offseason...Belly Up to the Barr Boys

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #91
    Originally posted by Drew S. View Post

    I wish I shared your optimism. I think recruiting is going to have to improve significantly for Maine to even stay where they are. Barr has done a good job coaching but his recruiting has been very disappointing.
    Yes recruiting needs to get better by alot but there are pieces of the puzzle that yet need to come together, not all in Barr's control.
    Im still cautiously optimistic, but no immediate fantasy of making the frozen four again.

    Comment


    • #92
      Thank You for the feedback and a better understanding. I am glad they are recruiting better and building and not using the portal as a quick fix which is not a remedy for smaller schools. excited to see these younger player develop and build over the upcoming years

      Comment


      • #93
        Originally posted by NorthMike View Post

        Not everyone here jumps on posters, some do for whatever odd reason. Civility is another thing sliding away with our culture.

        Imo the situation here has improved from coaching, Barr notably improved locker room culture, player skills, player conditioning, brought the style of play more in line with how other successful programs play. Fans noticed all this and there was an uptick this year in fan enthusiasm.

        The need for more skilled players in the roster is definite. This will take a while, a couple of top BCHL players, brothers from NB, will help but arent the full solution by a long shot. Several of Barrs recruits so far have been excellent, this is an encouraging sign for the future of his ability to recruit here. His players have improved defense in a big way as compared to the last several years. So the future looks brighter but I still say we need to wait until Barr year 4 or 5.
        The alfond player facility improvements are absolutely necessary for the future of recruiting. How far off is this - unknown right now.

        Having said all this the biggest downside/challenge we are going to continue facing, and may never get a leg over on is having enough funding to sustain a hockey program fans here would like to see again. Hard to do on the cheap and it seems the gap is widening around D1. I say that without any real data other than what can be seen for coach salaries throughout.
        This site is very civil compared to this place back when Walsh was the coach. Way more fun back then.

        Student population is dropping like a rock in Orono, has been for a couple years. If it keeps up Orono will be a ghost town.



        I swear there ain't no heaven but I pray there ain't no hell.

        Maine Hockey Love it or Leave it

        Comment


        • #94
          Originally posted by walrus View Post

          Student population is dropping like a rock in Orono, has been for a couple years. If it keeps up Orono will be a ghost town.


          Not just us, nationally enrollment in college has been declining. Its going to depend on how the umaine system responds. With the collection of small campuses it leaves Orono vulnerable.
          Sports at Orono could be looked at by the Board as a liability or essential to the growth of Orono. It comes down to that I suppose.

          Comment


          • #95
            Originally posted by NorthMike View Post

            Yes recruiting needs to get better by alot but there are pieces of the puzzle that yet need to come together, not all in Barr's control.
            Im still cautiously optimistic, but no immediate fantasy of making the frozen four again.
            I agree with this, I think we also have to qualify it by saying that recruiting is improving and has already improved from the last 10 years. The defense is a testament to that.

            Maine has the potential to be very good next year, beyond that is anyone’s guess. Are there enough high end scorers committed to maine right now? Probably not but the average recruit coming in has been better and the coaching has improved.

            I’ve seen a lot of talk similar to this on the Lowell thread, they are happy with the job Bazin is doing coaching the team but are concerned with the lack of scorers. I think it is also a sign of the times, high end draft picks are not picking hockey East schools outside of Boston. For Maine to be competitive it is going to be on the backs of overlooked 4 year guys which I think Maine is landing (Freel, Holt, Breazeale)

            Comment


            • #96
              Back when Maine was a national power, written in ink Final Four participant year-in-year-out, Maine spent a whole heck of a lot more on hockey than most schools (and if you ask certain people on Commonwealth Avenue, Maine spent a whole heck of a lot more illegally, too). That isn't the case anymore. The top athletic schools are separating themselves from the rest of us at an ever increasing pace. The sheer money being brought in by the Big Ten (and the SEC, but they don't have hockey) dwarfs everyone else. The Maines, the UNH's, even the BU's and North Dakota's, rely on institutional transfers and student fees to fund athletics so there will always be a cap on how much the athletic department can soak the academic side. Michigan and Wisconsin and Minnesota and Ohio State and Notre Dame don't have that problem. Their money is generated by TV revenue for football, plus gate receipts, merchandising, etc. The only thing limiting the amount of money they spend on athletics is good taste, of which they don't have much. And beyond that, the only thing limiting their spending on hockey is institutional desire.

              Long story short, until there is systemic, structural change in hockey, the recruiting resources and on-campus facilities at the mega-schools are going to mean that the NHL draft picks funnel there. Even if Ohio State spends an equal amount as Maine in hockey, the rising tide that is football raises all boats of its athletic program by having shiny new training facilities and athlete only parts of campus that indirectly benefits their hockey programs. Walking someone around even the new facilities at Maine will pale in comparison. The draft picks aren't walking through the door. Maine and the rest of the non-Big 10 schools are going to have to develop players more than recruit finished products.

              Comment


              • #97
                (OK, I get it... Nobody wants to speak ill of the dead.)

                But Red absolutely ruined Maine hockey. No doubt about it. His tenure made Tim look like Scotty Bowman, or John Tortorella, or Jimmy Montgomery, or pretty much *any* decent coach.

                Barr is trying to exhume the program, but Red buried it so deep that's he'll need a back hoe to even get close.

                Gendron was the worst hire in the history of Maine sports, and his was the most absurd contract extension some years later.
                Last edited by Fishman'81; 03-30-2023, 08:29 PM.

                Comment


                • #98
                  This is really the place to come for a pick-me-up.....yeesh. Step away from the ledge fellas.

                  Meanwhile athletic superpower Quinnipiac is in the Frozen 4.....must be pulling a Shawn Walsh down there in Hamden.

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    Originally posted by BlackBearFan19 View Post

                    I agree with this, I think we also have to qualify it by saying that recruiting is improving and has already improved from the last 10 years. The defense is a testament to that.

                    Maine has the potential to be very good next year, beyond that is anyone’s guess. Are there enough high end scorers committed to maine right now? Probably not but the average recruit coming in has been better and the coaching has improved.

                    I’ve seen a lot of talk similar to this on the Lowell thread, they are happy with the job Bazin is doing coaching the team but are concerned with the lack of scorers. I think it is also a sign of the times, high end draft picks are not picking hockey East schools outside of Boston. For Maine to be competitive it is going to be on the backs of overlooked 4 year guys which I think Maine is landing (Freel, Holt, Breazeale)
                    How do you figure recruiting has improved? Barr has brought in 10 forwards and only one was a legitimate top six forward. The floor on the guys he has brought in other than the goalie has been decent enough but they really haven’t produced much. There are very few guys he has gotten to commit that show much potential and honestly the best recruits Maine has committed all have ties to the prior regime. It seems like this calendar year things have improved some but there is a long way to go.
                    Originally posted by BobbyBrady
                    Crosby probably wouldn't even be on BC's top two lines next year

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by AMC View Post
                      The top athletic schools are separating themselves from the rest of us at an ever increasing pace. The sheer money being brought in by the Big Ten (and the SEC, but they don't have hockey) dwarfs everyone else.

                      Long story short, until there is systemic, structural change in hockey, the recruiting resources and on-campus facilities at the mega-schools are going to mean that the NHL draft picks funnel there. Even if Ohio State spends an equal amount as Maine in hockey, the rising tide that is football raises all boats of its athletic program by having shiny new training facilities and athlete only parts of campus that indirectly benefits their hockey programs. Walking someone around even the new facilities at Maine will pale in comparison. The draft picks aren't walking through the door. Maine and the rest of the non-Big 10 schools are going to have to develop players more than recruit finished products.
                      There is big chunk of reality here in what you say.
                      For example Wisconsin has poached coach Hastings from Minn State who paid him under his contract up to $350k. What an amazing job he did there.
                      News reports state Hastings will get $700k at Wisconsin. How does a small school compete against that. Can't.

                      However, there will always be the anomalies who aren't big rich schools making the 16 and frozen four.
                      This is where we need to fit in for the future of this program. Improve the program enough with coaching and recruiting including the critical player facilities improvements, where Maine isn't a middle to bottom ranked team but can pretty consistently stay above the 25 spot and periodically be in a position, when the celestial alignment is right, to make a deep post season run. This would be my realistic wish for the program these days.

                      Yeah Maine isn't going to accumulate a roster full of NHL draft picks for the reasons you mention. Barr realizes this and I think he can do what he has the intention of doing, bringing this program back into the conversation. The U best be ready to increase his salary when the time comes or it all starts over again, this will be the hard part.
                      Last edited by NorthMike; 03-31-2023, 07:53 AM.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by NorthMike View Post
                        Yeah Maine isn't going to accumulate a roster full of NHL draft picks for the reasons you mention. Barr realizes this and I think he can do what he has the intention of doing, bringing this program back into the conversation.
                        Wasn't that part of Hastings' model at MN State? I seem to recall when they were making Frozen Fours they did so without any NHL picks on their roster. It can be done.

                        Of course the huge schools have an advantage, and they always will. But you can never just project a tourney field full of giant schools and call it a day, there's always room for little guys. Look at the Final Four this year, its three teams who have never made it this far before, with one who may never make it here again (plus Connecticut, who I hope dosen't ruin everything). Even in football, noted powerhouse TCU made it all the way to the title game. Sure, they got waxed by a massive school, but the fact they even made it there, and took out UM along the way, no less, shows there's always room for the unexpected.

                        The key to success in collegiate athletics is a good head coaching hire, and above that a good and committed athletic department/university president who is willing to do what it takes to win.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by umhockey91 View Post
                          This is really the place to come for a pick-me-up.....yeesh. Step away from the ledge fellas.

                          Meanwhile athletic superpower Quinnipiac is in the Frozen 4.....must be pulling a Shawn Walsh down there in Hamden.
                          This was my point- that Maine isn't going to do it with the #1 NHL picks that some people want. It's going to be development. It's still doable, it just isn't going to be with plug and play talent like it was in the early 90's.

                          Comment


                          • Now with the portal, stay focused on top end BCHL/NAHL players and build with them for a 4 year plan with each class. Grab USHL players that are serious about Maine. my point is if you bring in players that are getting better and better and give them the playing time they will be happy, and stay. This is the formula that St Cloud and Duluth use and they have done very well to compete with the big boys. Do not get wrapped up in the NHL #1 draft picks as they are one and out. That formula has only gotten Michigan to final 4's and their goal is national championship, however the players do not stay to accomplish that. I have seen players have career years their overage years in the BC and NA and when they come into college at 21 they are just peaking stay with them and they will keep getting better. Its pretty simple, now if your a top 10 school in the country every year then another approach can work for them.

                            Comment


                            • FYI

                              https://twitter.com/evegoe/status/16...Zs0qmkhcFhysuw
                              Let's Go Pirates!

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Drew S. View Post

                                How do you figure recruiting has improved? Barr has brought in 10 forwards and only one was a legitimate top six forward. The floor on the guys he has brought in other than the goalie has been decent enough but they really haven’t produced much. There are very few guys he has gotten to commit that show much potential and honestly the best recruits Maine has committed all have ties to the prior regime. It seems like this calendar year things have improved some but there is a long way to go.
                                Drew, we’ve gone back and forth on the “guys with ties to the previous regime” thing too much. At the end of the day, there are currently two guys coming in next year who committed under Red. On top of that, anyone choosing to still come is Barr’s guy, just as Byron, Brown and Renouf were Gendron guys.

                                In addition to that the entire defense, which was better than anything Gendron put together, was composed almost entirely of Barr committed guys. My post clearly said that Maine probably doesn’t have enough high end scorers committed but the average recruit has been better. There were a lot of D3 guys coming to Maine under the previous regime and that seems not to be the case under this staff. The high end scorers will come but putting a competent D1 team on the ice is a huge step in the right direction.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X