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  • Originally posted by Numbers View Post

    With Penn State coming in at #8 in the PWR, I don't think the committee has any choice but to send Denver (I mean the overall #3 seed) there. Minnesota obviously goes to Fargo. Quinnipiac goes the Bridgeport. There is a new rule which prohibits the committee from moving any team more than two spots within its seeding band. That means that they can't take PSU, at #8, and treat them like the #5. The most they can do is treat them like a #6. So, the 3rd seed has to go to Allentown.
    Interesting. I wasn't aware of that change. There is an outside chance St. Cloud gets to #5. Would that mean they couldn't go to Fargo?
    North Dakota
    National Champions: 1959, 1963, 1980, 1982, 1987, 1997, 2000, 2016

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Fighting Sioux 23 View Post

      Interesting. I wasn't aware of that change. There is an outside chance St. Cloud gets to #5. Would that mean they couldn't go to Fargo?
      I think that is correct.

      Comment


      • Actually, I have been thinking about the committee's process a bit, and the more I think of it, the more it seems to make sense to me.

        What the committee uses the PWR for is to give an objective measuring stick when there is otherwise only a fine, indistinguishable line between teams. So, for example, a few years ago, UMD qualified by .0001 or even less, or Minnesota. Really, there is no difference that any person would recognize between the teams. But, the committee uses the PWR as a measuring stick.

        However, the committee is then faced with the realities of hockey. It is a tight margin game. One of the margins which is granted to home teams is "last player change". In NCAA tournament play, the higher seeded team is designated the home team, and has the right of last change.

        In some years, the range of, say 7-11 in the RPI (and in the PWR) is so tight that it amounts to less than 1/2 game of results. There is no way to distingish that, and some people might say "Hey, there isn't any difference. So, if the tournament can be made better in attendance or in novelty of matchups, just shuffle the teams to make it so." However, moving someone from 10 to 8, or from 8 to 9, changes their band, and thus changes their home/road status.

        And, the committee doesn't want to do that. So, they adhere to the PWR perhaps more tightly than is actually necessary.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Numbers View Post

          I think that is correct.
          Yikes. So, here is one scenario: SCSU, Minnesota, Minnesota State, Merrimack, Colgate, and Canisius win. That gives the following Pairwise Rankings:

          1. Minnesota
          2. Quinnipiac
          3. Denver
          4. Michigan
          5. St. Cloud State
          6. Boston University
          7. Harvard
          8. Penn State
          9. Ohio State
          10. Merrimack
          11. Michigan Tech
          12. Minnesota State
          13. Western Michigan
          14. Cornell
          15. Colgate
          16. Canisius

          Minnesota to Fargo.
          Quinnipiac to Bridgeport
          Denver to Allentown
          Michigan to Manchester

          Pure serpentine leads to:

          Fargo
          1. Minnesota vs. 16. Canisius
          8. Penn State vs. 9. Ohio State

          Bridgeport
          2. Quinnipiac vs. 15. Colgate
          7. Harvard vs. 10. Merrimack

          Allentown
          3. Denver vs. 14. Cornell
          6. Boston University vs. 11. Michigan Tech

          Manchester
          4. Michigan vs. 13. Western Michigan
          5. St. Cloud State vs. 12. Minnesota State

          This doesn't work because Penn State has to be in Allentown. The question then becomes, do we just move that whole bracket to Allentown? If the goal is to protect the #1, then no. If we can only have Penn State lined up against the #1, #2, or #3 overall seeds, then the only real option is to swap the BU-Tech and PSU-OSU matchups. That gives us:

          Fargo
          1. Minnesota vs. 16. Canisius
          6. Boston University vs. 11. Michigan Tech

          Bridgeport
          2. Quinnipiac vs. 15. Colgate
          7. Harvard vs. 10. Merrimack

          Allentown
          3. Denver vs. 14. Cornell
          8. Penn State vs. 9. Ohio State

          Manchester
          4. Michigan vs. 13. Western Michigan
          5. St. Cloud State vs. 12. Minnesota State

          Next, we have some intra-conference matchups to fix. We can't have QU vs. Colgate. We can't have QU vs Cornell or Denver vs. Western Michigan either. Western Michigan has to play QU. The next question is do we also move Cornell to make it more equal? Perhaps...but let's wait for now. The other intra-conference matchup is Penn State vs. Ohio State. The easy flip is Ohio State and Merrimack. So, that gives us...

          Fargo
          1. Minnesota vs. 16. Canisius
          6. Boston University vs. 11. Michigan Tech

          Bridgeport
          2. Quinnipiac vs. 13. Western Michigan
          7. Harvard vs. 9. Ohio State

          Allentown
          3. Denver vs. 14. Cornell
          8. Penn State vs. 10. Merrimack

          Manchester
          4. Michigan vs. 15. Colgate
          5. St. Cloud State vs. 12. Minnesota State

          Okay. We've protected the #1, placed all the hosts in their regionals, and have avoided intra-conference matchups. Now, what can be done to improve attendance. Does Cornell put more butts in the seats in Manchester than Colgate? I would presume so, but I would also defer to our east coast fans. It also "rewards" Denver over Michigan for being a higher overall 1 seed. I'd love to put St. Cloud in Fargo, but the new rule doesn't allow it. But, what about Minnesota State? Fargo doesn't need any help attendance wise, so I'm inclined to leave it be...plus, the committee hasn't really cared much about saving flights recently. So, my bracket in this scenario would be:

          Fargo
          1. Minnesota vs. 16. Canisius
          6. Boston University vs. 11. Michigan Tech

          Bridgeport
          2. Quinnipiac vs. 13. Western Michigan
          7. Harvard vs. 9. Ohio State

          Allentown
          3. Denver vs. 15. Colgate
          8. Penn State vs. 10. Merrimack

          Manchester
          4. Michigan vs. 14. Cornell
          5. St. Cloud State vs. 12. Minnesota State

          So, you're treating BU as the #8 (from the #6), Tech as the #9 (from the #11), Western Michigan as the #15 (from the #13), Ohio State as the #10 (from the #9), Colgate as the #14 (from the #15), Penn State as the #6 (from the #8), Merrimack as the #11 (from the #10), and Cornell as the #13 (from the #14). That's a lot of changes.

          Whew...hopefully this scenario doesn't play itself out.
          North Dakota
          National Champions: 1959, 1963, 1980, 1982, 1987, 1997, 2000, 2016

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Fighting Sioux 23 View Post

            Yikes. So, here is one scenario: SCSU, Minnesota, Minnesota State, Merrimack, Colgate, and Canisius win. That gives the following Pairwise Rankings:

            1. Minnesota
            2. Quinnipiac
            3. Denver
            4. Michigan
            5. St. Cloud State
            6. Boston University
            7. Harvard
            8. Penn State
            9. Ohio State
            10. Merrimack
            11. Michigan Tech
            12. Minnesota State
            13. Western Michigan
            14. Cornell
            15. Colgate
            16. Canisius

            Minnesota to Fargo.
            Quinnipiac to Bridgeport
            Denver to Allentown
            Michigan to Manchester

            Pure serpentine leads to:

            Fargo
            1. Minnesota vs. 16. Canisius
            8. Penn State vs. 9. Ohio State

            Bridgeport
            2. Quinnipiac vs. 15. Colgate
            7. Harvard vs. 10. Merrimack

            Allentown
            3. Denver vs. 14. Cornell
            6. Boston University vs. 11. Michigan Tech

            Manchester
            4. Michigan vs. 13. Western Michigan
            5. St. Cloud State vs. 12. Minnesota State

            This doesn't work because Penn State has to be in Allentown. The question then becomes, do we just move that whole bracket to Allentown? If the goal is to protect the #1, then no. If we can only have Penn State lined up against the #1, #2, or #3 overall seeds, then the only real option is to swap the BU-Tech and PSU-OSU matchups. That gives us:

            Fargo
            1. Minnesota vs. 16. Canisius
            6. Boston University vs. 11. Michigan Tech

            Bridgeport
            2. Quinnipiac vs. 15. Colgate
            7. Harvard vs. 10. Merrimack

            Allentown
            3. Denver vs. 14. Cornell
            8. Penn State vs. 9. Ohio State

            Manchester
            4. Michigan vs. 13. Western Michigan
            5. St. Cloud State vs. 12. Minnesota State

            Next, we have some intra-conference matchups to fix. We can't have QU vs. Colgate. We can't have QU vs Cornell or Denver vs. Western Michigan either. Western Michigan has to play QU. The next question is do we also move Cornell to make it more equal? Perhaps...but let's wait for now. The other intra-conference matchup is Penn State vs. Ohio State. The easy flip is Ohio State and Merrimack. So, that gives us...

            Fargo
            1. Minnesota vs. 16. Canisius
            6. Boston University vs. 11. Michigan Tech

            Bridgeport
            2. Quinnipiac vs. 13. Western Michigan
            7. Harvard vs. 9. Ohio State

            Allentown
            3. Denver vs. 14. Cornell
            8. Penn State vs. 10. Merrimack

            Manchester
            4. Michigan vs. 15. Colgate
            5. St. Cloud State vs. 12. Minnesota State

            Okay. We've protected the #1, placed all the hosts in their regionals, and have avoided intra-conference matchups. Now, what can be done to improve attendance. Does Cornell put more butts in the seats in Manchester than Colgate? I would presume so, but I would also defer to our east coast fans. It also "rewards" Denver over Michigan for being a higher overall 1 seed. I'd love to put St. Cloud in Fargo, but the new rule doesn't allow it. But, what about Minnesota State? Fargo doesn't need any help attendance wise, so I'm inclined to leave it be...plus, the committee hasn't really cared much about saving flights recently. So, my bracket in this scenario would be:

            Fargo
            1. Minnesota vs. 16. Canisius
            6. Boston University vs. 11. Michigan Tech

            Bridgeport
            2. Quinnipiac vs. 13. Western Michigan
            7. Harvard vs. 9. Ohio State

            Allentown
            3. Denver vs. 15. Colgate
            8. Penn State vs. 10. Merrimack

            Manchester
            4. Michigan vs. 14. Cornell
            5. St. Cloud State vs. 12. Minnesota State

            So, you're treating BU as the #8 (from the #6), Tech as the #9 (from the #11), Western Michigan as the #15 (from the #13), Ohio State as the #10 (from the #9), Colgate as the #14 (from the #15), Penn State as the #6 (from the #8), Merrimack as the #11 (from the #10), and Cornell as the #13 (from the #14). That's a lot of changes.

            Whew...hopefully this scenario doesn't play itself out.

            Personally, I hope it does. I like seeing people squirm in their little world.

            But, in truth, my ideal bracket is that Northern Michigan wins, (I hate Mankato), and Colgate and CC both lose, so that Alaska gets in. Do the bracket however you want. I don't care. Alaska in and Mankato out. I would like that.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by BC/HE View Post

              Holy Cross is also a 7 seed so with their game being first tonight it would mean CC could become the 8th team. Minnesota fans will love to be reminded of playing Holy Cross in North Dakota.
              This Minnesota fan would love nothing more than to see the Gophers face Holy Cross in North Dakota. What better way to start a National Championship run than by exorcizing an old demon?
              National championships won by Big Ten schools : 23 (Michigan 9, Wisconsin 6, Minnesota 5, Michigan State 3, Ohio State 0, Penn State 0, Notre Dame 0)
              National championships won by NCHC schools : 21 (North Dakota 8, Denver 8, MN-Duluth 3, Colorado College 2, St. Cloud State 0, Miami 0, NE-Omaha 0, Western Michigan 0)

              23 > 21

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Numbers View Post


                Personally, I hope it does. I like seeing people squirm in their little world.

                But, in truth, my ideal bracket is that Northern Michigan wins, (I hate Mankato), and Colgate and CC both lose, so that Alaska gets in. Do the bracket however you want. I don't care. Alaska in and Mankato out. I would like that.
                I'd like to see CC make it...but in general chaos is fun to see play out, particularly with newish blood in the tournament. Perhaps a Michigan Tech, Western Michigan, Northern Michigan, and Michigan Frozen Four to go with it, with Western taking their first crown? That would be entertaining to see.
                North Dakota
                National Champions: 1959, 1963, 1980, 1982, 1987, 1997, 2000, 2016

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Fighting Sioux 23 View Post

                  I'd like to see CC make it...but in general chaos is fun to see play out, particularly with newish blood in the tournament. Perhaps a Michigan Tech, Western Michigan, Northern Michigan, and Michigan Frozen Four to go with it, with Western taking their first crown? That would be entertaining to see.
                  Subscribe.
                  Let's Go Broncos!

                  Comment


                  • does this Gopher analyst not know how offside works? the play they keep talking about is not offside.

                    Comment


                    • Cry some more about the refs

                      Comment


                      • Colgate kills Alaska's dream. If CC wins, Denver hangs on to #3 by slim margin. Likely brackets:
                        Fargo: 1-Minn v 16-Canisius, 6-SCSU v 9-Ohio State
                        Bridgeport: 2-Quinnipiac v 14-Merrimack (15-CC), 7-Harvard v 11-Minnesota State
                        Allentown: 3-Michigan(Denver) v 15-Colgate (14-Colgate), 8-Penn State v 10-Michigan Tech
                        Manchester: 4-Denver(Michigan) v 13-Cornell, 5-BU v 12-Western Michigan

                        There is the possibility of switching Cornell and Colgate, because Cornell can drive to Allentown.
                        Last edited by Numbers; 03-18-2023, 09:11 PM.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Fighting Sioux 23
                          With just one result left to be determined, I think the bracket shakes out something like this (rankings in parentheses are if CC comes back and beats SCSU)

                          Fargo
                          1. Minnesota vs. 16. Canisius
                          6. (7) St. Cloud State vs. 11. Minnesota State

                          Bridgeport
                          2. Quinnipiac vs. 14. Merrimack (or 15. Colorado College)
                          7. (6) Harvard vs. 9. Ohio State

                          Allentown
                          3. Michigan vs. 15. (14) Colgate
                          8. Penn State vs. 10. Michigan Tech

                          Manchester
                          4. Denver vs. 13. Cornell
                          5. Boston University vs. 12. Western Michigan
                          I get Mich and Den swapping places also if CC wins. And, I like yours better than mine. Only difference is you and I have Ohio State and Minn State swapped. but, for travel, and also inter-Minnesota intrigue, Minn State at Fargo makes a lot of sense.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Numbers View Post
                            Colgate kills Alaska's dream. If CC wins, Denver hangs on to #3 by slim margin. Likely brackets:
                            Fargo: 1-Minn v 16-Canisius, 6-SCSU v 9-Ohio State
                            Bridgeport: 2-Quinnipiac v 14-Merrimack (15-CC), 7-Harvard v 11-Minnesota State
                            Allentown: 3-Michigan(Denver) v 15-Colgate (14-Colgate), 8-Penn State v 10-Michigan Tech
                            Manchester: 4-Denver(Michigan) v 13-Cornell, 5-BU v 12-Western Michigan

                            There is the possibility of switching Cornell and Colgate, because Cornell can drive to Allentown.
                            I think Minnesota State goes to Fargo and Ohio State goes to Bridgeport. Other than that, I think you are spot on.
                            North Dakota
                            National Champions: 1959, 1963, 1980, 1982, 1987, 1997, 2000, 2016

                            Comment


                            • So the baseline if SCSU wins?

                              Fargo:

                              1. Minnesota (1)
                              2. Harvard (7)
                              3. Ohio State (9)
                              4. Canisius (16)

                              Allentown:

                              1. Michigan (3)
                              2. Penn State (8)
                              3. Michigan Tech (10)
                              4. Colgate (15)

                              Bridgeport:

                              1. Quinnipiac (2)
                              2. St. Cloud State (6)
                              3. Minnesota State (11)
                              4. Merrimack (14)

                              Manchester:

                              1. Denver (4)
                              2. BU (5)
                              3. Western Michigan (12)
                              4. Cornell (13)

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by J.D. View Post
                                does this Gopher analyst not know how offside works? the play they keep talking about is not offside.
                                Absolutely amazing to watch them slo mo that for almost 2 full minutes. Like, this is a basic delayed offside with no Michigan player touching the puck in the zone until it was cleared. What is the mystery here?
                                Originally posted by reBlur
                                the sober Trivino I know is not a guy who would force his way into a girl's room and attempt to rape her. I can't imagine him ever making anyone even feel uncomfortable when he's sober.There are plenty of players in my time covering the team who have looked at me differently or flirted with me or the like. Trivino has never been one of those players. Even outside of the rink, he'll say hi and is plenty of friendly, but has never been even close to saying or doing anything inappropriate.

                                Comment

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