CCHA v2.9.1 - BGSU BSU FSU LSSU MSU MTU NMU UST & Special Guests - The Augie Vikings

[TalonsUpPuckDown]

Normally I would agree, but this is college hockey we are talking about. Only 1 D1 conference has hockey, just barely, and they have virtually unlimited funds. The next D1 options would be the Summit and MAC with more than 2 teams that support D1 hockey. I'm not saying I like it or wish it was that way, but that is reality.

It is easy to see that the NCHC could morph into Summit League hockey. They already have 3 members in the NCHC. When St. Thomas get fully up and running, they could bolt to the NCHC. Lindenwood is already affiliated with the Summit League. I'm not saying that is/will happen, but they are at 4, 5 if you count affiliated schools with D1 hockey. Personal opinion, the NCHC is successful and seems to work well for everyone except Miami.

All discussions I've seen so far focus on western leagues, but HE and the ECAC face the same issue (so does AH). The ACC (BC) isn't going to sponsor hockey and neither is the Big East (Providence, UCONN). This whole NCAA business side of the sport is not something I know much about, but wouldn't a solution to the problem include a scenario where all D1 college hockey programs kick in to a centralized compliance clearinghouse and the leagues continue on as is? I get this is likely a dumb question, but I qualified myself by saying I don't know much about how any of this works.

[Bronco]

The MAC just dropped men's soccer, which had successful programs, but couldn't find enough members to keep the league afloat. Now we are expecting the conference to pick up a sport which only has three full members? Just don't see it happening. I don't see the other 9 full time members wanting to spend a dime more for a sport that the majority of their Universities do not sponsor.

[Lost_Husky]

The MAC just dropped men's soccer, which had successful programs, but couldn't find enough members to keep the league afloat. Now we are expecting the conference to pick up a sport which only has three full members? Just don't see it happening. I don't see the other 9 full time members wanting to spend a dime more for a sport that the majority of their Universities do not sponsor.

I don't think anyone realistically expects the MAC to pick up hockey. This came out of Miami crying about the NCHC talking with ASU and their unhappiness being beaten to powder year in and year out in the NCHC. The flavor I got from the interview was they were a MAC school and the NCHC can't push them around.

That morphed into a general NCHC/CCHA realignment discussion and very wild speculation about what the next round of re-alignment may look like/where the lines would be redrawn. The basic thought was the only full sport D1 conference that could possible sponsor hockey would be the Summit League with a minimal number of affiliated teams. Even that is not likely as the NCHC is powerhouse in hockey where all but Miami seem to be happy.

The MAC was the next highest D1 conference with 3 teams with no known viable path without someone(s) who loves college hockey and MAC schools showering them with money to making hockey work.

[Eddie Schorr]

I don't think anyone realistically expects the MAC to pick up hockey. This came out of Miami crying about the NCHC talking with ASU and their unhappiness being beaten to powder year in and year out in the NCHC. The flavor I got from the interview was they were a MAC school and the NCHC can't push them around.

That morphed into a general NCHC/CCHA realignment discussion and very wild speculation about what the next round of re-alignment may look like/where the lines would be redrawn. The basic thought was the only full sport D1 conference that could possible sponsor hockey would be the Summit League with a minimal number of affiliated teams. Even that is not likely as the NCHC is powerhouse in hockey where all but Miami seem to be happy.

The MAC was the next highest D1 conference with 3 teams with no known viable path without someone(s) who loves college hockey and MAC schools showering them with money to making hockey work.

It also came out of Miami of Ohio's arrogance that leads them to think they can dictate terms to others that transparently are meant to benefit themselves. The reality is that nobody wants to put up with their crap. It's why Ohio State (and now BG) are freezing them off the schedule. What their arrogance blinded them to was into thinking that their magic decade would last forever and there'd be no slipping back to their historical norm of mediocre or worse. Well, guess what? They slipped the hell back.

[RaceBoarder]

It also came out of Miami of Ohio's arrogance that leads them to think they can dictate terms to others that transparently are meant to benefit themselves. The reality is that nobody wants to put up with their crap. It's why Ohio State (and now BG) are freezing them off the schedule. What their arrogance blinded them to was into thinking that their magic decade would last forever and there'd be no slipping back to their historical norm of mediocre or worse. Well, guess what? They slipped the hell back.

I've fallen out of touch with Miami since they left for the NCHC and have only seen the surface results. I get that they have become the NCHC's doormat, but could you elaborate on BG/tOSU here.

Like Miami is demanding 2:1 game contracts or something?

[TalonsUpPuckDown]

I've fallen out of touch with Miami since they left for the NCHC and have only seen the surface results. I get that they have become the NCHC's doormat, but could you elaborate on BG/tOSU here.

Like Miami is demanding 2:1 game contracts or something?

Ohio State has been ****ed off at Miami State since Rico was there. They wont play ‘em.

We’re ****ed off at Miami State for some shenanigans over portal players. Now we won’t play ‘em.

Interestingly enough, the BG/OSU series goes on year after year after year…

[Eddie Schorr]

I've fallen out of touch with Miami since they left for the NCHC and have only seen the surface results. I get that they have become the NCHC's doormat, but could you elaborate on BG/tOSU here.

Like Miami is demanding 2:1 game contracts or something?

Ohio State has been ****ed off at Miami State since Rico was there. They wont play ‘em.

We’re ****ed off at Miami State for some shenanigans over portal players. Now we won’t play ‘em.

Interestingly enough, the BG/OSU series goes on year after year after year…

There's a lot of really bad blood between Miami of Ohio and Ohio State that dates back to the 60s and transcends anything athletic. While I'm sure the egos in the athletic department didn't like getting dominated for a decade by an in-state school, it's a lot deeper than just hockey stuff. We literally put their first doctoral programs together for them (diplomas for the first few years said "Miami University in conjunction with The Ohio State University), and they repaid that by having their former President who was the Ohio Board Of Regents Chair team up with a populist anti-intellectual Governor to completely backstab us in a very major way. Miami is in no position to demand anything from Ohio State, and Ohio State will never lift a finger to help Miami. If that place goes bankrupt, we'll take over the buildings and turn it into a branch campus.

Didn't Miami also blackball and block Bowling Green from being considered for an NCHC invite? Bergeron as the BG coach and a Miami of Ohio alum was probably able to smooth things over a bit, but as soon as he left, BG dropped Miami from the schedule, and Ohio State stepped in to make sure BG had an in-state rivalry weekend to replace Miami of Ohio. Moral of the story--as the NCHC is finding out--is that Miami of Ohio doesn't play well with others and wears out their welcome rather quickly. Cincinnati has also had enough of them, and it seems like they'll only continue the football and basketball games on UC's terms.

[RaceBoarder]

Thanks for the explanation.

Through NMU, I never really had any sort of beef with Miami and actually had a lot of fun hanging out with their fanbase at several various events at the end of the CCHA era, so this is kind of surprising to hear. But again, I never dealt with them behind the scenes, so I get it.

[njmav1]

Didn't Miami also blackball and block Bowling Green from being considered for an NCHC invite? Bergeron as the BG coach and a Miami of Ohio alum was probably able to smooth things over a bit, but as soon as he left, BG dropped Miami from the schedule, and Ohio State stepped in to make sure BG had an in-state rivalry weekend to replace Miami of Ohio. Moral of the story--as the NCHC is finding out--is that Miami of Ohio doesn't play well with others and wears out their welcome rather quickly. Cincinnati has also had enough of them, and it seems like they'll only continue the football and basketball games on UC's terms.

I read somewhere that BG was invited to apply when MSU applied for membership a few years ago. BG said no thanks and the NCHC said they were staying put at eight.

[Lost_Husky]

There's a lot of really bad blood between Miami of Ohio and Ohio State that dates back to the 60s and transcends anything athletic. While I'm sure the egos in the athletic department didn't like getting dominated for a decade by an in-state school, it's a lot deeper than just hockey stuff. We literally put their first doctoral programs together for them (diplomas for the first few years said "Miami University in conjunction with The Ohio State University), and they repaid that by having their former President who was the Ohio Board Of Regents Chair team up with a populist anti-intellectual Governor to completely backstab us in a very major way. Miami is in no position to demand anything from Ohio State, and Ohio State will never lift a finger to help Miami. If that place goes bankrupt, we'll take over the buildings and turn it into a branch campus.

Didn't Miami also blackball and block Bowling Green from being considered for an NCHC invite? Bergeron as the BG coach and a Miami of Ohio alum was probably able to smooth things over a bit, but as soon as he left, BG dropped Miami from the schedule, and Ohio State stepped in to make sure BG had an in-state rivalry weekend to replace Miami of Ohio. Moral of the story--as the NCHC is finding out--is that Miami of Ohio doesn't play well with others and wears out their welcome rather quickly. Cincinnati has also had enough of them, and it seems like they'll only continue the football and basketball games on UC's terms.

This bit of history makes things make sense. I live in SW Ohio and keep hearing and experiencing that Miami students/alumni tend to be on the arrogant/cocksure end of the spectrum. Even Miami's local marketing is slanted towards 'We are an Ivy school'. It also explains why UCinci and Xavier grads along with the local Cincinnati media don't give Miami any airtime/rarely admit Miami exists. U Dayton and Wright State get more airtime/coverage than Miami.

[Eddie Schorr]

This bit of history makes things make sense. I live in SW Ohio and keep hearing and experiencing that Miami students/alumni tend to be on the arrogant/cocksure end of the spectrum. Even Miami's local marketing is slanted towards 'We are an Ivy school'. It also explains why UCinci and Xavier grads along with the local Cincinnati media don't give Miami any airtime/rarely admit Miami exists. U Dayton and Wright State get more airtime/coverage than Miami.

And I don't get the arrogance. They don't rank in the top 100 in USNWR, and Ohio State is in the top 50. Ohio State accepts half their applicants, and Miami of Ohio accepts 88%. Ohio State has an average SAT score 100 points higher than Miami of Ohio. They fall back on some book from the early 80s called "Public Ivies" in which they and Vermont were included over more likely candidates like Wisconsin, Illinois or Washington solely to gin up a little controversy and publicity. The book, however, had no formula or metrics and was simply the entirely subjective opinion of its author. But, it's like that's all they have to talk about, so they bang that drum constantly without realizing how sad it is.

College hockey certainly saw the delusional arrogance that school instills in people when, after only three or four years of success and a single frozen four, their college paper proclaimed Miami of Ohio as "College Hockey's New Dynasty." How'd that turn out?

[moose97]

They fall back on some book from the early 80s called "Public Ivies"

Well, for one thing, their marketing department is doing a hell of a job. Not growing up in or really near Ohio, I had no idea it is a public university & assumed it was private based on how its perceived...

[TalonsUpPuckDown]

Well, for one thing, their marketing department is doing a hell of a job. Not growing up in or really near Ohio, I had no idea it is a public university & assumed it was private based on how its perceived...

Hence the “Miami State…” ;-)

[manurespreader]

If you watched the BSU vs LSSU games this weekend, LSSU is playing very well right now and will be a huge challenge for anyone. They are pretty far back but could ruin your season if you have to play them.

[pdt1081]

Didn't Miami also blackball and block Bowling Green from being considered for an NCHC invite? Bergeron as the BG coach and a Miami of Ohio alum was probably able to smooth things over a bit, but as soon as he left, BG dropped Miami from the schedule, and Ohio State stepped in to make sure BG had an in-state rivalry weekend to replace Miami of Ohio. Moral of the story--as the NCHC is finding out--is that Miami of Ohio doesn't play well with others and wears out their welcome rather quickly. Cincinnati has also had enough of them, and it seems like they'll only continue the football and basketball games on UC's terms.

Bergeron was ****ed he found out about the NCHC at the same time as the general public. Wasn't ****ed about BG being left out (really nobody was). He was mad because someone who he thought was a friend (Rico) left him be blindsided like everybody else. He righted BG's program, BG was asked to apply with Mankato but declined.

Through all that, BG and Miami still scheduled each other every season. BG dropped Miami from the schedule due to the circumstances surrounding a player transferring. Probably could have turned in an NCAA violation over it, but instead just decided to not schedule them for awhile, which hurts their budget far more than any sanctions would have.

OSU quit scheduling them a while ago, after they thought Miami was trying to run the score up on them.