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UNH Wildcats 2021/2022 - Return of the Champions of October?

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  • Originally posted by wildcatdc View Post
    Again, this is not an either/or situation. All of these things need to be addressed to stay competitive. To position this as a “get better recruiters and it’s all fixed” argument is silly.
    Dc, you say its necessary to 'stay competitive". Could you explain your thoughts, given that UNH has the second youngest arena in HE (BU is newest), and is behind the following teams.

    Northeastern - Opened: April 16, 1910
    U.Mass - the Mullins Center’s doors opened in January 1993.
    Providence -The Dunkin' Donuts Center became a reality on November 3, 1972
    BC Conte Forum 1988
    U.Conn - plays out of Hartford, off campus (though the prospect of the new arena is helping, much like the new Whit helped UNH)

    (Maine, in its heyday, sold the flimsiest arena)
    The Umile legacy:
    14-15 8th place,
    15-16 10th place
    16-17 10th place
    17-18 11th place
    18-19 8th place
    19-20 9th place
    20-21 10th place
    21-22 9th place

    Comment


    • Originally posted by NCAA watcher View Post

      Dc, you say its necessary to 'stay competitive". Could you explain your thoughts, given that UNH has the second youngest arena in HE (BU is newest), and is behind the following teams.

      Northeastern - Opened: April 16, 1910
      U.Mass - the Mullins Center’s doors opened in January 1993.
      Providence -The Dunkin' Donuts Center became a reality on November 3, 1972
      BC Conte Forum 1988
      U.Conn - plays out of Hartford, off campus (though the prospect of the new arena is helping, much like the new Whit helped UNH)

      (Maine, in its heyday, sold the flimsiest arena)
      Wow, you picked several of the POSTER CHILDREN of arenas that have undergone significant upgrades to the “guts”, most in the last 5 years. Honest question - have you been through the underbelly of the Whitt recently? Have you seen pics of the competition?
      Signature line intentionally left blank.

      Comment


      • A good chef would certainly benefit from the highest quality ingredients, but can make you a very fine meal with the basics. A bad chef can't cook with either...
        Live Free or Die!!
        Miami University '03

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Dan View Post
          A good chef would certainly benefit from the highest quality ingredients, but can make you a very fine meal with the basics. A bad chef can't cook with either...
          Absolutely agree with you. Would you rather not have both? Pretty sure if y’all have given up on the current chef (I certainly haven’t) and want a new one, Wolfgang Puck ain’t walking through that door once he gets a look at the spice rack we currently have! :-)
          Signature line intentionally left blank.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by wildcatdc View Post

            Wow, you picked several of the POSTER CHILDREN of arenas that have undergone significant upgrades to the “guts”, most in the last 5 years. Honest question - have you been through the underbelly of the Whitt recently? Have you seen pics of the competition?
            No, not at all.
            The Umile legacy:
            14-15 8th place,
            15-16 10th place
            16-17 10th place
            17-18 11th place
            18-19 8th place
            19-20 9th place
            20-21 10th place
            21-22 9th place

            Comment


            • Look, I can’t point to two people who I admire more for their college hockey wisdom than you two, Watcher and Dan. And to be clear, I absolutely get your directional points.

              I’m just not going to argue any longer about continuing to improve all variables when we have the chance. It’s not a zero sum game.
              Signature line intentionally left blank.

              Comment


              • By the way, I am not BLAMING the condition of the facility or the size of the rink for ALL of the woes of the past decade. I am simply saying, let’s fix what we can, when we can and remove doubts.
                Signature line intentionally left blank.

                Comment


                • You had me at "look."

                  So, 6 in a row. You can only play who they schedule, so let's keep going. Any word on Margel? He was starting to get going, then fell out in the Christmas illness wave, and hasn't been back yet.
                  The Umile legacy:
                  14-15 8th place,
                  15-16 10th place
                  16-17 10th place
                  17-18 11th place
                  18-19 8th place
                  19-20 9th place
                  20-21 10th place
                  21-22 9th place

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by wildcatdc View Post
                    That stated, not only is the snippet I copied above demonstrably false, it is to some extent intrinsically conflicted. To say that the subject is “never” brought up is simply untrue, and in fact, it IS brought up in the context of pro development. There is a desire for top-tier talent to be on ice that roughly resembles the NHL. Hardly superficial.
                    Then how do you explain kids flocking to Minnesota, St. Cloud and UMass among others? Every school has obstacles and faces objections - it is, by definition, the recruiters job to overcome those objections with answers with conviction.

                    McCloskey, and even Borek, convinced kids (Winnik and JVR, for example) that coming to the large sheet was great for their skating and would HELP their pro-development, but suddenly under Souza its an objection that simply cannot be overcome? When the ice size is converted there will be more objections and 'dirty recruiting' can those be overcome? Kids want scholarship money, they want trust/belief and they want a vision for how they can contribute and who they can become - there is nothing UNH lacks that prevents them from giving kids all these answers...

                    As for facility amenities, think about applying for a job. There are jobs all over the country with amazing amenities, benefits and work space/facilities. Does this actually convince anyone to take a job? Perhaps, but not ahead of salary, opportunity, bosses/co-workers, non-facility based professional development opportunities, etc. A ping-pong table and fully stocked kitchens are great, but not the reason anyone actually takes a job...

                    Would all these new bells and whistles help UNH recruit? Sure, but they are not valid excuses for recruiting failures. Speaking out in recruiting interviews about your own limitations or acknowledging to media, admin or boosters that you cannot recruit without them is a giant red flag...

                    Right now UNH is not only hearing recruit objections, but expressing and validating them themselves AND admitting they cannot overcome them. Quite frankly, that tells the whole story...
                    Live Free or Die!!
                    Miami University '03

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by NCAA watcher View Post

                      No, not at all.
                      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_SUOhXCt0g

                      The above is one example, from your list. Massive renovation after 40 years.

                      At UMass, Carvel (the hero of a few here) is quoted as saying that their “athletes deserve first-class facilities” as they delivered their new locker room before this season.

                      You can tour Agganis and Matthews on YouTube as well, both materially better. I believe NU went through a renovation in 2010.

                      Here’s another fun fact… we have less than 500sf of dedicated workout/cardio in the Whitt, D1 average is about 4000sf. Our players have to tromp over to the field house to share space with other teams. This definitely comes up in the recruiting process.

                      again, not the be-all/end-all, but not exactly an “asset”.
                      Signature line intentionally left blank.

                      Comment


                      • Timeline for upcoming "fixes" to UNH Hockey and the aging 26 yr. old Whittemore Center Arena:

                        * March '22 - UNH finishes RS in 7th place, loses 2-1 to UMass-Lowell in HEA QF round
                        * Summer '22 - replace refrigeration & re-size the arena, with 10 feet of empty space lengthwise
                        * Winter '23 - last 50 season ticket holders protest, needing binoculars to see ice from front row
                        * March '23 - UNH finishes RS in 9th place, loses to Merrimack in reinstated MBPBEGAM playoffs
                        * May '23 - sixth year goalie Mike Robinson finally runs out of eligibility, signs lifetime ECHL deal
                        * Summer '23 - UNH replaces short glass with adjustable zoom lens glass to assist sight lines
                        * Winter '24 - last 25 season ticket holders protest, allergic to weeds in the 10 feet of empty space
                        * March '24 - UNH finishes RS in 8th place, makes trip to Boston for HEA Tourney (guest passes)
                        * May '24 - UNH Head Coach Mike Souza gets 10 year extension, promises steady improvement
                        * Summer '24 - underbelly of The Whitt upgraded, with extra bathrooms for non-binary skaters
                        * Winter '25 - last 12 season ticket holders protest, want non-binary bathrooms for main concourse
                        * March '25 - season ends in 10 game losing streak, Coach Souza restores "Black Betty" to playlist
                        * May '25 - UNH Head Coach Mike Souza vows to conduct national search for new athletic trainer(s)
                        * Summer '25 - Press Row upgraded to include fiber optics, eliminating dial-up, no press to notice
                        * Winter '26 - last half-dozen season ticket holders protest, just out of sheer habit, just because ...
                        Sworn Enemy of the Perpetually Offended
                        Montreal Expos Forever ...

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by wildcatdc View Post
                          By the way, I am not BLAMING the condition of the facility or the size of the rink for ALL of the woes of the past decade. I am simply saying, let’s fix what we can, when we can and remove doubts.
                          I have NO problem with this. I agree completely. I hope they upgrade anything they can afford to upgrade, primarily for the sake of the student-athletes who deserve the best experience in exchange for their effort.

                          Personally, I like the large ice, but if UNH is set on changing things I really don't care anymore. My issue comes from a perspective of limited dollars and a need to be strategic with spending (What is it that will really make a difference?) and from a perspective of UNH feeling limited in what should be expected from the staff/program as currently constituted (the coaches/program do not lack the means to be successful)...

                          That said, if UNH has the money to spend on the ice size AND upgrade amenities then I hope they spend it, upgrading in every area possible. I just hope they're are honest and objective about what will truly help recruiting and what the obstacles/objections (and related answers) to recruiting truly are - because that is the only way they can spend beneficially or expect a different result post-spending...
                          Last edited by Dan; 01-25-2022, 01:12 PM.
                          Live Free or Die!!
                          Miami University '03

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Dan View Post

                            Then how do you explain kids flocking to Minnesota, St. Cloud and UMass among others? Every school has obstacles and faces objections - it is, by definition, the recruiters job to overcome those objections with answers with conviction.

                            McCloskey, and even Borek, convinced kids (Winnik and JVR, for example) that coming to the large sheet was great for their skating and would HELP their pro-development, but suddenly under Souza its an objection that simply cannot be overcome? When the ice size is converted there will be more objections and 'dirty recruiting' can those be overcome? Kids want scholarship money, they want trust/belief and they want a vision for how they can contribute and who they can become - there is nothing UNH lacks that prevents them from giving kids all these answers...

                            As for facility amenities, think about applying for a job. There are jobs all over the country with amazing amenities, benefits and work space/facilities. Does this actually convince anyone to take a job? Perhaps, but not ahead of salary, opportunity, bosses/co-workers, non-facility based professional development opportunities, etc. A ping-pong table and fully stocked kitchens are great, but not the reason anyone actually takes a job...

                            Would all these new bells and whistles help UNH recruit? Sure, but they are not valid excuses for recruiting failures. Speaking out in recruiting interviews about your own limitations or acknowledging to media, admin or boosters that you cannot recruit without them is a giant red flag...

                            Right now UNH is not only hearing recruit objections, but expressing and validating them themselves AND admitting they cannot overcome them. Quite frankly, that tells the whole story...
                            Dan, are you even reading my posts? I mean, really reading them?

                            I am not ascribing full blame to either the rink or the facilities. I’m simply saying (for it seems like the umpteenth time), that we should remove any/all obstacles if and when we can. To argue against THAT would just be petty. To your point, it may not fully solve the problem, but you’d be hard-pressed to find anyone who wouldn’t rather be competitive in all aspects of the recruiting process.
                            Signature line intentionally left blank.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Dan View Post

                              I have NO problem with this. I agree completely. I hope they upgrade anything they can afford to upgrade, primarily for the sake of the student-athletes who deserve the best experience in exchange for their effort.

                              Personally, I like the large ice, but if UNH is set on changing things I really don't care anymore. My issue comes from a perspective of limited dollars and a need to be strategic with spending (What is it that will really make a difference?) and from a perspective of UNH feeling limited in what should be expected from the staff/program as currently constituted (the coaches/program do not lack the means to be successful)...

                              That said, if UNH has the money to spend on the ice size AND upgrade amenities then I hope they spend it, upgrading in every area possible. I just hope they're are honest and objective about what will truly help recruiting and what the obstacles/objections (and related answers) to recruiting truly are - because that is the only way they can spend beneficially or expect a different result post-spending...
                              Sorry - our last two posts crossed in the mail!
                              Signature line intentionally left blank.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by wildcatdc View Post

                                [url]At UMass, Carvel (the hero of a few here) is quoted as saying that their “athletes deserve first-class facilities” as they delivered their new locker room before this season.
                                ...

                                EDIT - We're on the same page DC, just different reactions to the messaging I suppose. I'm happy to see any and all upgrades come UNH's way, just want to see them strive for and reach their potential in the meantime...
                                Last edited by Dan; 01-25-2022, 01:19 PM.
                                Live Free or Die!!
                                Miami University '03

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