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Hockey East: 2019/20 season is Joe Bertagna's last as commish

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  • Split-N
    replied
    Re: Hockey East: 2019/20 season is Joe Bertagna's last as commish

    Originally posted by Nick Papagiorgio View Post
    I mean... ok but the programs with deeper rosters of skill players benefit the same way there as they do during 5x5 and 4x4 and 3x3 and any other situation. That's not unfair. It's consistent if nothing else.
    I take your point but my comment on unfair/disproportionate advantage was focused on what I consider to be gimmicks, like 3x3 OT and the accursed shootout. There always have been and always will be times when a "have not" somehow manages to tie a blue blood. But IMO when you go to a 3x3 OT, the talent edge of the blue blood becomes magnified so the odds tilt heavily in favor of the blue blood. Even moreso in a shootout, which after all is nothing more than a skills competition.

    So let the tied teams continue to play real hockey in a 5x5 OT of whatever duration you want. If it's still tied at the end of that OT, so be it. The two teams split the standing points, which is the only fair way for the league standings to reflect the actual competitive outcome.
    Last edited by Split-N; 02-20-2020, 09:56 AM.

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  • boblav1
    replied
    Re: Hockey East: 2019/20 season is Joe Bertagna's last as commish

    I always wondered why the NCAA added a rule to award each team a time out once the game went into OT? I've been to several games where a team has been on the ropes and forced to ice the puck in OT. Instead of one team having a clear advantage against tired players the other team just calls a time out to get fresh skaters on the ice.

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  • J.D.
    replied
    Originally posted by Sean Pickett View Post
    No, not a challenge. An actual HEA-NCHC interlocking schedule with the games between the teams from both leagues counting in both leagues' standings.

    Sean
    Oh I'm not sure how I feel about that

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  • Split-N
    replied
    Re: Hockey East: 2019/20 season is Joe Bertagna's last as commish

    Fear the Pick!!!!!

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  • ticapnews
    replied
    Re: Hockey East: 2019/20 season is Joe Bertagna's last as commish

    I'm now convinced Sean isn't a human being. There is no way he has this much information committed to memory or available at the click of a button. It's some sort of A.I. Maybe part of Skynet. It seems harmless enough because it's just posting stuff about sports, but it's all a ruse to disarm us. It's only a matter of time before it leads the Robot Uprising.

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  • Sean Pickett
    replied
    Re: Hockey East: 2019/20 season is Joe Bertagna's last as commish

    Originally posted by BC/HE View Post
    3x3,4x4 and shootouts cheapen the game and unless employed consistently across all leagues they must keep the result after the 5 minutes as official. If they want to have fewer ties the best alternative is to extend the OT. Now anything more than 10 minutes would be a burden for travel schedules and could be considered an injury waiting to happen. So why not go to an 8 minute OT if 10 is too much? In 8 minutes teams would not play to just keep it tied like some do with 5 minute OT's. By the way I also wouldn't mind seeing the playoffs be just 4 teams headed straight to the Garden.
    3x3 has been discussed before in both the Should College Hockey Should Adopt 3-on-3 OT thread and the NCAA Committee Recommends Change To Overtime In 2016-17 in which I posted this:

    Originally posted by Sean Pickett View Post
    Not quite:

    NHL 2015-16 Season (3x3 overtime)
    1230 games played
    275 overtime games (23.6 %)
    107 shootouts (8.7 % of all games; 38.9 % of overtime games)

    NHL 2014-15 Season (4x4 overtime)
    1230 games played
    306 overtime games (24.9 %)
    170 shootouts (13.8 % of all games; 55.6 % of overtime games)

    Over the past two seasons the average is just 47.7% of overtime games were decided playing 4x4 or 3x3 with the remaining 52.3% tied after 5 minutes of overtime.
    To date this season there have been 179 ovetime games, of which 109, 60.9%, were still still tied after the 5 minute overtime.

    Sean
    Last edited by Sean Pickett; 02-19-2020, 05:54 PM.

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  • Sean Pickett
    replied
    Re: Hockey East: 2019/20 season is Joe Bertagna's last as commish

    Originally posted by NCAA watcher View Post
    I'm not sure how hard. Yes, the financials will be a bit higher with travel, but from a hockey perspective, I think a lot of the NCHC teams would welcome it. That is because right now they are small and beating each other up, to their own detriment. Having a set of new teams to beat in a lesser conference would be welcome to Miami and Colorado and Nebraska, which are stuck as bottom feeders. For a coach looking to survive, getting games against U.Conn, Vermont and UNH would be easier wins for the resume.

    I assume that the benefit of wins over lesser HE teams still help more than multiple losses against top teams Duluth and Denver.

    In many respects, this is what happened when HE was founded, and played the younger brother to the WCHA powerhouses Wisconsin, NoDak and Minnesota, while Denver was able to claw its way back.
    I'm thinking more that the NCHC teams would be resistant to giving up the current 10 games from their unbalanced schedule as that would mean giving up a home series or two with UND, DU and/or UMD every season. However, as you mention, I also think getting to play (and potentially win) 11 games vs Hockey East teams is a good selling point.

    Sean

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  • BC/HE
    replied
    Re: Hockey East: 2019/20 season is Joe Bertagna's last as commish

    3x3,4x4 and shootouts cheapen the game and unless employed consistently across all leagues they must keep the result after the 5 minutes as official. If they want to have fewer ties the best alternative is to extend the OT. Now anything more than 10 minutes would be a burden for travel schedules and could be considered an injury waiting to happen. So why not go to an 8 minute OT if 10 is too much? In 8 minutes teams would not play to just keep it tied like some do with 5 minute OT's. By the way I also wouldn't mind seeing the playoffs be just 4 teams headed straight to the Garden.

    Leave a comment:


  • Sean Pickett
    replied
    Re: Hockey East: 2019/20 season is Joe Bertagna's last as commish

    Originally posted by J.D. View Post
    The Hockey East/NCHC challenge like they do in Men's Hoops...ACC vs. Big Ten. I'm in.
    No, not a challenge. An actual HEA-NCHC interlocking schedule with the games between the teams from both leagues counting in both leagues' standings.

    Sean

    Leave a comment:


  • Sean Pickett
    replied
    Re: Hockey East: 2019/20 season is Joe Bertagna's last as commish

    Originally posted by Split-N View Post
    Agree. Hockey has always recognized that, in a given game, one team may really not be better than the other so the two teams split the standings points. This ensures the objectivity and integrity of the point-based standings system. Adding gimmicks like 3x3 OT, shootouts (nothing more than a skills competition), and (God forbid) loser points compromises and even corrupts the standings.
    Well, college hockey leagues (and the NHL) could go with the football (aka soccer) system of 3 points for a win and 1 point for a tie in an effort to encourage playing for the win. Of course that also corrupts the standings, as last season Liverpool would have won the Premier League 67 points to 66 using the old 2-1-0 point system instead of the current 3-1-0 point system.

    Sean

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  • Nick Papagiorgio
    replied
    Re: Hockey East: 2019/20 season is Joe Bertagna's last as commish

    Originally posted by Split-N View Post
    To wit: The aforesaid gimmicks would seem to unfairly and disproportionately benefit the "Blue Blood" programs that almost always have deeper rosters of skill players who can thrive in skills competitions, like 3x3 and shootouts.
    I mean... ok but the programs with deeper rosters of skill players benefit the same way there as they do during 5x5 and 4x4 and 3x3 and any other situation. That's not unfair. It's consistent if nothing else.

    Leave a comment:


  • Split-N
    replied
    Re: Hockey East: 2019/20 season is Joe Bertagna's last as commish

    Originally posted by J.D. View Post
    ...The other major point is trying to reduce ties. I honestly don't understand the obsession with that...I just don't understand why ties are deemed to be a problem...
    Agree. Hockey has always recognized that, in a given game, one team may really not be better than the other so the two teams split the standings points. This ensures the objectivity and integrity of the point-based standings system. Adding gimmicks like 3x3 OT, shootouts (nothing more than a skills competition), and (God forbid) loser points compromises and even corrupts the standings. And just because the NHL apparently thinks that 3x3, shootouts, and loser points are good for the NHL doesn't mean that any of those is good for the college game. To wit: The aforesaid gimmicks would seem to unfairly and disproportionately benefit the "Blue Blood" programs that almost always have deeper rosters of skill players who can thrive in skills competitions, like 3x3 and shootouts.

    Originally posted by Dan View Post
    ...all I do is root for 3x3 overtime. It is electric and a whole lot of fun...
    The carnival midways where you get a stuffed animal for somehow knocking over a target or ringing a bell are fun too.

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  • Middle Street
    replied
    Re: Hockey East: 2019/20 season is Joe Bertagna's last as commish

    Originally posted by Sean Pickett View Post
    Here are the lengths of all UML games at Tsongas this season:
    I have no data on why Maine's home games are running 15 minutes longer than UML's home games, sorry.

    Sean
    This is exactly what I was looking for, thanks.

    Leave a comment:


  • J.D.
    replied
    Re: Hockey East: 2019/20 season is Joe Bertagna's last as commish

    The Hockey East/NCHC challenge like they do in Men's Hoops...ACC vs. Big Ten. I'm in.

    Leave a comment:


  • ticapnews
    replied
    Originally posted by NCAA watcher View Post
    Aiming way too high with the Big 10. How about the other direction: relegation play, so the last place team moves to the AHA for the next year. Leaves a 10 team league. And it evens out the AHA, which is also 11, and now will be 12.

    Plays off of the fan's repeated desire on the thread to have the final games be meaningful.
    Should UVM do the elephant walk of shame now, or wait until March?

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