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  • Re: Starting D1 Hockey Program

    Originally posted by Sol Diablo View Post
    HC doesn't even have the money pay for travel to a scheduled game. They may not have the budget to remain D1.
    Have to respectfully disagree. Notwithstanding potential COVID-19 impacts, HC absolutely has the money. Its endowment is ~$785 million, which places it fourth behind only BC, BU, and NU among HEA schools (HC is already a member on the women's side). Having resources and determining spending priorities are entirely different things. By contrast, SHU's endowment is ~$167 million. SHU might well be willing to spend more on athletics than HC but HC overall has significantly greater financial strength.

    Of course, all things financial have been turned on their heads because of impacts from the current public health emergency. Nobody knows what the financial consequences will be...just that there will be consequences.
    "Through the years, we ever will acclaim........"

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    • Re: Starting D1 Hockey Program

      Originally posted by Sol Diablo View Post
      HC doesn't even have the money pay for travel to a scheduled game. They may not have the budget to remain D1.
      It's quite a leap to go from "Too expensive right now to pay airfare for an OOC game," to "Program's getting shut down," dontcha think?

      There has been talk on the Miami message board that flights to ECAC/HE OOC games should be curtailed to save money with those games going to midwestern bus trip schools. I don't think you're insinuating that Miami "may not have the budget to remain D1," are you?

      I understand the frustration at how ASU is affected by all this, but the Alabama-Huntsville thread has some very good discussions regarding the risks associated with being both an independent and a geographic outlier.

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      • Re: Starting D1 Hockey Program

        Originally posted by TalonsUpPuckDown View Post
        It's quite a leap to go from "Too expensive right now to pay airfare for an OOC game," to "Program's getting shut down," dontcha think?

        There has been talk on the Miami message board that flights to ECAC/HE OOC games should be curtailed to save money with those games going to midwestern bus trip schools. I don't think you're insinuating that Miami "may not have the budget to remain D1," are you?

        I understand the frustration at how ASU is affected by all this, but the Alabama-Huntsville thread has some very good discussions regarding the risks associated with being both an independent and a geographic outlier.
        And I am probably wrong. However ASU has not cancelled any flights, nor games from their schedule, they are proceeding with the $120 million arena. So maybe HC's money is tied up in investments and endowments that only allow a low withdrawal rate, many times 4% is used ($31 million for HC based on the prior comment), and if their investment managers perceive that their markets won't rebound in a timely manner then more budget gets cut. Likely a low probability they would have to drop divisions but it is a crazy world right now.

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        • Re: Starting D1 Hockey Program

          Originally posted by Sol Diablo View Post
          And I am probably wrong. However ASU has not cancelled any flights, nor games from their schedule, they are proceeding with the $120 million arena. So maybe HC's money is tied up in investments and endowments that only allow a low withdrawal rate, many times 4% is used ($31 million for HC based on the prior comment), and if their investment managers perceive that their markets won't rebound in a timely manner then more budget gets cut. Likely a low probability they would have to drop divisions but it is a crazy world right now.
          This was topic discussed over on the schedules thread; there may be more airlifted OOC series rescheduled. And, God forbid, if the dominoes do start falling, watch out ASU.

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          • Re: Starting D1 Hockey Program

            Originally posted by TalonsUpPuckDown View Post
            This was topic discussed over on the schedules thread; there may be more airlifted OOC series rescheduled. And, God forbid, if the dominoes do start falling, watch out ASU.
            And the craziness is that ASU plans to have students in class in the fall, sports to continue as scheduled, but if there are no home hockey games because other schools cancel their trips, and likewise Huntsville and the Alaska schools are in the same boat, it would be perceived to be unfair to the students of these schools. Then the administration has to ask themselves why spend the money if students can't benefit from it. They would be wondering if NCAA D1 hockey is truly a legitimate collegiate sport anymore. And I don't anticipate the NCAA willingly stepping into this mess to straighten it out, waiver things or ? , but they will probably have to if cancelling continues. Would be interesting to be a fly on the wall when the NCAA and colleges have some discussions. My guess is that the universitys' majority consensus will drive the NCAA as NCAA only seems to drive individual school issues?
            Last edited by Sol Diablo; 05-21-2020, 01:46 PM.

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            • Re: Starting D1 Hockey Program

              Originally posted by rpi82 View Post
              Holy Cross has quite a bit of money. Whether they choose to spend it on hockey is another matter. Despite having only about 1/2 as many students, CotHC, which has a long tradition in New England (pre-Flutie and the growth of big time athletics on Chestnut Hill it was the school of choice for NE male Catholics and BC was the fallback school)
              I just fell off my barstool laughing at that one! HC has always had visions of grandeur. They used to run their mouth about how they were as good as the Ivies. And touted their record in football against the Ivies. Then their league dropped schollies, and surprise, surprise, the Ivies started pounding HC in football.
              bigmrg74: "You can't drink the day away if you don't start early!"
              SledDog: "UncleRay seems to be the most sensible one here tonight."
              All great men are dead and I'm not feeling well.
              A Margarita! in every hand and another Margarita! in the other hand!

              And stay off the lawn!

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              • Re: Starting D1 Hockey Program

                Originally posted by UncleRay View Post
                I just fell off my barstool laughing at that one! HC has always had visions of grandeur. They used to run their mouth about how they were as good as the Ivies. And touted their record in football against the Ivies. Then their league dropped schollies, and surprise, surprise, the Ivies started pounding HC in football.
                Not sure what you're laughing so hard about but in my memory span, HC was indeed on the national stage in both football and basketball (even won a natty in 1948) and rained on BC's parade on more than a few occasions. In fact, one of the reasons for the human carnage of the Coconut Grove fire of 1942 was so many HC fans celebrating an improbable 55-12 shellacking of BC that cost BC a Sugar Bowl bid. What's happened to HC athletics in recent decades is lamentable, to say the least.

                BTW, I have no ties to Holy Cross. Just wouldn't mind seeing its athletic lot improve, especially in hockey.
                Last edited by Split-N; 05-23-2020, 08:42 AM.
                "Through the years, we ever will acclaim........"

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                • Re: Starting D1 Hockey Program

                  St. Thomas still views Division I move as best long-term strategy

                  https://www.startribune.com/st-thoma...egy/570692292/
                  Minnesota Golden Gopher Hockey

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                  • Re: Starting D1 Hockey Program

                    Originally posted by UncleRay View Post
                    I just fell off my barstool laughing at that one! HC has always had visions of grandeur. They used to run their mouth about how they were as good as the Ivies. And touted their record in football against the Ivies. Then their league dropped schollies, and surprise, surprise, the Ivies started pounding HC in football.
                    Not sure what you are laughing about. HC was the New England school of choice for Catholic males until BC left them in the dust by leveraging their emergence in sports (particularly the Flutie PR) to develop a national reputation while HC reduced the emphasis on sports. As a small school of 3,000 or so students, far smaller than even Dartmouth (the smallest Ivy), located on a hillside in Worcester that was probably an inevitable decision. As I remember it, their league didn't drop scholarships, they were founding members of a league of academically similar I-AA schools that chose not to offer scholarships (the Patriot League which was founded in the 80s as the Colonial League).

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                    • Re: Starting D1 Hockey Program

                      BC had eclipsed HC long, long before Flutie was even considering where to attend college. I'll admit I don't know the details of what football conference they were in when, but the gist of my comment about schollies and the Ivies remains valid: they ran their mouths about beating up on the Ivies when they had schollies and the Ivies didn't, but when the footing was evened with HC not having schollies, the tables turned immediately .
                      bigmrg74: "You can't drink the day away if you don't start early!"
                      SledDog: "UncleRay seems to be the most sensible one here tonight."
                      All great men are dead and I'm not feeling well.
                      A Margarita! in every hand and another Margarita! in the other hand!

                      And stay off the lawn!

                      Comment


                      • Resurrecting this thread since it’s the off-season and that’s when we pretend to have serious discussions about the very unserious ideas of who’s going maybe add a program.

                        I mentioned earlier in the thread that I started keeping a list of programs where we would hear something (a new arena being built by campus, some club coach yapping to a newspaper, etc).

                        Here’s basically where that list stands:
                        • St. Thomas (100% happening but staying on my list until they drop a puck)
                        • Illinois (95% likely to actually happen)
                        • Navy (70%)
                        • Lindenwood (this is where the percentages don’t actually mean anything because I actually don’t think it’ll happen but it’s still possible… 15%?)
                        • Penn (7.5% that endowment for their club program… that’s a weird thing for a club program but Ivies are gonna Ivy)
                        • The 7 D-II schools are allowed to play D-I (7% for some reason I feel like this could happen, yet there’s never once been some local paper story of one of their ADs suggesting it… but it’s an entire conference that’s already playing varsity hockey so… ?\_(ツ)_/?)
                        • Tennessee State (5% until their study comes back, then it’s either 50% or 0%)
                        • Simon Fraser (4% their club team has played exhibitions and… hey Canadians! UBC would go here too for the same reasons were they in the NCAA)
                        • Oakland (3.5% and dropping since it’s been 3 years since their feasibility study was announced)
                        • Schools With Women’s Team Which I Guess Is A Good Indicator Based On LIU and Maybe Lindenwood (Syracuse) (1.5%)
                        • Schools With Club Teams Who’ve Made Local News Talking About Maybe Going Varsity With Nothing Else Behind It (Maryville) (1%)
                        • Random Schools With Actual Legit Options For Arenas And Nothing Else Driving This Conversation (Iowa, UNLV, Georgia, Liberty, Nebraska, evidently Arizona plays somewhere that can hold 6,000 or so) (idk 1%???)
                        • Rhode Island (0.8%… only because of persistent “rumors” some people mention here, but seriously guys has there ever even been a newspaper article about this?)
                        • Random Schools Who For Some Reason Have Legit Hired Consultants About An Arena But Otherwise Has Nothing Else (Indiana, High Point University) (0.5%)
                        • Schools That Actually Once Kicked The Tires And Said No Or Otherwise Have Had ADs Publicly Say It’s Been Considered (Kennesaw State, Minnesota State-Moorhead, Wisconsin-Milwaukee, Wisconsin-Green Bay, Minot State, Grand Valley State) (0.1%)
                        • Schools Closer To Penn’s Rink Than Penn (Drexel) (0%)
                        • Schools That Used To Have Teams That Were Dropped And Probably Only Have Access To Okay Or Lousy Rinks (UIC, Kent State, St Louis, Ohio, Fairfield, Findlay, Villanova technically, Wayne State) (0%)
                        • Schools That Random USCHO Posters Have Opined About With No Way To Justify How It Might Actually Happen (Texas, Colorado State, Delaware, Stony Brook, Rutgers, Albany, Marquette, Iowa State) (0%)
                        • Do you remember that one guy who once posted here about Louisville and his entire justification on the matter had something to do with intramural hockey? (-10%)
                        If you want to be a BADGER, just come along with me

                        BRING BACK PAT RICHTER!!!


                        At his graduation ceremony from the U of Minnesota, my cousin got a keychain. When asked what UW gave her for graduation, my sister said, "A degree from a University that matters."

                        Canned music is a pathetic waste of your time.

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                        • Here are the links to Lindenwood starting D1 hockey 2022-2023.

                          Lindenwood men’s ice hockey moving to Division I


                          Jeff Cox from New England Hockey Journal

                          Lindenwood University To Add Division I NCAA Hockey

                          Private Missouri college, Lindenwood University, aiming to add Division I men's hockey within two years










                          Slap Shot - 444 might want to consider a restraining order.
                          dggoddard - Minnesota is THE ELITE Program in all of college hockey.
                          wasmania - you have to be the very best to get ice time with the great gophers!

                          Comment


                          • Of all the schools listed above, the one that surprises me most about not jumping in is Arizona, if only to keep up with rival Arizona State. The Arizona club program, at least when I was there, had all the trappings of a varsity program, including nice arena, season ticket holders, hefty budget (at least for a club program). Also sorta surprised that UNLV hasn't taken the plunge although maybe the Vegas/Henderson Knights might not be enthralled about the prospect of revenue competition.

                            Don't know what to think about Illinois anymore. The silence has been deafening.
                            "Through the years, we ever will acclaim........"

                            Comment


                            • Lindenwood is recruiting a roster.
                              https://www.wichitafallswarriors.com...ood-university

                              ... the men’s ice hockey program will make the transition to Division I starting in the 2022-23 season. “ ... I’ll have the opportunity to be a part of Lindenwood’s inaugural season as the team transitions to Division I”.
                              The preceding post may contain trigger words and is not safe-space approved. <-- Virtue signaling.

                              North Dakota Hockey:

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Split-N View Post
                                Of all the schools listed above, the one that surprises me most about not jumping in is Arizona, if only to keep up with rival Arizona State. The Arizona club program, at least when I was there, had all the trappings of a varsity program, including nice arena, season ticket holders, hefty budget (at least for a club program). Also sorta surprised that UNLV hasn't taken the plunge although maybe the Vegas/Henderson Knights might not be enthralled about the prospect of revenue competition.

                                Don't know what to think about Illinois anymore. The silence has been deafening.
                                I keep asking around and they keep saying it's still on course. Take it for what's it's worth.
                                Slap Shot - 444 might want to consider a restraining order.
                                dggoddard - Minnesota is THE ELITE Program in all of college hockey.
                                wasmania - you have to be the very best to get ice time with the great gophers!

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