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Minnesota Golden Gopher Season 2018-2019: Fire Motzko

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  • Re: Minnesota Golden Gopher Season 2018-2019: Fire Motzko

    Originally posted by SteveO View Post
    Agreed D2D, with the decline in ticket revenue there simply isn't a budget surplus for any serious renovations to the ice surface in the immediate future. New boards, glass, floor surface replacement, refrigeration alterations, and new seating is an expensive investment, but there's no money in program cookie jar for such a project at this time. The hybrid surface is most likely a compromise based upon the fact it would be much more costly to reduce to an NHL ice surface.
    200 x 90 might also be something of a sweet spot in competitive terms. It would lessen the adjustment needed to play on 200 x 85 ice sheets. Yet it would retain a bit of home ice advantage for a team that usually has an edge in terms of speed.

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    • Re: Minnesota Golden Gopher Season 2018-2019: Fire Motzko

      Originally posted by SteveO View Post
      I'm gonna say $2M+. Lucia thought if they did shrink it, it would be a hybrid.
      The refrigeration system alone could be close to $1M for an arena like this. Especially since they're going to have to tear up the concrete. The removal of that much concrete might take $50,000-$250,000 depending on a number of factors. If I had to guess this is closer to $5-7.5 million. Trying to get the new seats right is going to be difficult. It may require reworking portions of the entire bowl. Also, if you’re going to add that many more people, the HVAC system would likely need to be looked at. As well as code requirements for water closet count. Honestly, this project could be way, way more than what they bargained for.

      I’ve done estimates on local hockey rinks concerting ice sheets and renovating existing refrigeration systems. They are NOT cheap. I’ve also done estimates and projects at the U. You’ve probably seen some of my work at some point if you have ever attended an outdoor hockey game at TCF or been to a football game in November.
      Code:
      As of 9/21/10:         As of 9/13/10:
      College Hockey 6       College Football 0
      BTHC 4                 WCHA FC:  1
      Originally posted by SanTropez
      May your paint thinner run dry and the fleas of a thousand camels infest your dead deer.
      Originally posted by bigblue_dl
      I don't even know how to classify magic vagina smoke babies..
      Originally posted by Kepler
      When the giraffes start building radio telescopes they can join too.
      He's probably going to be a superstar but that man has more baggage than North West

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      • Originally posted by pgb-ohio View Post
        200 x 90 might also be something of a sweet spot in competitive terms. It would lessen the adjustment needed to play on 200 x 85 ice sheets. Yet it would retain a bit of home ice advantage for a team that usually has an edge in terms of speed.
        Stop. You cannot be serious. Anyone, that is anyone, would insist on 200 x 87.5.

        If anyone advises against this they clearly are, and overwhelmingly so, a buffoon full of poppycock.

        Signed a devote UNH fan

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        • Re: Minnesota Golden Gopher Season 2018-2019: Fire Motzko

          University of Illinois has it right when it comes to ice sheet dimensions: 197’x115’

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          • Re: Minnesota Golden Gopher Season 2018-2019: Fire Motzko

            Originally posted by dxmnkd316 View Post
            The refrigeration system alone could be close to $1M for an arena like this. Especially since they're going to have to tear up the concrete. The removal of that much concrete might take $50,000-$250,000 depending on a number of factors. If I had to guess this is closer to $5-7.5 million. Trying to get the new seats right is going to be difficult. It may require reworking portions of the entire bowl. Also, if you’re going to add that many more people, the HVAC system would likely need to be looked at. As well as code requirements for water closet count. Honestly, this project could be way, way more than what they bargained for.

            I’ve done estimates on local hockey rinks concerting ice sheets and renovating existing refrigeration systems. They are NOT cheap. I’ve also done estimates and projects at the U. You’ve probably seen some of my work at some point if you have ever attended an outdoor hockey game at TCF or been to a football game in November.
            Nice post and info dx. Interesting to see your take on it with your experience. I recall engineers were looking at the Kohl ice sheet renovations during Eaves tenure some years ago. IIRC they were looking at $2-3M, but arguably that's a few years ago and there were many unknowns. They commented that they couldn't tell when considering price if the floor anchors could be relocated or a complete floor replacement was the only option. But as you pointed out, there are other factors such as the HVAC that may significantly escalate costs. Mariucci is going to have to punt on this one for a while until Motzko brings back the glory of Golden Gopher hockey.

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            • Re: Minnesota Golden Gopher Season 2018-2019: Fire Motzko

              Originally posted by dxmnkd316 View Post
              The refrigeration system alone could be close to $1M for an arena like this. Especially since they're going to have to tear up the concrete. The removal of that much concrete might take $50,000-$250,000 depending on a number of factors. If I had to guess this is closer to $5-7.5 million. Trying to get the new seats right is going to be difficult. It may require reworking portions of the entire bowl. Also, if you’re going to add that many more people, the HVAC system would likely need to be looked at. As well as code requirements for water closet count. Honestly, this project could be way, way more than what they bargained for.

              I’ve done estimates on local hockey rinks concerting ice sheets and renovating existing refrigeration systems. They are NOT cheap. I’ve also done estimates and projects at the U. You’ve probably seen some of my work at some point if you have ever attended an outdoor hockey game at TCF or been to a football game in November.
              They would probably have to dig deep into the existing foundation to place the rink, in order to accommodate those new seats without interrupting the sightlines for the rest of the bowl's seats. Either that or go with one of two options: 1) completely redesign the bowl for the new seats or 2) go with messed up sightlines for all the existing seats.
              "The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." George Orwell, 1984

              "One does not simply walk into Mordor. Its Black Gates are guarded by more than just Orcs. There is evil there that does not sleep, and the Great Eye is ever watchful. It is a barren wasteland, riddled with fire and ash and dust, the very air you breathe is a poisonous fume." Boromir

              "Good news! We have a delivery." Professor Farnsworth

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              • Re: Minnesota Golden Gopher Season 2018-2019: Fire Motzko

                Originally posted by St. Clown View Post
                They would probably have to dig deep into the existing foundation to place the rink, in order to accommodate those new seats without interrupting the sightlines for the rest of the bowl's seats. Either that or go with one of two options: 1) completely redesign the bowl for the new seats or 2) go with messed up sightlines for all the existing seats.
                That's another thing I didn't even think about. That being said, Maroosh is dug into the ground. So it's less of an issue but I'm guessing the caissons were put in around the perimeter because the weight of the structure is distributed towards the sides. There is very little center support towards the ice (relative to the rest of the arena).

                But if there are any major structural elements that go down 20+ feet under the ice, it's even more complicated. Especially given that there's a roof overhead...

                But to your other point about sightlines, that's kind of what I was getting at when I said the new seats are going to be difficult to get right without reworking portions (large portions) of the existing bowl). The ends and sides should be ok. But anything outside of the blue lines on the sides and outside of the faceoff dots on the ends is going to be fugly.

                I still don't know if this will be done in the next ten years. I'm guessing every time someone comes in and re-estimates it closer to construction, the estimates get larger and probably substantially so. Trying to scope something like this is very hard without getting into it and spending 10-20% of the final cost of construction. If the U doesn't get that preliminary engineering money, this isn't going to be pretty in terms of finances.
                Code:
                As of 9/21/10:         As of 9/13/10:
                College Hockey 6       College Football 0
                BTHC 4                 WCHA FC:  1
                Originally posted by SanTropez
                May your paint thinner run dry and the fleas of a thousand camels infest your dead deer.
                Originally posted by bigblue_dl
                I don't even know how to classify magic vagina smoke babies..
                Originally posted by Kepler
                When the giraffes start building radio telescopes they can join too.
                He's probably going to be a superstar but that man has more baggage than North West

                Comment


                • Re: Minnesota Golden Gopher Season 2018-2019: Fire Motzko

                  Originally posted by BlackI View Post
                  Stop. You cannot be serious. Anyone, that is anyone, would insist on 200 x 87.5.

                  If anyone advises against this they clearly are, and overwhelmingly so, a buffoon full of poppycock.

                  Signed a devote UNH fan
                  Shrug. Beyond snark, what's the significance of 87.5? Width of the Whitt?

                  200 x 100 makes a big difference. Lots of extra of room, and a little tough on players with mediocre speed. Which would be the category I'm in, even at the lowly levels I've played at.

                  Guess I should let the speed guys speak for themselves. But I'd think that an 5 extra feet for the entire length of the rink would amount to enough square footage to be worthwhile.
                  Last edited by pgb-ohio; 07-25-2019, 04:25 PM.

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                  • Re: Minnesota Golden Gopher Season 2018-2019: Fire Motzko

                    Originally posted by dxmnkd316 View Post
                    That's another thing I didn't even think about. That being said, Maroosh is dug into the ground. So it's less of an issue but I'm guessing the caissons were put in around the perimeter because the weight of the structure is distributed towards the sides. There is very little center support towards the ice (relative to the rest of the arena).

                    But if there are any major structural elements that go down 20+ feet under the ice, it's even more complicated. Especially given that there's a roof overhead...

                    But to your other point about sightlines, that's kind of what I was getting at when I said the new seats are going to be difficult to get right without reworking portions (large portions) of the existing bowl). The ends and sides should be ok. But anything outside of the blue lines on the sides and outside of the faceoff dots on the ends is going to be fugly.

                    I still don't know if this will be done in the next ten years. I'm guessing every time someone comes in and re-estimates it closer to construction, the estimates get larger and probably substantially so. Trying to scope something like this is very hard without getting into it and spending 10-20% of the final cost of construction. If the U doesn't get that preliminary engineering money, this isn't going to be pretty in terms of finances.
                    Along the list of the frustrating things, this time from a players/coaches vantage point, is that Mariucci currently has one of the best sheets of ice upon which I've ever skated. I've been to dozens of local high school, community and college rinks, and the X, and I've been to a few rinks out of town, too, and Mariucci's is the best skating ice around. Can they replicate that setup with the replacement cooling system? People want to say yes to that question, but it's a much more difficult thing to replicate than most people would expect. A lot of math in that equation.
                    "The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." George Orwell, 1984

                    "One does not simply walk into Mordor. Its Black Gates are guarded by more than just Orcs. There is evil there that does not sleep, and the Great Eye is ever watchful. It is a barren wasteland, riddled with fire and ash and dust, the very air you breathe is a poisonous fume." Boromir

                    "Good news! We have a delivery." Professor Farnsworth

                    Comment


                    • Re: Minnesota Golden Gopher Season 2018-2019: Fire Motzko

                      Met Center had the best ice I've skated on by far and it's really bizarre how something from afar that seems so elementary could be so vastly different from sheet to sheet.

                      Never skated at Mecca but I've heard the same.

                      Comment


                      • Re: Minnesota Golden Gopher Season 2018-2019: Fire Motzko

                        Complex systems. It’s not just running tubes in concrete.

                        But most likely, it’s the ice crew that keeps it that way.
                        Code:
                        As of 9/21/10:         As of 9/13/10:
                        College Hockey 6       College Football 0
                        BTHC 4                 WCHA FC:  1
                        Originally posted by SanTropez
                        May your paint thinner run dry and the fleas of a thousand camels infest your dead deer.
                        Originally posted by bigblue_dl
                        I don't even know how to classify magic vagina smoke babies..
                        Originally posted by Kepler
                        When the giraffes start building radio telescopes they can join too.
                        He's probably going to be a superstar but that man has more baggage than North West

                        Comment


                        • Re: Minnesota Golden Gopher Season 2018-2019: Fire Motzko

                          Watched the WJSS (World Junior Summer Showcase) Finland/Canada and USA/Sweden games on NHL Network yesterday. Lots of recent NHL draft choices scattered throughout, but most are on the USA squad.

                          Sampo Ranta showed some great speed as the Fins clobbered Canada 8-3. Ranta is leading all scorers after 7 games in the 11-game tournament at USA Hockey Arena in Plymouth, Mich which includes USA, Finland, Canada and Sweden.

                          It's part of the tryout process for the 2020 IIHF World Junior Championships, which will be held Dec. 26-Jan. 5 in the Czech Republic. Ranta was one of the last players cut from the Finnish squad in 2019 that went on to win the tournament’s gold medal, so he's pulling out all the stops hoping to make the 2020 Fin team.

                          Blake McLaughlin and Ryan Johnson are on the USA squad. Blake McLaughlin has spent considerable time with trainer Cal Dietz so far this summer, and has put on some weight. His compete level was strong and added a goal and assist in USA's shellacking of Sweden 6-0 yesterday. This is McLaughlin’s second on-ice camp of the summer after he traveled to Southern California in late June for the Anaheim Ducks development camp.

                          He was second on the Gophers among rookie scorers with five goals and 15 assists in 35 games last season. I expect Blake will elevate his game next season. The BMW line (Burke/McLaughlin/Walker) was fast and productive, a bright spot for the Gophers last season and if Motzko keeps them together, they'll be exciting to watch.

                          USA plays Finland on Friday Aug. 2 @ 4pm and the last game of the WJSS on Sat. @ 4pm vs Canada.

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                          • Re: Minnesota Golden Gopher Season 2018-2019: Fire Motzko

                            Yesterday the Fins got off to a commanding lead against a slow starting USA squad. USA came back in 3rd and nearly tied it up in the last minute but fell short to the Fins 6-5.

                            Sampo Ranta had a nice breakaway for a goal and he leads all scorers going into the final day of the WJSS vs Sweden (1pm). USA vs Canada rivalry in the final game (4pm).

                            Finland vs USA HIGHLIGHTS

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                            • Re: Minnesota Golden Gopher Season 2018-2019: Fire Motzko

                              Originally posted by SteveO View Post
                              Yesterday the Fins got off to a commanding lead against a slow starting USA squad. USA came back in 3rd and nearly tied it up in the last minute but fell short to the Fins 6-5.

                              Sampo Ranta had a nice breakaway for a goal and he leads all scorers going into the final day of the WJSS vs Sweden (1pm). USA vs Canada rivalry in the final game (4pm).

                              Finland vs USA HIGHLIGHTS
                              I happened to see Ranta's breakaway goal yesterday, and my immediate thought was, "Hope we see more of that when he's wearing a Gopher sweater". Based on that one play I won't be surprised if he's chosen as one of the team's shootout specialists on a regular basis.
                              Minnesota Golden Gopher Hockey

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                              • Re: Minnesota Golden Gopher Season 2018-2019: Fire Motzko

                                Originally posted by D2D View Post
                                I happened to see Ranta's breakaway goal yesterday, and my immediate thought was, "Hope we see more of that when he's wearing a Gopher sweater". Based on that one play I won't be surprised if he's chosen as one of the team's shootout specialists on a regular basis.
                                He looked fast, competed hard and was strong around the net throughout the whole tourney. With all the top draft choices, I was surprised he led in scoring. I expected more last year, but a breakout year for Sampo Ranta would be huge.

                                Ryan Johnson got the final goal of the tourney as USA beat Canada 5-3. I thought he played solid conservative D, didn't jump in and join the rush. But he skates well, exits the zone with skill, and he's got a nice shot. He'll be solid on the blueline for the Gophers.

                                USA vs Canada HIGHLIGHTS
                                Last edited by SteveO; 08-03-2019, 07:16 PM.

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