UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

I agree that it is great to have three lines again that can be a threat to score goals, but moving up Grasso to the first line should not change that. Also, nice to have again a PP that can score once in a while. Just seems to me that TyK needs a finisher on the first line, and I do not think that Salvaggio fits that bill. Just based on my observations from the three games that I have seen at home.

It may come to pass later in the season that someone like Grasso (or Blackburn?) will be moved up to the top line - or not. I don't see the need to rush it, frankly. For one, we are starting to see some regular contributions from the top three lines, and there's no need for urgency to "fix" something that's working quite well right now. Let those lines continue to gel and develop. And, let's not forget ... last season (and other past seasons) when UNH has loaded up its top line, the lack of scoring depth across multiple lines has not done the team any favors. I'm sure it would help boost Kelleher's stats in the short run ... but are we trying to get Kelleher a Hobey nomination, or is UNH trying to win hockey games, and get the program turned back in the right direction?



Not to mention Kelleher is a senior, and the guys Grasso is playing with now are (hopefully) going to be teammates for several years into the future. I think some (if not all?) of these points have been raised and made by other posters. They play together enough on the PP as it stands, and I think you'd want to be careful not to create a line of "munchkins" and create an easy target for the opposition's best checking lines.

Let's not forget ... Correale/Poturalski/Kelleher was fun to watch early last season, but ran out of steam as the season progressed when they soaked up the attention of the opposition, which would often neutralize them, and then allow them just bash UNH over the head with their lack of depth issues. And this year's would-be "Munchkin Line" (assuming McNicholas or Nazarian would fill out a line with Kelleher/Grasso) makes the Correale/Poturalski/Kelleher line of last season look like behemoths by comparison.

If you're gonna move Salvaggio - and I'm not there yet myself, but let's say IF - then I'd be leaning more towards someone with some size and potential finishing skills. Vela comes to mind first, then maybe Eiserman or Blackburn, or even BvR if he continues to progress in the coming weeks.

But for now, I'd leave well enough alone. No need for munchkins when we've got cupcakes waiting ...

[deltabravo62]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

Agreed Chuck, a "munchkin" line works on the PP, but creating opportunities even strength with lack of size is a much tougher thing especially when the better competition starts rolling into town. Let the freshman line get more familiar with each other and let Grasso take his bonus time on the first PP. We all know there will be plenty of PP time in the near future with how tightly they are calling the game right now.

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

Of course it's no surprise that Patrick Grasso is HE POW! DT gets a mention for his 2-0 weekend/ .944 save percentage...Oh, also mentioned that Coach U won his 350th HE game (since we are into following the numbers here).

[Snively65]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

I am just here to be the contrarian, to contrast with e.cat just being here to help.

[e.cat]

I am just here to be the contrarian, to contrast with e.cat just being here to help.

Contrarian's are people too so I'm okay with that. In fact, I'm partial to contrarians stemming from my days at UNH in the early seventies! I was a contrarian then because I was not anti-establishment. Now I am. Go figure!

I'm just to help though

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

Also mentioned that Coach U won his 350th HE game (since we are into following the numbers here).

No getting out of line with *other* round numbers, HR. Double secret probation may be in the offing ...

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

No getting out of line with *other* round numbers, HR. Double secret probation may be in the offing ...

...extends wrist (s) for proverbial slap.. happy Halloween!!

[phb]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

Question.

Moved from the area 7-8 years ago. Gave up tickets. Have followed the woes of the program on the board. Caught a few games on tv. But just how bad is it from a fan interest perspective.

I remember Snively rocking. And while the Whit wasn't that, we had good crowds. Turned on the Mack game on youtube this morning and all I saw were empty seats. So what is the true size of the crowd at a game like this?

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

Question.

Moved from the area 7-8 years ago. Gave up tickets. Have followed the woes of the program on the board. Caught a few games on tv. But just how bad is it from a fan interest perspective.

I remember Snively rocking. And while the Whit wasn't that, we had good crowds. Turned on the Mack game on youtube this morning and all I saw were empty seats. So what is the true size of the crowd at a game like this?

True size crowd is a most elusive stat (or so it seems but hey what do I know about these things as Sonar likes to say...) but I'm having a super hard time believing there were 3500 as stated...

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

Question.

Moved from the area 7-8 years ago. Gave up tickets. Have followed the woes of the program on the board. Caught a few games on tv. But just how bad is it from a fan interest perspective.

I remember Snively rocking. And while the Whit wasn't that, we had good crowds. Turned on the Mack game on youtube this morning and all I saw were empty seats. So what is the true size of the crowd at a game like this?

Welcome back! I'll let others who attend more frequently these days answer your question ... but from my standpoint, it's shocking just how far local interest in the program has fallen. And it's not just the "butts in the seats" issue - it just seems the folks whose jobs you may think would include drumming up (or even simply maintaining) interest in the program have become apathetic and disinterested. It's my biggest beef with the guy in charge of the whole operation ... I mean, the guy arrived pretty much simultaneously in his job at UNH with the arrival of the Monarchs in Manchester, and he's been seemingly content all along in ceding his hockey "market share" to the Monarchs ever since. I know several families who live within a 5-10 minute drive of campus who have kids who are heavily into athletics, and when they talk about going to see live hockey, and you ask if they're going to The Whitt at UNH to see live Hockey East action ... the looks you'll get make it abundantly clear they've never heard of it - they're talking strictly Bruins or Monarchs.

UNH Hockey used to be New Hampshire's team. The energy at Snively, the year on the road while The Whitt was under construction, all the concerns about being able to fill a building almost twice the size of Snively, and the first few years in the new building, right up through the first (almost spontaneous) "White Out The Whitt" against Walshy's boys from UMaine at the end of the '99 season, a waiting list for season tix numbering in the thousands, and some serious discussion about arena expansion. All gone ... gradually and I won't recount the various reasons (I'm sure most posters are already at me by this point) but all gone nonetheless.

My guess is you can fit most crowds so far this season comfortably into Snively with a thousand empty seats to spare.

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

Welcome back! I'll let others who attend more frequently these days answer your question ... but from my standpoint, it's shocking just how far local interest in the program has fallen. And it's not just the "butts in the seats" issue - it just seems the folks whose jobs you may think would include drumming up (or even simply maintaining) interest in the program have become apathetic and disinterested. It's my biggest beef with the guy in charge of the whole operation ... I mean, the guy arrived pretty much simultaneously in his job at UNH with the arrival of the Monarchs in Manchester, and he's been seemingly content all along in ceding his hockey "market share" to the Monarchs ever since. I know several families who live within a 5-10 minute drive of campus who have kids who are heavily into athletics, and when they talk about going to see live hockey, and you ask if they're going to The Whitt at UNH to see live Hockey East action ... the looks you'll get make it abundantly clear they've never heard of it - they're talking strictly Bruins or Monarchs.

UNH Hockey used to be New Hampshire's team. The energy at Snively, the year on the road while The Whitt was under construction, all the concerns about being able to fill a building almost twice the size of Snively, and the first few years in the new building, right up through the first (almost spontaneous) "White Out The Whitt" against Walshy's boys from UMaine at the end of the '99 season, a waiting list for season tix numbering in the thousands, and some serious discussion about arena expansion. All gone ... gradually and I won't recount the various reasons (I'm sure most posters are already at me by this point) but all gone nonetheless.

My guess is you can fit most crowds so far this season comfortably into Snively with a thousand empty seats to spare.

Chuck curious just how many could Snively seat??

[Snively65]

Chuck curious just how many could Snively seat??

I think that Snively's seating capacity was 3500 for hockey, expanded to 4500 for a Phish concert in 1994 before conversion. But, the Quonset-hut style played much louder than nearly double the capacity at the Whitt. I doubt that there were more than 2500 bodies in seats at the Mac game on Saturday night, so that pretty much is what Chuck suggests. However, I think that the lack of attendance is not simply alums dying off or bailing on a lousy product on the ice, but also much less interest by students in evening activities beyond their dorm rooms. From when the Whitt opened in 1995 through the glory years in the early 2000's, students filled both ends of the arena, close to 2000 seats. In contrast, on Saturday night there were probably fewer than 300 students, including the band. Yet, without them, the place would be as quiet as a morgue.

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

I think that Snively's seating capacity was 3500 for hockey, expanded to 4500 for a Phish concert in 1994 before conversion. But, the Quonset-hut style played much louder than nearly double the capacity at the Whitt. I doubt that there were more than 2500 bodies in seats at the Mac game on Saturday night, so that pretty much is what Chuck suggests. However, I think that the lack of attendance is not simply alums dying off or bailing on a lousy product on the ice, but also much less interest by students in evening activities beyond their dorm rooms. From when the Whitt opened in 1995 through the glory years in the early 2000's, students filled both ends of the arena, close to 2000 seats. In contrast, on Saturday night there were probably fewer than 300 students, including the band. Yet, without them, the place would be as quiet as a morgue.

Wondered if Halloween festivities had anything to do with the fewer students...but since we sit in 101 we usually have "spill over" with students but that hasn't happened in a couple of seasons. I will say tho more people have been sitting in our section; we usually have a crowd there. Also kind of confused about the Monarch/UNH mention...we talking about sponsorships? Guess I kind of by pass those posts sorry...All I know is I'd like to park in the Alumni Center

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

Wondered if Halloween festivities had anything to do with the fewer students...but since we sit in 101 we usually have "spill over" with students but that hasn't happened in a couple of seasons. I will say tho more people have been sitting in our section; we usually have a crowd there. Also kind of confused about the Monarch/UNH mention...we talking about sponsorships? Guess I kind of by pass those posts sorry...All I know is I'd like to park in the Alumni Center

Simply put ... UNH Hockey had the State of New Hampshire (and arguably the southernmost tip of Maine?) to itself for a long, long time, until the Monarchs arrived with the construction of the Verizon/SNHU Arena in Manchester just after the turn of the century. I'm not sure the folks at UNH did anything great even before then to attract attention to what has (at least for most of my 50+ years) been its flagship athletics program, but the long-time hockey roots in the state - combined with a limited local supply of high profile hockey located only in Durham until 2001 - focused things on UNH Hockey for the statewide market, with little (if any) competition. Right place, right time, etc.

When the Monarchs arrived - and this was just over 5+ years after The Whitt had been opened in a sensationally successful way - I would argue one of the reasons they were able to do this (and arguably one of the reasons the Verizon/SNHU was even built primarily for hockey) was that they'd seen the folks in Durham take a calculated risk in expanding a 3,500 seat arena into a 6,000+ seat arena, filling it regularly every game AND having a well-publicized waiting list for season tickets well into the thousands. Supply and demand - UNH had the supply and an enormous demand for tickets, which did lead to some discussion (albeit briefly and probably never seriously within UNH admin) of the capacity for expanding The Whitt to soak up more of the waiting list. I don't think it's a stretch to say that back then, if The Whitt had been expanded to a 10,000 seat arena, it still would have been packed to capacity. The first few Riverstone trips to Manchester pretty much confirmed that. Heady days, indeed.

But with the Monarchs' arrival, and with most of the state's population being closer to Manchester than to the Seacoast, the folks in Durham HAD to know the longer the Monarchs were in town, the doubling of the in-state hockey "supply" would gradually drain some of the pent-up demand UNH Hockey had enjoyed when it was highly successful on the ice AND in the stands due to high demand for their product. But as the quality of the UNH product slowly but steadily deteriorated ... demand for the tickets began to slip, and the availability of right-priced entertainment in Manchester provided more than double the previous supply (and with most AHL games being weekenders, directly pitted against the weekend-heavy UNH schedule). And when the recession hit a few years later, saving on the travel costs to Durham made the trip for many to Manchester even easier (if not necessary).

While this sea change was going on with the NH statewide hockey market ... what was UNH doing to compete with the Monarchs to at the very least retain its fanbase? Silly crap, pretty much. I'll let the long-time season ticket holders recount the voluminous trail of slights they've been subjected to back when UNH tried to leverage its waiting list against them by cooking up continuous schemes to extract more money from the loyal fanbase. And in retrospect, I've found it highly ironic that when our beloved AD cracked down on the long-standing crowd chants for not being of the PC "family friendly" variety AND began to have editorial control over the playlist - not to mention having the band playing over the crowd chants at the opposing starting line-up - it all hinted at overprotecting a "family" market at The Whitt that the program and its AD have since done very very little to market itself to and pursue.

So overall, it's a very basic tale of supply and demand, and of a supplier that's done a really crappy job of recognizing important changes impacting its market share, and very much squandering a positive demand scenario it had probably done very little to cultivate in the first place. It's been about 50 years since UNH Hockey played home games outdoors, and the two great moves from UNH since then to benefit its product was first to build Snively, and then roughly 30 years later to build The Whitt - the latter of which was a huge gamble that paid off handsomely, and arguably dragged the school and the rest of its campus into the modern era. Another smart move in the old days was to put their home games on free TV statewide (usually NHPTV, but also WMUR and WBIN at times) to increase the program's visibility.

That's been about it. Otherwise, it's been incumbent upon Coach Holt - and more recently Coach Umile - to put an entertaining and winning product on the ice. And that's been an increasingly challenging issue in recent seasons for Coach Umile. But he shouldn't have to do this alone, and BS35+4's having been basically "asleep at the switch" while his Hockey fanbase was allowed to steadily erode in the direction of Manchester has been the chief culprit. JMHO.

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

Thanks Chuck for the explanation of what/ where / and how we are where we are at the 'Whitt. Of course right now (and I haven't been there this season, yet..) the Monarchs I doubt are grabbing a ton of fans with their ECHL product as opposed to the AHL product that was there. I know a season tix holder tho there who loves whatever is on the ice so there's that, and then another (who gets me free tix) who would give anything to see the AHL back in town as the numbers are (and I hate to use this term) 'deplorable' . I cannot even begin to speak for veteran STH's as we've only been in this game for 3 complete seasons but at least this year a few 'perks' were offered mainly in the way of getting in earlier, discounts at the concession stands, and a few other things (don't have the list in front of me). Not that these are game changers but it's a start I suppose...

It's all about the product on the ice...that fills the seats in any venue, no? Glad there are the faithful that do show up game in and game out. I remember when we first started going I talked to an usher who said he'd been working there since the start of the 'Whitt and of course, has seen the good, the bad and the ugly. I asked him why he continued to do the gig and he said "well, no matter how bad UNH is, at least you get to see the good teams like BC play" Sigh. Which of course fills seats when a big team is in town but this season, those will be far and few in between with our schedule (HE teams not included).

Besides teams out in NoDak land where hockey is king, I wonder how many other venues are filled to capacity every weekend? (including the Conte out here...have to say when we've gone to UVM the Gutt is usually pretty packed but not sure of their capacity)...Will those 'heady days' return to UNH? One can only hope but I know where I'll be this weekend...