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  • Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

    Originally posted by HockeyRef View Post
    Man, what a sad state of affairs; I guess all anyone who cares enough can choose to either support who's on the ice, or not. Not that they are not beyond reproach because that's part of the fan thing; we have our opinions on how the team does and that's not going to change now. Still the present team deserves that much and I'm glad fans that have been with the team (like you) still are attending games. No judgement on those who are taking a pass for now; it's a personal choice and I'm sure a hard one to make after years of loyalty. I have to believe that those young men are doing the best they can AND while its darned exasperating at times, it's still UNH hockey. You guys have the hindsight of what was but I still managed to catch a glimpse to stay with it. Clap, clap, clap...

    That is where we are right here and now, I mean, isn't it? One can only hope that the powers that be will do the right thing before it all goes south. If they can't see it, that's beyond pathetic. So please keep showing up; I'm sure the empty seats aren't lost on the guys on the ice. You mention the great ones in your post; Mark Mowers, etc. There IS a great one on the ice, right now, and that's Tyler Kelleher. He will leave a legacy just for being on the "100 club", but that ain't all. I'm glad to say I followed him all 4 years; it's been worth it.
    I missed the first shortie and was coming through the turnstile just in time to see the second. From thereon, it seemed like a competitive game to me, as both teams are really lousy. Tyk seems to have had no room to move in the two games that I have seen this season; he does his usual deking around the opposing players, including his classic spinning-around with the puck glued to his stick, but there is never anyone open to receive a pass, unlike last season with Pots and Correale. In fact, on many occasions, his teammates look no different than the squirts playing between the first and second periods in which all the players converge on the puck simultaneously as they bounce into one another. Tyk is the only UNH player who can skate the puck out of the defensive zone, which leaves the D-men without much to do, other than getting beat by shorties while on the PP, which put the game on Saturday night out of reach in the first five minutes. It will be a long season, but I will continue to show up when I can. And, I am looking forward to my first trip to MSG, evah!
    Last edited by Snively65; 10-24-2016, 06:45 PM.

    Comment


    • Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

      Originally posted by Rover View Post
      I think its only fair to also track Dick's "Umile's Last Stand - The Quest for 400" career losses!

      He has approx. 340 in his career. With 68 games left by Chuck's calculations, that means he goes 8-60 the rest of the way.

      Hmmm....that's doable!
      If there were 20 more L's on his resume, he could have taken both round number *quests* right down to the wire.

      Originally posted by HockeyRef View Post
      Man, what a sad state of affairs; I guess all anyone who cares enough can choose to either support who's on the ice, or not. Not that they are not beyond reproach because that's part of the fan thing; we have our opinions on how the team does and that's not going to change now. Still the present team deserves that much and I'm glad fans that have been with the team (like you) still are attending games. No judgement on those who are taking a pass for now; it's a personal choice and I'm sure a hard one to make after years of loyalty. I have to believe that those young men are doing the best they can AND while its darned exasperating at times, it's still UNH hockey. You guys have the hindsight of what was but I still managed to catch a glimpse to stay with it. Clap, clap, clap...

      That is where we are right here and now, I mean, isn't it? One can only hope that the powers that be will do the right thing before it all goes south. If they can't see it, that's beyond pathetic. So please keep showing up; I'm sure the empty seats aren't lost on the guys on the ice. You mention the great ones in your post; Mark Mowers, etc. There IS a great one on the ice, right now, and that's Tyler Kelleher. He will leave a legacy just for being on the "100 club", but that ain't all. I'm glad to say I followed him all 4 years; it's been worth it.
      I'd say it's already gone south, to be fair. The problem has been that until last season, the slippage had been gradual, and not readily noticeable - almost like trying to watch a glacier melt. You come back at the same time every year and the glacier is a little smaller, and while you don't see the steady melting, you still know it has to be melting. Last season, though, the glacier was transformed into a snowball, and popped into the microwave.

      And worse still ... we are talking about deep structural damage to everything around the program. First it was the energy getting sucked out of the building due to the forces of political correctness, "acceptable" chants/songs, etc. Then the fabled multi-thousand seat waiting list - the one we used to rely upon when some of us discussed expanding the Whitt - eroded and went away. Next, the long-term base of fans gradually fell away, alienated by an AD who used the Men's Hockey program as the slush fund for everything else they were doing, and the gradual fall-off of the entertainment value of a program that was no longer a serious contender for national (or even league) honors.

      The on-ice product has unquestionably deteriorated. A program that used to seek out a challenging schedule and high-profile NC events now looks to paper over the cracks with pseudo-membership in the AHA to try to prop up a head coach who has not only lost the plot, but has also lost his enthusiasm and commitment for basic necessary functions of a successful D-1 head coach. His hand-picked successor is clearly struggling to sell his vision for the program out on the recruiting trails, and the holdover assistant isn't doing much better. I don't even see a concerted effort by the folks in admin to sell tickets (and how late in the pre-season was it before the ST's actually got sent?), unless it's for the new toy across the street. Anyone who doesn't realize Football has passed Hockey at UNH just isn't paying attention.

      So has Hockey already gone south at UNH? Obviously yes. To me, the question is just "how far south"? And while some seem to think (hope/whistle past the graveyard) they've gone south in a temporary "let's go to the Cape for the weekend" way ... I see it more like the program is wandering somewhere in between Richmond and Jacksonville, and it's just getting hotter and hotter with each passing month.

      < insert Waffle House joke here >

      At least in the mid-'80's we could blame a ridiculously difficult interlocking schedule with the WCHA for part of the problems. Who'd ever have guessed it would take an interlocking schedule with the mighty AHA to bring UNH down this time.
      Sworn Enemy of the Perpetually Offended
      Montreal Expos Forever ...

      Comment


      • Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

        Originally posted by Chuck Murray View Post
        If there were 20 more L's on his resume, he could have taken both round number *quests* right down to the wire.



        I'd say it's already gone south, to be fair. The problem has been that until last season, the slippage had been gradual, and not readily noticeable - almost like trying to watch a glacier melt. You come back at the same time every year and the glacier is a little smaller, and while you don't see the steady melting, you still know it has to be melting. Last season, though, the glacier was transformed into a snowball, and popped into the microwave.
        And worse still ... we are talking about deep structural damage to everything around the program. First it was the energy getting sucked out of the building due to the forces of political correctness, "acceptable" chants/songs, etc. Then the fabled multi-thousand seat waiting list - the one we used to rely upon when some of us discussed expanding the Whitt - eroded and went away. Next, the long-term base of fans gradually fell away, alienated by an AD who used the Men's Hockey program as the slush fund for everything else they were doing, and the gradual fall-off of the entertainment value of a program that was no longer a serious contender for national (or even league) honors.

        The on-ice product has unquestionably deteriorated. A program that used to seek out a challenging schedule and high-profile NC events now looks to paper over the cracks with pseudo-membership in the AHA to try to prop up a head coach who has not only lost the plot, but has also lost his enthusiasm and commitment for basic necessary functions of a successful D-1 head coach. His hand-picked successor is clearly struggling to sell his vision for the program out on the recruiting trails, and the holdover assistant isn't doing much better. I don't even see a concerted effort by the folks in admin to sell tickets (and how late in the pre-season was it before the ST's actually got sent?), unless it's for the new toy across the street. Anyone who doesn't realize Football has passed Hockey at UNH just isn't paying attention.

        So has Hockey already gone south at UNH? Obviously yes. To me, the question is just "how far south"? And while some seem to think (hope/whistle past the graveyard) they've gone south in a temporary "let's go to the Cape for the weekend" way ... I see it more like the program is wandering somewhere in between Richmond and Jacksonville, and it's just getting hotter and hotter with each passing month.

        < insert Waffle House joke here >

        At least in the mid-'80's we could blame a ridiculously difficult interlocking schedule with the WCHA for part of the problems. Who'd ever have guessed it would take an interlocking schedule with the mighty AHA to bring UNH down this time.
        Here is my metaphor, Chuck. Our hockey team is like a calving tidewater glacier in West Greenland, which is now retreating much more rapidly than in the past. And, from that rapidly retreating glacier emanates a large iceberg, which melts away as it floats south in the North Atlantic, in search of cup cake AHC ships to sink before the iceberg melts completely.
        Last edited by Snively65; 10-24-2016, 04:41 PM.

        Comment


        • Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

          My take is that UNH is now in the fray not above the fray. We now are solidly treading in shark infested waters and will be until DU rides into the sunset! The transitiion of power from DU to MS is anything but peaceful and is hurting the program right now. DU is nothing more than a well paid consultant at this point. So just step aside and collect your paycheck until the contract runs out. Let the transition go forward and fill the vacancy with a young former defenseman or goalie and move on up out of the fray again!
          GO BLUE/GO UNH

          COLLEGE HOCKEY RULES

          Comment


          • Originally posted by HockeyRef View Post
            Man, what a sad state of affairs; I guess all anyone who cares enough can choose to either support who's on the ice, or not. Not that they are not beyond reproach because that's part of the fan thing; we have our opinions on how the team does and that's not going to change now. Still the present team deserves that much and I'm glad fans that have been with the team (like you) still are attending games. No judgement on those who are taking a pass for now; it's a personal choice and I'm sure a hard one to make after years of loyalty. I have to believe
            that those young men are doing the best they can AND while its darned exasperating at times, it's still UNH hockey. You guys have the hindsight of what was but I still managed to catch a glimpse to stay with it. Clap, clap, clap...

            That is where we are right here and now, I mean, isn't it? One can only hope that the powers that be will do the right thing before it all goes south. If they can't see it, that's beyond pathetic. So please keep showing up; I'm sure the empty seats aren't lost on the guys on the ice. You mention the great ones in your post; Mark Mowers, etc. There IS a great one on the ice, right now, and that's Tyler Kelleher. He will leave a legacy just for being on the "100 club", but that ain't all. I'm glad to say I followed him all 4 years; it's been worth it.
            The only things Mark Mowers and Tyler Kelleher have in common are that they both were born in the USA, they both played for UNH, and they are both forwards. Tyler Kelleher wishes in his dreams that he was anywhere near as good as Mark Mowers. Tyler Kelleher's deficiencies were on full display Saturday night. He's the type of player who thinks that every pass is intended for him and, conversely, that there is no reason to pass to others. On the 1997 team he would have been a third line energy forward.

            Comment


            • Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

              Okay, I've been going back and forth on whether to post this, but given the paroxysms of agony being expressed here, I'm going to throw it out there, as a FWIW. I have zero intention of engaging in a debate about the quality of the source or the veracity of what was shared. I'll (as Watcher did recently), simply put it out here in the threadosphere for consumption.

              About three weeks back, i was at an event in Durham and had a chance run-in with somebody apparently pretty "in the know" with our athletic department. I didn't really take anything too seriously until our beloved Coach Bowes made a beeline for this person, interrupting our conversation for a bit. I figured that maybe this would be somebody with some answers, or at the very least, a perspective on what the he\_\_ is going on.

              I pounced on the chance to ask a few questions (got borderline uncomfortable a couple times), and here's what I heard....

              1. The three-year out was very much a product of a settlement negotiated by the athletic department. WhenI asked why we had this silly transition, I got a look like I had three heads. This person simply said, "Umile did NOT want to go". While this person didn't say the negotiations were acrimonious or anything, it seems clear that this department that some will say has been fiddling while Rome burns has actually had a proactive, while perhaps not overly effective, hand in the exit, in the face of a lifetime contract.

              2. More interestingly, (and this is where I think I pushed too far in my questions), it sounds like there may be some efforts underway to ensure that Sonar doesn't have to wait until 2018 to return to the Whitt. That Chuck's "March to 600" may not actually have the necessary runway to be seen through to completion. Perhaps this is what was meant by "interesting times", and "things happening behind the curtain, from Scarano's preseason interview. Don't know. I guess we'll see, and I know I have fingers crossed.

              I'm simply trying to relay a conversation, not trying to get too deep into conjecture here. I think those that have seen me post know that I prefer facts vs. creating narratives just to try to prove a point. That stated, I will throw one thought out there - IF above are true, I wonder if that has led to some acrimony twixt the department and the program, and has caused some of the lack of attention.

              Again, I have no interest in a debate here - just sharing the unedited facts from a conversation. And I kind of wish that someone like 1932 were still around to provide perspective on what I heard. I wonder if we are too quick to jump on some posters because they don't adhere to the prevailing narrative - that's particularly unfortunate when it happens to be someone who appears to have access that none of us do.
              Signature line intentionally left blank.

              Comment


              • Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

                Originally posted by Greg Ambrose View Post
                The only things Mark Mowers and Tyler Kelleher have in common are that they both were born in the USA, they both played for UNH, and they are both forwards. Tyler Kelleher wishes in his dreams that he was anywhere near as good as Mark Mowers. Tyler Kelleher's deficiencies were on full display Saturday night. He's the type of player who thinks that every pass is intended for him and, conversely, that there is no reason to pass to others. On the 1997 team he would have been a third line energy forward.
                Sounds harsh, but absolutely true. I do think Kelleher would've looked great playing wing on the Sadowski line, a mini-Jason Shipulski, with good ol' what's-his-name on the left wing. Whatever happened to that guy?
                Sworn Enemy of the Perpetually Offended
                Montreal Expos Forever ...

                Comment


                • Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

                  Originally posted by wildcatdc View Post
                  Okay, I've been going back and forth on whether to post this, but given the paroxysms of agony being expressed here, I'm going to throw it out there, as a FWIW. I have zero intention of engaging in a debate about the quality of the source or the veracity of what was shared. I'll (as Watcher did recently), simply put it out here in the threadosphere for consumption.

                  About three weeks back, i was at an event in Durham and had a chance run-in with somebody apparently pretty "in the know" with our athletic department. I didn't really take anything too seriously until our beloved Coach Bowes made a beeline for this person, interrupting our conversation for a bit. I figured that maybe this would be somebody with some answers, or at the very least, a perspective on what the he\_\_ is going on.

                  I pounced on the chance to ask a few questions (got borderline uncomfortable a couple times), and here's what I heard....

                  1. The three-year out was very much a product of a settlement negotiated by the athletic department. WhenI asked why we had this silly transition, I got a look like I had three heads. This person simply said, "Umile did NOT want to go". While this person didn't say the negotiations were acrimonious or anything, it seems clear that this department that some will say has been fiddling while Rome burns has actually had a proactive, while perhaps not overly effective, hand in the exit, in the face of a lifetime contract.

                  2. More interestingly, (and this is where I think I pushed too far in my questions), it sounds like there may be some efforts underway to ensure that Sonar doesn't have to wait until 2018 to return to the Whitt. That Chuck's "March to 600" may not actually have the necessary runway to be seen through to completion. Perhaps this is what was meant by "interesting times", and "things happening behind the curtain, from Scarano's preseason interview. Don't know. I guess we'll see, and I know I have fingers crossed.

                  I'm simply trying to relay a conversation, not trying to get too deep into conjecture here. I think those that have seen me post know that I prefer facts vs. creating narratives just to try to prove a point. That stated, I will throw one thought out there - IF above are true, I wonder if that has led to some acrimony twixt the department and the program, and has caused some of the lack of attention.

                  Again, I have no interest in a debate here - just sharing the unedited facts from a conversation. And I kind of wish that someone like 1932 were still around to provide perspective on what I heard. I wonder if we are too quick to jump on some posters because they don't adhere to the prevailing narrative - that's particularly unfortunate when it happens to be someone who appears to have access that none of us do.
                  Thanks for posting, 'dc. Seriously. I've heard bits & pieces of this from a separate source, so having some of these things from a second source is reassuring all around. And yeah, it would be nice to have 1932 back. We all don't necessarily have to agree all the time, but it's good to have some hearty discussion (and even debate and disagreement) to make this place tick. Otherwise, it can get pretty dull.
                  Sworn Enemy of the Perpetually Offended
                  Montreal Expos Forever ...

                  Comment


                  • Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

                    I get it that the program has def regressed from what it was there is no question. Heck even this wearer of blue and white colored glasses understands that. As for TyK not having a stellar season so far? What, we expect him to carry the team game in and game out? Really? Sigh; he's not the first Senior to have a disappointing end to his career potentially but I hope for his sake it turns out better than it looks right now. He deserves it. Let's evaluate his season / career when it's all said and done, shall we? Sorry I don't have the perspective to put him up against the players you mention; you have the luxury to do that. My bad I guess. I still do not feel he deserves to be discounted.

                    Anyway, go Cubbies on that note!!! Interestingly I found out that Jed Hoyer, their executive Vice President was one of my students when I did a one year stint at Plymouth Elementary back in '83. Wish him the best!
                    Last edited by HockeyRef; 10-24-2016, 07:25 PM.
                    Here we go 'Cats!!

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by wildcatdc View Post
                      Okay, I've been going back and forth on whether to post this, but given the paroxysms of agony being expressed here, I'm going to throw it out there, as a FWIW. I have zero intention of engaging in a debate about the quality of the source or the veracity of what was shared. I'll (as Watcher did recently), simply put it out here in the threadosphere for consumption.

                      About three weeks back, i was at an event in Durham and had a chance run-in with somebody apparently pretty "in the know" with our athletic department. I didn't really take anything too seriously until our beloved Coach Bowes made a beeline for this person, interrupting our conversation for a bit. I figured that maybe this would be somebody with some answers, or at the very least, a perspective on what the he\_\_ is going on.

                      I pounced on the chance to ask a few questions (got borderline uncomfortable a couple times), and here's what I heard....

                      1. The three-year out was very much a product of a settlement negotiated by the athletic department. WhenI asked why we had this silly transition, I got a look like I had three heads. This person simply said, "Umile did NOT want to go". While this person didn't say the negotiations were acrimonious or anything, it seems clear that this department that some will say has been fiddling while Rome burns has actually had a proactive, while perhaps not overly effective, hand in the exit, in the face of a lifetime contract.

                      2. More interestingly, (and this is where I think I pushed too far in my questions), it sounds like there may be some efforts underway to ensure that Sonar doesn't have to wait until 2018 to return to the Whitt. That Chuck's "March to 600" may not actually have the necessary runway to be seen through to completion. Perhaps this is what was meant by "interesting times", and "things happening behind the curtain, from Scarano's preseason interview. Don't know. I guess we'll see, and I know I have fingers crossed.

                      I'm simply trying to relay a conversation, not trying to get too deep into conjecture here. I think those that have seen me post know that I prefer facts vs. creating narratives just to try to prove a point. That stated, I will throw one thought out there - IF above are true, I wonder if that has led to some acrimony twixt the department and the program, and has caused some of the lack of attention.

                      Again, I have no interest in a debate here - just sharing the unedited facts from a conversation. And I kind of wish that someone like 1932 were still around to provide perspective on what I heard. I wonder if we are too quick to jump on some posters because they don't adhere to the prevailing narrative - that's particularly unfortunate when it happens to be someone who appears to have access that none of us do.
                      Right, so gleaning from your post, and I respect your wish not to debate here, DU is going out kicking and screaming! Furthermore, this transition is not of his liking! Am I getting this correct? Anyway, this is my perception as a long time casual observer, the transition is not pretty. Hey DU has done a lot of good things for the program but times change and it's time for that change to happen! For DU to hang in for what can only be characterized as selfish reasons is untenable at best. Take your friggin medicine and your bloated bank account and move on!
                      GO BLUE/GO UNH

                      COLLEGE HOCKEY RULES

                      Comment


                      • Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

                        Thanks Wildcatdc. I do love tea leaves.

                        Originally posted by wildcatdc View Post
                        1. The three-year out was very much a product of a settlement negotiated by the athletic department. When I asked why we had this silly transition, I got a look like I had three heads. This person simply said, "Umile did NOT want to go".... in the face of a lifetime contract.
                        There is an interesting question not answered here. Probably not one anyone wants to articulate.
                        The Umile legacy:
                        14-15 8th place,
                        15-16 10th place
                        16-17 10th place
                        17-18 11th place
                        18-19 8th place
                        19-20 9th place
                        20-21 10th place
                        21-22 9th place

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by e.cat View Post
                          Right, so gleaning from your post, and I respect your wish not to debate here, DU is going out kicking and screaming! Furthermore, this transition is not of his liking! Am I getting this correct? Anyway, this is my perception as a long time casual observer, the transition is not pretty. Hey DU has done a lot of good things for the program but times change and it's time for that change to happen! For DU to hang in for what can only be characterized as selfish reasons is untenable at best. Take your friggin medicine and your bloated bank account and move on!
                          I understand your question, Ecat, but again, I don't want to misrepresent the conversation as being any more than it was. The person got an extremely surprised look on their face when I asked the question, and I've quoted their answer verbatim.
                          Signature line intentionally left blank.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by wildcatdc View Post
                            I understand your question, Ecat, but again, I don't want to misrepresent the conversation as being any more than it was. The person got an extremely surprised look on their face when I asked the question, and I've quoted their answer verbatim.
                            Okay no worries dc. Maybe we can get a wikileaks on it
                            GO BLUE/GO UNH

                            COLLEGE HOCKEY RULES

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by e.cat View Post
                              Okay no worries dc. Maybe we can get a wikileaks on it
                              I think they have their hands full. 😄
                              Signature line intentionally left blank.

                              Comment


                              • Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 -- We're Going to Have a Hockey Season Here!!

                                Originally posted by Chuck Murray View Post
                                His hand-picked successor is clearly struggling to sell his vision for the program out on the recruiting trails, and the holdover assistant isn't doing much better.
                                I posted this earlier and deleted it because the real blame here belongs with the two guys who have been here the longest and make the most money but I really sense the succession team isn't going to be up to the task and it's adding insult to injury to think we're going to have to spend the next 5 years proving what many of us suspect right now. I guess we'll have to wait until October of 2021 to know if that's correct but I can't help thinking we're only just getting started on wasting 5 years to get right back to where we are now.
                                I went home with a waitress the way I always do
                                How was I to know she was with the russians, too?

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