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UNH Wildcats 2015-2016 (Part One) - Return of the "Champions of December"??

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  • Originally posted by Dan View Post
    I think plenty of people are on Umile's case, but Borek is going to have to shoulder his fair share of the blame since he was given so much responsibility. We all know he's your friend and none of us have ever heard anything other than that he is a world-class human being and a hard-worker, but despite some occasional good gets UNH Hockey (and the team's overall talent level) has slowly but consistently declined to where it is now due to his failures as the lead recruiter...

    Coaching is a results based business. Below is Borek's record as an associate and HC - take note of where the programs start and where they finish. (I could only find overall coaching records at Colby)

    Colby
    Previous Coach - 28-33-7 (.463)
    Borek - 33-35-5 (.486)
    Following Coach (Tortorella) - 230-138-33 (.615)

    Lake State
    1995-96 - 30-8-2 (Jackson)
    1996-97 - 19-14-5
    1997-98 - 15-18-4
    1998-99 - 11-23-4
    1999-00 - 18-16-2
    2000-01 - 13-23-0
    2001-02 - 8-27-2 (Anzalone)

    New England College
    2000-01 - 20-10-0 (Previous)
    2001-02 - 14-11-2
    2002-03 - 20-6-0 (Following)

    UNH
    2001-02 - 30-7-3 (McCloskey)
    2002-03 - 28-8-6
    2003-04 - 20-15-6
    2004-05 - 26-11-5
    2005-06 - 20-13-7
    2006-07 - 26-11-2
    2007-08 - 25-10-3
    2008-09 - 20-13-5
    2009-10 - 18-14-7
    2010-11 - 22-11-6
    2011-12 - 15-18-3
    2012-13 - 20-12-7
    2013-14 - 22-18-1
    2014-15 - 19-19-2
    2015-16 - 4-6-3 (Souza)

    Umile ultimately deserves the blame as the HC (including the failures of those on his staff) and should have retired years ago, but Borek simply did not live up to his reputation as one of the best recruiters in college hockey history while at UNH. Or at Lake State, etc. Where would UMass be if they had hired Borek? Probably right where they are...
    It doesn't make you suspicious that UMass passed over a AHC in a successful program for a asst coach at a cellar dweller?? His responsibility at UNH went beyond head recruiter, but we'll just have to see what happens to the 2 programs in the next few years. I know his work ethic and his loyalty to his employer, he'll never take anything for granted, ever.
    He didn't leave any thing to chance and was always looking for other ways to get an advantage. Beantown, team camp were all at UNH. do you know how many elite recruits spent time in the Whitt? As a Wildcat fan and SB supporter I wish the original plan for him to be the HC had happened 7-8 years ago. Then if he were no longer here it would all be on him.

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    • Re: UNH Wildcats 2015-2016 (Part One) - Return of the "Champions of December"??

      Originally posted by bomberhockey View Post
      It was shocking how easy Bentley gained entry into the defensive zone and not just on odd man rushes. The defense had to give up some gap if theyre not getting help from an effective back check, way too many d zone breakdowns and some soft goals. They were better while on PK in the d zone. Only saw it once, maybe missed some things.
      What do you attribute the d zone breakdowns to? Is lack of talent, lack of effort, forwards not helping, poor coaching or just a combination of these?
      GO BLUE/GO UNH

      COLLEGE HOCKEY RULES

      Comment


      • Re: UNH Wildcats 2015-2016 (Part One) - Return of the "Champions of December"??

        Originally posted by bomberhockey View Post
        The word you heard was false.
        You know Borek got McCloskey in the college game? And I can assure you Borek is one of the best recruiters there is. Not denigrating Brian's ability to recruit, but SB is tireless and tenacious. You look at him as the reason for the "recruiting failures" but how many number 2 picks in the draft came here before JvR? How about the 2 NHL blue liners? You blame him for the guys that got away but not credit for who did. This wasn't his program, he did what he could do to keep the wildcat competitive from his position. And the recruits that did come came here on a discount the SB negotiated, you'd be shocked at how few "full boats" were given even to some big time recruits. He was the candidate for the UMass job from sources on both sides until he was not the candidate. What would UMass look like now if the AD had pulled the trigger on THE candidate.
        Take a look at how many NHL pictures are in the hall since SB came in.
        Oh and I've been a fan since 1965, DII Wildcats. Before DU came as a player.
        Slow down bro! To your first claim, I'll just tell you that I was pretty plugged in back then and the information I got, although not directly from Umile, was pretty impeachable. Now maybe he changed his mind but I would ask you this. If he did desire to be a head coach again, wouldn't you think that he would be jumping at other chances that may have come his way rather than playing the wait and watch game with Umile? Umile obviously gave him no assurances that he was the lead candidate to replace him. Second, although I don't know its relevancy here, I know that Borek was instrumental for McCloskey because I did a long interview with Brian when he took the women's job and he told me. Third, not sure if Borek ever slept in the back seat of his car in the outskirts of Sioux Falls, but Brian did (unless he was embellishing). And I have no doubt that Borek was "tireless and tenacious", just like Brian. But was he "effective?" As for the #2 picks, the dmen in the NHL, all well and good. Those are feathers in his cap. But I do not invest my time following UNH Hockey solely because I want to see our players advance to the next level. I have spent a heck of a lot of time over the past 40+ years following the team because I enjoy the college game, it connects me to my school and, UNH has historically played a great brand of hockey. Since you've been a fan longer than I, you know that UNH played an exciting brand of hockey in the 70's into the early 80's, had a fallow period in the late 80's, then came back full bore when Umile, then McCloskey took over. If you want to assert that the teams of the last five years or so are equal to the teams that took the ice from 1996-97 through 2002-03, go ahead. I doubt if you would find many who agree with you. As for your tale that Borek was a finalist for the UMass job, what does it say that they instead took someone with no head coaching experience and was an assistant at a program with half the success of UNH? And, btw, I can't help it if you are older than me. Yesterday was my mother's 100th birthday. If she was still around, I might ask her why I wasn't born sooner.

        Comment


        • Re: UNH Wildcats 2015-2016 (Part One) - Return of the "Champions of December"??

          Originally posted by bomberhockey View Post
          I wish the original plan for him to be the HC had happened 7-8 years ago. Then if he were no longer here it would all be on him.
          So you are saying that when Borek was hired he came because of promise that he would succeed Umile as head coach?

          Comment


          • Originally posted by e.cat View Post
            What do you attribute the d zone breakdowns to? Is lack of talent, lack of effort, forwards not helping, poor coaching or just a combination of these?
            I can't pretend to know the answer to that. I think that the loss of BP was big but unavoidable. Masonius not coming maybe a little. Chemistry? That's a strength of DU but is it still? What is the communication like? The attitude?

            Comment


            • Re: UNH Wildcats 2015-2016 (Part One) - Return of the "Champions of December"??

              Originally posted by bomberhockey View Post
              No, everyone that decommitted did so of their own accord. "They no longer knew anyone in the program". Others may have but were advised not to, or made more whole in the commitment to them.
              Thanks again. You describe a situation in which Umile is quite disengaged, beyond delegating to others. I heard that he was more engaged in the early 2000s, ie Sean Collins. Has he gradually become less interested in recruiting, and if so, is one manifestation of this a choice not to go to bat against admissions? Is it a hubris in which he believes his system is most important and he minimize the role of talent? It sure sounds like it's to late to teach a dog New tricks, and that Souza has to rebuild the entire organizational involvement with kids.
              The Umile legacy:
              14-15 8th place,
              15-16 10th place
              16-17 10th place
              17-18 11th place
              18-19 8th place
              19-20 9th place
              20-21 10th place
              21-22 9th place

              Comment


              • Re: UNH Wildcats 2015-2016 (Part One) - Return of the "Champions of December"??

                Originally posted by Felger View Post
                Dan

                Thanks for this...love your insight. How do you see the goaltending situation play out going forward? Also, will all three be getting full rides? If so, it seems that tying up three scholarships on goalies makes an already difficult recruiting situation that much tougher
                Honestly, I don't know the absolute specifics of any of the three's offers - when I refer to them as scholarship goalies, I'm referencing the fact that all three will be receiving some athletic based aid while at UNH (while a player like Reagan is recruited with the understanding he'll likely walk-on and play an emergency role all four years). Its possible and likely, that all three will have scholarships for the next two seasons, but that doesn't necessarily mean three full year scholarships.

                Hockey is an equivalency sport, which means DI programs have 18 scholarships to divide up over its entire roster. Some schools will stick to an x-for-4 model, meaning that a 2-for-4 would have two years paid for and two years uncovered, but they don't have to. Hypothetically, Clark could get 50% for the next two years, Tirone could get 75% and Robinson could get 75% meaning they'd have three goalies all receiving money for 2.00 scholarships per season.

                There are other ways to manipulate equivalency scholarships as well. Let's say, again hypothetically, Foegel was receiving a full scholarship for this season and UNH was concerned that the goaltending log-jam would eat up too much money over the next two seasons. UNH could take Foegel's second semester money and (after discussing with the family) give it to one of the goalies, reducing their scholarship over the next two years by that amount and freeing that money up for skaters.

                There is also the possibility - although I can't imagine Umile doing so - to simply take money away from a student athlete as NLI's are still (for most schools) one-year agreements. Now, you are NOT supposed to take away money for athletic reasons, but the NCAA language is vague and less loyal/ethical coaches (across all sports) have been doing this for years under the guise of a 'one year aid agreement'. They are one year agreements, but on-ice production or over recruiting were never intended to lead to non-renewals...
                Last edited by Dan; 12-03-2015, 12:19 PM.
                Live Free or Die!!
                Miami University '03

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Greg Ambrose View Post
                  So you are saying that when Borek was hired he came because of promise that he would succeed Umile as head coach?
                  He was under the impression that he was going to take the reigns in a relatively short period of time, provided they stayed relevant. The original timeline came and went and nothing happened for more than double the original timeline. SB knew that wasn't a given as it is now bu it was assured. Until recently I believe he had a contract that lapsed one year after DU's did, ongoing just in case.
                  I take no pleasure in speaking about this as DU is a gracious man that is a legend. And he was supportive of SB during emailgate unlike the guy across the street. (Emailgate is another story altogether)
                  I feel that no where else would an associate head coach be so relevant in this programs outcome. Does anyone even think of assistants at other programs?
                  So yes is the concise answer, "after a national search" of course.

                  Comment


                  • Re: UNH Wildcats 2015-2016 (Part One) - Return of the "Champions of December"??

                    Originally posted by bomberhockey View Post
                    It doesn't make you suspicious that UMass passed over a AHC in a successful program for a asst coach at a cellar dweller?? His responsibility at UNH went beyond head recruiter, but we'll just have to see what happens to the 2 programs in the next few years. I know his work ethic and his loyalty to his employer, he'll never take anything for granted, ever.
                    He didn't leave any thing to chance and was always looking for other ways to get an advantage. Beantown, team camp were all at UNH. do you know how many elite recruits spent time in the Whitt? As a Wildcat fan and SB supporter I wish the original plan for him to be the HC had happened 7-8 years ago. Then if he were no longer here it would all be on him.
                    I don't pretend to know why UMass made the decision they did - but, you're going to have a hard time convincing me that Borek would have them competing for championships. I am aware of much talent skated at the Whitt every year...

                    http://www.ushr.com/news/20130802/49...0s-at-UNH-Camp

                    ...as well as the fact that almost none of that elite talent ever ended up at UNH.
                    Live Free or Die!!
                    Miami University '03

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Chuck Murray View Post
                      How recently did the "yes then no" part kick in, then? If you're comfortable offering specifics, cool - if not, then a vague timeframe would be helpful. Hard to believe the de-commits wouldn't at least be an "effect" of any post-June fallout ... which I think you kind of confirm by mentioning the quote above. I'm not sure about that last bit ("Others ... made more whole ... "), other than it sounds like offers may have had to be improved to prevent further defections???
                      To your last question yes a 50 or 75% was made a full. Which with 18 scholarships you better be right on with your prospect. As I said before some big recruits, significant pieces came here on less than a full.

                      Comment


                      • Re: UNH Wildcats 2015-2016 (Part One) - Return of the "Champions of December"??

                        Originally posted by bomberhockey View Post
                        And he was supportive of SB during emailgate unlike the guy across the street. (Emailgate is another story altogether).
                        This I'll agree with this - I've known coaches at rival programs of my own, who have reported making this mistake and received the most minor of secondary violations if anything at all. I had no interest in seeing them punished any further nor did I feel like I lost any advantage due to their honest mistakes. NCAA compliance officers will tell coaches consistently, that secondary and minor violations are no big deal. They don't expect you to know the rule book like the back of your hand or avoid making mistakes entirely. In fact, if you're not making these small mistakes they become more suspicious (and assume you may be covering violations up!).

                        Recruiting software is confusing enough now - and it has come a long way since 'emailgate'. Accidentally sending an email to 20-30 not of age recruits (that could have been as innocent as "hey, FYI were playing a top-five match-up with BC this weekend!") did not deserve the severity of the self-imposed sanctions. I don't know what the email actually said, but its rare you send mass emails with anything important pertaining to a kid's individual recruitment. Additionally, every coach in the country will get those messages to the kids by sending them to their coach and having he/she forward them along. So UNH and Borek faced embarrassment and stiff sanctions for skipping the middleman loop hole...
                        Last edited by Dan; 12-03-2015, 12:33 PM.
                        Live Free or Die!!
                        Miami University '03

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Dan View Post
                          This I'll agree with this - I've known coaches at rival programs of my own, who have reported making this mistake and received the most minor of secondary violations if anything at all. I had no interest in seeing them punished any further nor did I feel like I lost any advantage due to their honest mistakes. NCAA compliance officers will tell coaches consistently, that secondary and minor violations are no big deal. They don't expect you to know the rule book like the back of your hand or avoid making mistakes entirely. In fact, if you're not making these small mistakes they become more suspicious (and assume you may be covering violations up!).

                          Recruiting software is confusing enough now - and it has come a long way since 'emailgate'. Accidentally sending an email to 20-30 not of age recruits (that could have been as innocent as "hey, FYI were playing a top-five match-up with BC this weekend!") did not deserve the severity of the self-imposed sanctions. I don't know what the email actually said, but its rare you send mass emails with anything important pertaining to a kid's individual recruitment. Additionally, every coach in the country will get those messages to the kids by sending them to their coach and having he/she forward them along. So UNH and Borek faced embarrassment and stiff sanctions for skipping the middleman loop hole...
                          And When a competitive coach realized he did it, he told him to stop and just don't tell anyone , SB turned himself in, he probably would have been alright if he didn't. I know I'm pumping his tires he isn't perfect, but he looks at things differently than most. He sees the things that may devastate most and turns them into a positive, his abrupt end to playing career, getting fired at LSSU and his house fire.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Chuck Murray View Post
                            How recently did the "yes then no" part kick in, then? If you're comfortable offering specifics, cool - if not, then a vague timeframe would be helpful. Hard to believe the de-commits wouldn't at least be an "effect" of any post-June fallout ... which I think you kind of confirm by mentioning the quote above. I'm not sure about that last bit ("Others ... made more whole ... "), other than it sounds like offers may have had to be improved to prevent further defections???
                            The end started ok but after all was said and done they were Done. They won't be exchanging Christmas cards. Yes they had to offer more to keep one that I know about.

                            Comment


                            • Re: UNH Wildcats 2015-2016 (Part One) - Return of the "Champions of December"??

                              Bomber, are you happy with the Souza appointment? Or did you/ do you think a 'national search' should have been implemented? Just curious.
                              Here we go 'Cats!!

                              Comment


                              • Re: UNH Wildcats 2015-2016 (Part One) - Return of the "Champions of December"??

                                Originally posted by bomberhockey View Post
                                He was under the impression that he was going to take the reigns in a relatively short period of time, provided they stayed relevant. The original timeline came and went and nothing happened for more than double the original timeline. SB knew that wasn't a given as it is now bu it was assured. Until recently I believe he had a contract that lapsed one year after DU's did, ongoing just in case.
                                I take no pleasure in speaking about this as DU is a gracious man that is a legend. And he was supportive of SB during emailgate unlike the guy across the street. (Emailgate is another story altogether)
                                I feel that no where else would an associate head coach be so relevant in this programs outcome. Does anyone even think of assistants at other programs?
                                So yes is the concise answer, "after a national search" of course.
                                Thanks for sharing. Always interesting to get another perspective on things.

                                Hoping DU and SB patch things up someday. 10 years working in close quarters is tough to walk away from.
                                Sworn Enemy of the Perpetually Offended
                                Montreal Expos Forever ...

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