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Wisconsin Hockey: Episode XXXI: A New Hope

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  • Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Episode XXXI: A New Hope

    Originally posted by WiscTJK View Post
    Because the top programs get their freshman to perform right away... Not just when they are juniors and seniors.

    Plus other teams have "unexpected" departures and they don't seem to be so affected by it. At least they don't use it as a constant excuse.
    The other teams thing is largely a fallacy. There are very few freshman in NCAA hockey that perform at the high end on top lines unless they are playing with an experienced and talented player to make things go. Even Eichel, who is a real exception and could do much anyway, is playing with Jr. Danny O' Regan, a WJ team veteran, and U-18 World champion. Or for example gopher frosh had Rau, who is not on the previous list because he's only a third round pick playing in his 4th yr.
    Originally posted by WiscTJK
    I'm with Wisko and Tim.
    Originally posted by Timothy A
    Other than Wisko McBadgerton and Badger Bob, who is universally loved by all?

    Comment


    • Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Episode XXXI: A New Hope

      Originally posted by Wisko McBadgerton View Post
      The other teams thing is largely a fallacy. There are very few freshman in NCAA hockey that perform at the high end on top lines unless they are playing with an experienced and talented player to make things go. Even Eichel, who is a real exception and could do much anyway, is playing with Jr. Danny O' Regan, a WJ team veteran, and U-18 World champion. Or for example gopher frosh had Rau, who is not on the previous list because he's only a third round pick playing in his 4th yr.
      OK, let's say your are right. Than it is critical for the coach to even out the classes to ensure an NCAA tournament caliber team almost every year. Whatever the reason, the up and down roller coaster of results every 3-4 years is unacceptable for Wisconsin hockey. Other coaches manage the situation just fine.
      gwhinwi's: Wisconsin Badgers Recruiting Spreadsheet & Individual Face-Off Statistics

      EODS: De-Commit / Non-Pro Early Departure List

      Comment


      • Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Episode XXXI: A New Hope

        Originally posted by WiscTJK View Post
        OK, let's say your are right. Than it is critical for the coach to even out the classes to ensure an NCAA tournament caliber team almost every year. Whatever the reason, the up and down roller coaster of results every 3-4 years is unacceptable for Wisconsin hockey. Other coaches manage the situation just fine.
        Yes. Let us say I am right, not only because I like the sound of it, but because I am.

        And yes, it is critical to even out classes, which is exactly what I and most others have been saying all along. Not this 13 freshman and two checking Sr.s would produce better at MN or UND nonsense. The really relevant question then is: How is that done, and/or why hasn't it been done here? The answer to that isn't "nobody else has had a problem with it." It's something more specific to the Badger's situation that you have to sort through if you want to know. Or you can just generalize, I guess.

        Folks might be surprised, but I do think there are specific things that Eaves and co. are at fault for.
        Originally posted by WiscTJK
        I'm with Wisko and Tim.
        Originally posted by Timothy A
        Other than Wisko McBadgerton and Badger Bob, who is universally loved by all?

        Comment


        • Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Episode XXXI: A New Hope

          Why is Keegan Ford still on the roster on the schools website? For some reason this irks me.
          WISCONSIN BADGERS
          NCAA Championships: 1973, 1977, 1981, 1983, 1990, and 2006
          WCHA Regular Season Champions: 1977, 1990, and 2000
          WCHA Tournament Champions: 1970, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1982, 1983, 1988, 1990, 1995, 1998, and 2013
          B1G Tournament Champions: 2014
          Hobey Baker winner: #5 Blake Geoffrion

          Comment


          • Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Episode XXXI: A New Hope

            Originally posted by Wisko McBadgerton View Post
            Folks might be surprised, but I do think there are specific things that Eaves and co. are at fault for.

            Like having this become a cycle that we seem to be doomed to repeat for all of eternity?


            Are you our new Baghdad Bob?

            Comment


            • Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Episode XXXI: A New Hope

              Originally posted by Gurtholfin View Post


              Are you our new Baghdad Bob?
              Nope. I just like to look deeper into things.

              Give you an example: Awhile back I made some money on a company who's stock dipped on news that a container ship carrying their inbound products sunk. One full container ship can carry a hell of a lot of stuff. Big blow to the Company right? Well to make it a lot shorter, it turns out that it was pretty darn important to actually know specifically what was in the containers.
              Originally posted by WiscTJK
              I'm with Wisko and Tim.
              Originally posted by Timothy A
              Other than Wisko McBadgerton and Badger Bob, who is universally loved by all?

              Comment


              • Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Episode XXXI: A New Hope

                Look as deeply as you'd like. Certainly no one can accuse you of being reactionary. You do spend a lot of time defending Eaves though and looking for reasons (excuses) for why things are the way they are.


                My question is how long does Eaves get? This is the start of his 4th cycle (?) of unbalanced classes.

                I think we've seen enough. Seems that many ticket buyers agree with me.

                One cycle, maybe two is understandable. To have this continuing shows that he doesn't know how to correct the situation.


                He's had enough of a chance. The state of the program is deplorable. Don't care about excuses anymore.

                Time for a new direction.
                Last edited by Gurtholfin; 12-12-2014, 04:48 PM.

                Comment


                • Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Episode XXXI: A New Hope

                  Originally posted by Gurtholfin View Post
                  Look as deeply as you'd like. Certainly no one can accuse you of being reactionary.

                  My question though is how long does Eaves get? This is the start of his 4th cycle (at least) of unbalanced classes.

                  I think we've seen enough. Seems that many ticket buyers agree with me.

                  One cycle, maybe two is understandable. To have this continuing shows that he doesn't know how to correct the situation.


                  He's had enough of a chance. The state of the program is deplorable. Don't care about excuses anymore.

                  Time for a new direction.
                  Not saying that's an unfair position to take.

                  I think part of how one might look at Eaves culpability in not fixing the unbalanced classes, is related to if you would view Keegan Ford as a recruiting miss or not.
                  Originally posted by WiscTJK
                  I'm with Wisko and Tim.
                  Originally posted by Timothy A
                  Other than Wisko McBadgerton and Badger Bob, who is universally loved by all?

                  Comment


                  • Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Episode XXXI: A New Hope

                    Originally posted by Wisko McBadgerton View Post
                    You make several points which I'd like to get to as time permits, for now I'll just offer this about this point. Here are the 1st and 2nd round gofer picks since '06 and how long they stayed in school: (not in order)

                    Brady Skjei (1st) in 3rd year
                    Aaron Ness (2nd) 3yrs
                    Nico Sacchetti (2nd) 4Yrs.
                    Nick Leddy (1st) 1yr
                    Zach Budish (2nd) 4Yrs
                    Jordan Schroeder (1st) 2 yr
                    Nick Bjugstad (1st) 3 yrs
                    Mark Alt (2nd) 3yrs
                    Justin Holl (2nd) 4 yrs
                    Patrick White (1st) 4yrs
                    Jim O'Brien (1st) 1 yr
                    Mike Hoeffel (2nd)4 yrs
                    Erik Johnson (1st) 1 yr
                    Phil Kessel (1st) 1 yr
                    Kyle Okposo (1st)2 yrs
                    David Fischer (1st)4 yrs

                    As you can see, 10/16 stayed at least 3, and 5 of those stayed 4 years.
                    I don't know that comparing to the Gophers is entirely fair. I don't mean this in a smug way either.

                    The reality is that many of the players that come to the U grew up in its shadow. In particular, kids in the Twin Cities. I can't tell you how many times over the years that I have had players that commit to the Gophers tell me how they went to games at Mariucci quite often growing up. There is a sense of connection to the program because of it. They grew up with it. This plants a seed in their head and once they get there, they are (often times) not in any hurry to leave. Schools that rely more on talent that develops at distant locales (usually because their local talent base isn't as strong/deep) don't have that same situation.

                    (PS - A few of the names above stayed longer than many had hoped... simply because they didn't develop to the level that their draft position projected).
                    University of Minnesota

                    Twitter: Hammy Hockey

                    Comment


                    • Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Episode XXXI: A New Hope

                      Originally posted by Hammy View Post
                      I don't know that comparing to the Gophers is entirely fair. I don't mean this in a smug way either.

                      The reality is that many of the players that come to the U grew up in its shadow. In particular, kids in the Twin Cities. I can't tell you how many times over the years that I have had players that commit to the Gophers tell me how they went to games at Mariucci quite often growing up. There is a sense of connection to the program because of it. They grew up with it. This plants a seed in their head and once they get there, they are (often times) not in any hurry to leave. Schools that rely more on talent that develops at distant locales (usually because their local talent base isn't as strong/deep) don't have that same situation.

                      (PS - A few of the names above stayed longer than many had hoped... simply because they didn't develop to the level that their draft position projected).
                      What was Rau's draft status?

                      Never mind--I see he went in the 3rd Boy, you keep many third rounders like that for 4, you will win a lot of hockey games.
                      Last edited by burd; 12-12-2014, 05:52 PM.

                      Comment


                      • Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Episode XXXI: A New Hope

                        Originally posted by Gurtholfin View Post
                        You do spend a lot of time defending Eaves though and looking for reasons (excuses) for why things are the way they are.

                        Since you edited in this part in after/during my reply I'll respond to it: From your point of view I do suppose you see it as me defending Eaves. Maybe because you want Eaves gone, I don't know. From my point of view I feel I tend toward pointing out facts that I think are in conflict with certain opinions that often seem to be widely held. And I


                        Holy Crap! Paape just scored again!
                        Originally posted by WiscTJK
                        I'm with Wisko and Tim.
                        Originally posted by Timothy A
                        Other than Wisko McBadgerton and Badger Bob, who is universally loved by all?

                        Comment


                        • Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Episode XXXI: A New Hope

                          The stats on players leaving early puts this problem into sharp relief. However, like it or not, early departures are not endemic to Wisconsin Hockey. Nodak, Michigan, Minnesota, BC, BU, everybody has them. What *might* be unique to Wisconsin is the # of players who really aren't considered blue chippah's who leave early. I'm talking Brendan Woods, Matt Auffrey types etc
                          Everything in its right place, Wisconsin Hockey National Champs!


                          "but you're not as confused as him are you. it's not your job to be as confused as Nigel". Tap pt 1.

                          "I think it's ****ing stock. What--? Which part of that is unclear to you? I think it sounds stock to my ears. I mean, do you want me to write it down?" Tap Pt. 2

                          Who???! So What!!!! Big Deal!!!!

                          Comment


                          • Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Episode XXXI: A New Hope

                            Originally posted by solovsfett View Post
                            The stats on players leaving early puts this problem into sharp relief. However, like it or not, early departures are not endemic to Wisconsin Hockey. Nodak, Michigan, Minnesota, BC, BU, everybody has them. What *might* be unique to Wisconsin is the # of players who really aren't considered blue chippah's who leave early. I'm talking Brendan Woods, Matt Auffrey types etc
                            I'm curious how much Eaves' personality has to do with players leaving. Just sayin'.

                            Comment


                            • Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Episode XXXI: A New Hope

                              Originally posted by Chuck Schwartz View Post
                              I'm curious how much Eaves' personality has to do with players leaving. Just sayin'.
                              I'm wondering that as well. Like the situation w/Harbough in S.F. or Bobby Knight at Indiana. At a certain point that hard-guy stuff really wears thin and a lot of people (maybe especially college-age kids) don't want to deal with that.

                              U.S. 18 team 4 - Wisconsin 1

                              that's an interesting albeit probably expected result

                              anyone remember when UW beat the U.S. Olympic team in the 80's? We're a hell of a far cry from seeing a team that good in Madison
                              Everything in its right place, Wisconsin Hockey National Champs!


                              "but you're not as confused as him are you. it's not your job to be as confused as Nigel". Tap pt 1.

                              "I think it's ****ing stock. What--? Which part of that is unclear to you? I think it sounds stock to my ears. I mean, do you want me to write it down?" Tap Pt. 2

                              Who???! So What!!!! Big Deal!!!!

                              Comment


                              • Re: Wisconsin Hockey: Episode XXXI: A New Hope

                                Lol.

                                4-1 to the U-18s?

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