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  • ECAC Officiating First Half

    Just curious...what is the general concensus out there on the ECAC "zebras" ? I for one am not pleased at all. Yes, I am a "Gate" fan, but some things just don't seem to change over the years.

    Friday night a Union player was assessed a penalty shot, the only thing was, the refs awarded the penalty shot TO the wrong player for Union. How could that happen. How could you possibly screw that up ?

    I watch opposing players, after the whistle, jab...slash...crosscheck...McIntyre from Colgate and when he protects himself Mc gets the retaliation penalty...total BS as far as I'm concerned. And no I'm not always bashing the refs either. Your chance Got6 !!!
    It all starts with the goaltending.

  • #2
    Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

    I feel like the refs are always very one sided. I've seen it used against us many times (Quinnipiac) but I've also seen it in our favor. I am not one to want an advantage from the refs. I think it should be even across the board, but for many of the ECAC refs it's always a one sided game. And that's not fair to the team that's being penalized. It's not an even match up and then if that team loses, you can't fairly judge if that team should have lost or not.
    This goes for penalty refs and for the line judges. There's a few lines judges out that that have to be blind I swear.
    And let's not even get started on when refs get themselves mixed up with the players during a play
    Let's go Q!

    Win or Lose, I'm still a Bobcat

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

      Originally posted by sshablak View Post
      Just curious...what is the general concensus out there on the ECAC "zebras" ? I for one am not pleased at all. Yes, I am a "Gate" fan, but some things just don't seem to change over the years.

      Friday night a Union player was assessed a penalty shot, the only thing was, the refs awarded the penalty shot TO the wrong player for Union. How could that happen. How could you possibly screw that up ?
      It was clearly the wrong call - Kelly Zajac had the mini-breakaway, but Mario Valery-Trabucco took the shot. I thought the call for a penalty shot was correct, but Union got away with letting Trabucco (by far their best shooter) take the shot. Now, there are cases where the "victimized" team can choose the shooter, but that wasn't one of them.

      As far as the zebras go, I think they've been "OK" over the course of the season so far. There have been a few missed penalty calls (IMO) and some questionable calls, but that's par for the course with these guys. I haven't see any egregiously bad calls or non-calls...yet. Give it time, though.

      I think starlessixisky has it right - the refs seem to be one-sided in many games, plus an occasional make-up call thrown in. Once we get into the heart of the league schedule in late January, I think we're going to hear a lot of complaints.
      Union Hockey

      2014 National Champions!!!!

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      • #4
        Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

        I always thought anyone on the ice could take a penalty shot..... d'oh!

        You get good refs when you play RPI.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

          Whichever group did the Brown-Princeton game on Friday should officiate every ECAC game. It was great- they let the game flow (3 total penalties), but still had control so that it didn't get out of control. It was a very physical, scrappy game, too, so I think that really just further promotes their quality.

          As for the rest of the refs in ECAC: I am astonished that half of them are still employed.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

            Rule 4, Section 6
            SECTION 6. a. When any infraction of the rules calls for a penalty shot
            not involving a major, disqualification or misconduct penalty, the nonoffending
            team shall be given the option of accepting the penalty shot
            or having a minor penalty assessed to the offending player. If, however,
            a major, disqualification or misconduct penalty is incurred with the
            penalty shot, the shot shall be awarded and the penalty for the prescribed
            infraction shall be assessed.

            d. When a penalty shot is awarded under Rules 2-5-h, i and 6-34-e (illegal
            entry into the game), 6-10-f (in the last two minutes of regulation
            time or anytime during overtime, displacing the goal post, goalkeeper
            removing the helmet and/or face mask, or deliberately displacing the
            goal to prevent the puck from entering the goal at any time) or 6-16-b
            (defending player falling on, holding or gathering the puck into the body
            or hands when the puck in within the goal crease), the captain of the
            offending team shall designate any player who is not serving a penalty
            at that time to take the penalty shot. Such selection shall be reported to
            the referee and cannot be changed.
            When a penalty shot is awarded under Rules 6-29-e (interference) and
            6-59-b (fouling from behind), the referee shall designate the player who has
            been fouled as the player who shall take the penalty shot.

            When a penalty shot is awarded under Rule 6-10-f (during the course of
            a breakaway, a goalkeeper or player deliberately displaces the goal post or a
            goalkeeper deliberately removes the helmet and/or face mask), the penalty
            shot shall be taken by the player last in possession of the puck.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

              I haven't noticed much difference from previous seasons, maybe just a bit of an improvement, certainly not too much worse. Consistency, or lack of it to me seems to be the most pronounced problem.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

                Based on what 'Gate Radio posted, that means the refs at the Colgate-Union game got the call wrong. Zajac should have taken the penalty shot for Union, not Valery-Trabucco. At least it wasn't a score.

                Officiating at yesterday's Colgate-RPI game was AWFUL. At least twice Colgate should have been called for off-sides, and got away with it. McIntyre shoved a RPI player onto the ice in Colgate's defensive zone during the 2nd and there was no call. And in most Colgate games opposing defenders are doing everything they can to maim McIntyre ... most of the time, no call.

                At least Eugene Binda Jr. isn't officiating in this league anymore. But the following refs are those I've never liked in a key game:
                -John Murphy
                -Peter Feola
                -Chip McDonald
                -Alex Dell
                Colgate '09

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

                  Originally posted by Wholin1 View Post
                  Consistency, or lack of it to me seems to be the most pronounced problem.
                  That's the main complaint I have. Not only are they inconsistent within a game, they're inconsistent from one game to the next.
                  Quinnipiac Bobcats
                  2012-13, 2014-15, 2015-16, 2018-19 ECAC Regular Season Champions
                  2013 East Regional Champions, Frozen Four
                  2014 East Regional
                  2015 West Regional
                  2016 ECAC Tournament Champions, East Regional Champions, Frozen Four
                  2019 Midwest Regional

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

                    Originally posted by Rainman View Post
                    Based on what 'Gate Radio posted, that means the refs at the Colgate-Union game got the call wrong. Zajac should have taken the penalty shot for Union, not Valery-Trabucco. At least it wasn't a score.

                    Officiating at yesterday's Colgate-RPI game was AWFUL. At least twice Colgate should have been called for off-sides, and got away with it. McIntyre shoved a RPI player onto the ice in Colgate's defensive zone during the 2nd and there was no call. And in most Colgate games opposing defenders are doing everything they can to maim McIntyre ... most of the time, no call.

                    At least Eugene Binda Jr. isn't officiating in this league anymore. But the following refs are those I've never liked in a key game:
                    -John Murphy
                    -Peter Feola
                    -Chip McDonald
                    -Alex Dell
                    Add Baker to that list. And Kotyra.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

                      The reffering in this league is below what is required, and the better the player, depending on the team I've come to notice, the more the reaction penalty is handed out, as opposed to the initiation.

                      Mr. Stewart, the head of officiating, had a wonderful NHL career both as a player and referree. However, I have never seen him at any games watching our product to assess and evaluate his talent.

                      I cannot remember any games the "Murphy's" have reffed at any rink that stands out. I know they must dis-like the Coach's and/or our current
                      captian(s) at Colgate. If he even sneezes, they send him to the Sin-Bin for littering.

                      One would have hoped that the Two Ref system would be a marked improvement. However, in saying all this, ECAC hockey is frantic hockey, and isn't coached or played within systems similar to the WCHA or the CCHA.

                      We can discuss this subject until we are blue in the face, however, the problem usually starts or ends, from the Top down.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

                        As an old timer I can say for certain that bad reffing is nothing new in the ECAC. Names like Mike Noeth, Harry Amian and Pierre Berlanger bring up horror stories in my mind. Going to the two ref system seemed like a good idea at the time but has just made it so we get twice as many bad calls. I don't know if it will ever be any better. Perhaps if the pay were better? Does anyone know what the refs are paid these days for doing a game?
                        Take the shortest distance to the puck and arrive in ill humor

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                        • #13
                          Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

                          Originally posted by DrDemento View Post
                          Going to the two ref system seemed like a good idea at the time but has just made it so we get twice as many bad calls.
                          And they're missing twice as many calls as well.

                          The refs are too complacent. There just doesn't seem to be any accountability.
                          Quinnipiac Bobcats
                          2012-13, 2014-15, 2015-16, 2018-19 ECAC Regular Season Champions
                          2013 East Regional Champions, Frozen Four
                          2014 East Regional
                          2015 West Regional
                          2016 ECAC Tournament Champions, East Regional Champions, Frozen Four
                          2019 Midwest Regional

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

                            Originally posted by DrDemento View Post
                            As an old timer I can say for certain that bad reffing is nothing new in the ECAC. Names like Mike Noeth, Harry Amian and Pierre Berlanger bring up horror stories in my mind. Going to the two ref system seemed like a good idea at the time but has just made it so we get twice as many bad calls. I don't know if it will ever be any better. Perhaps if the pay were better? Does anyone know what the refs are paid these days for doing a game?
                            Doc, do you mean pay from the league or other sources?. I'd also like to know what training, certification, continuing education, etc. is involved. I would also say that in their partial defense, I assume all of these guys have day jobs are very much part timers, and have a pretty tough job to do.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: ECAC Officiating First Half

                              Compared to these guys, I miss Belanger, Amian and Noeth! It really is not worth complaining about, but it is still frustrating.

                              Stewart is not the answer. If his talent were have as big as his ego, he would be the best ref in the world. In Albany last year, he was too buys chasing fluff to pay attention to hockey. He was at the Harvard - SLU game this year, and got to watch the linesman give a penalty to Alex Curran who wasn't even on the ice for a scrum in front of the Harvard goal. He defends them. He says he solved fighting in the league by not letting teams go out and tap their goalie after every period. He is delusional. He gives the "how many teams are there in the ECAC?" speech every year. The 13th team being the officials who, of course, pretty much have never played a game in their lives and wouldn't know flow if they were going through the sewer system like a water slide!!

                              There are a few things that really chaffe me. One is when they give a clear advantage to one team which is frequent. Second, is when they don't do what is necessary to prevent injuries and out of control play. Against Dartmouth in Albany in 2007, Casey Parenteau got absolutely drilled from behind into the boards. While he lay motionless, Dave Hansen (who was one of the better refs) saw the whole thing, called nothing and stepped over the motionless player. I thought there were three dangerous plays in the Friday SLU-Clarkson tilt all of which could have been majors. None were, and one was called on the wrong team / player! Also on Friday night, I thought Beca was out of control with his stick.....nothing called. It is not even what they call, it is what they don't call. And, I have often complained that the real issue is there is no consistency between crews, between games, between periods or even between shifts. Clakson got a PP to tie the game with 30 seconds left on Friday....equally serious infractions were not called in the first or second periods. I have just tried to accept that it is always going to be bad and have the mentality that you have to play through it. Problem is when that happens in a playoff series. Back in about 2004ish, Kotyra absolutely put it to the Saints at Colgate. He was the difference in the series IMHO, and he didn't protect the players. Trevelyan got hit high an concussed. Kotyra did it again, although not as noticably, last year in Albany when we played Yale. Some nights, they are the difference in the game and that is a real tragedy....because the kids and the fans and the parents have so much riding on these games.

                              A final thought, in other leagues, they actually are part of the league. They have cookouts in the summers with all the refs and coaches, they get together, and that is one reason when the ECAC plays on the road you are never going to get a call in the CCHA, WCHA or HEA!! The refs were absolutely laughable for us at Maine. Called everything on us, nothing on them.

                              I am convinced the officiating is much better in the OHL / CHL. I wish we could get some of those guys. I think just the part time nature and the where are league is run, there are flaws.

                              Oh, and so far the officiating is about the same, maybe a touch better this year but there is LOTS of room for improvement.
                              Last edited by Got 6, Want More; 12-06-2009, 06:42 PM.
                              9/11/01 - Stewie & Pelch, you are missed by the SLU Family.
                              1962, 1988, 1989, 1992, 2000, 2001, we want More!!!

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