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UNH Wildcats 2012-2013 Postseason Thread

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  • Re: UNH Wildcats 2012-2013 Postseason Thread

    Channeling Bob Ryan here...

    Can someone please explain the fascination with Josh Ciocco?
    UNH Hockey: From "Why Not Us' to "Woe is Us"

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    • Re: UNH Wildcats 2012-2013 Postseason Thread

      Originally posted by Chuck Murray View Post
      Heck - if the University can find $100K for a crappy new logo/marketing program, why can't they add an extra coach to the staff IF it addresses a need AND begins to set things up for an eventual succession plan after Coach Umile decides to hang it up?

      Only 4-and-a-half months left until the start of the season ...
      NCAA teams may only have 3 paid coaching staff members.

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      • Re: UNH Wildcats 2012-2013 Postseason Thread

        Originally posted by WIrinkrat View Post
        NCAA teams may only have 3 paid coaching staff members.
        So give one of them a volunteer tag (didn't Churchard do this in the past?) and line them up with another paying job in the area??
        Sworn Enemy of the Perpetually Offended
        Montreal Expos Forever ...

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        • Re: UNH Wildcats 2012-2013 Postseason Thread

          Originally posted by Chuck Murray View Post
          So give one of them a volunteer tag (didn't Churchard do this in the past?) and line them up with another paying job in the area??
          Why would someone who already has a job coaching NCAA hockey exclusively want to go to a situation where they have to work with the hockey program AND at another full time job in the area to make ends meet (especially when other said job may not pay as much as they could make with their hockey salary elsewhere?) They also wouldn't be able to do any off campus recruiting.

          Churchard worked at the school already and volunteered primarily as a sports psychologist. Not even close to being a similar situation as to what you are suggesting.

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          • Re: UNH Wildcats 2012-2013 Postseason Thread

            Originally posted by Felger View Post
            Channeling Bob Ryan here...

            Can someone please explain the fascination with Josh Ciocco?
            By all accounts, a nice guy and ambitious young UNH alum that many posters have fresh memories of his playing days, who also wants to be involved in the program. You can bet your bottom dollar that if Patrick Foley or Mark Mowers came on these boards and posted as themselves, they would also attract a huge amount of positive goodwill too.
            Sworn Enemy of the Perpetually Offended
            Montreal Expos Forever ...

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            • Re: UNH Wildcats 2012-2013 Postseason Thread

              Originally posted by WIrinkrat View Post
              Why would someone who already has a job coaching NCAA hockey exclusively want to go to a situation where they have to work with the hockey program AND at another full time job in the area to make ends meet (especially when other said job may not pay as much as they could make with their hockey salary elsewhere?) They also wouldn't be able to do any off campus recruiting.

              Churchard worked at the school already and volunteered primarily as a sports psychologist. Not even close to being a similar situation as to what you are suggesting.
              If that person's current coaching job was at a D-1 backwater like Brown, and it meant he could move up to coach at his alma mater, why would/should he rule that out?

              The *other* job could be a flexible job at the school (please don't say they don't exist) or in private industry in the area. It can be done if someone wants it to happen.
              Sworn Enemy of the Perpetually Offended
              Montreal Expos Forever ...

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              • Re: UNH Wildcats 2012-2013 Postseason Thread

                Originally posted by Chuck Murray View Post
                If that person's current coaching job was at a D-1 backwater like Brown, and it meant he could move up to coach at his alma mater, why would/should he rule that out?

                The *other* job could be a flexible job at the school (please don't say they don't exist) or in private industry in the area. It can be done if someone wants it to happen.
                So you're suggesting they break the NCAA rules? Sorry Chuck, you're off base...and I don't care where someone is coaching...if they are in D1 and making a full time salary (and probably a really good one at that at an Ivy) they aren't going to leave to work multiple jobs just so they can be on the staff at UNH. Your opinion of the relative value of working at UNH compared to other schools seems to be kind of inflated.

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                • Re: UNH Wildcats 2012-2013 Postseason Thread

                  Now that Maine has selected a coach, someone who wasn't on anybody's list at the beginning of the process, is their process of selection instructional for UNH? Like Maine, UNH is a program outside the Boston media market, their glory days increasingly in the rear view mirror for a variety of reasons and, most importantly, with a financial base that is not the equal of some of their Hockey East competitors (BC, BU, ND and, yes, UConn), never mind the Big Ten. When Umile announces his retirement I am sure UNH will start off with the same thought process as Maine, get a high profile coach with a solid D1 head coaching resume. But when confronted with the realities that they are not like BC, Michigan, etc. will they shift gears on the fly and take someone not considered at the start of the process? Money and admission policies are going to play a big part of this. Hope Marty is planning ahead.

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                  • Re: UNH Wildcats 2012-2013 Postseason Thread

                    Originally posted by Felger View Post
                    Channeling Bob Ryan here...

                    Can someone please explain the fascination with Josh Ciocco?
                    Ciocco has the potential to be a top-notch recruiter for some college program. Since he joined the staff of U.S. Hockey Report in the Fall of 2011, he has been a prime contributor to their evaluations of young talent from the bantam level up to the USHL. He's logged a ton of miles going to rinks all over the US and Canada to appraise players at Showcase events, USA Hockey camps, and the like. His evaluations in USHR often predict which youngsters will become Division I vs. III players and who will develop into top-line talent in Division I.
                    The UNH Men's Hockey Blog

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                    • Re: UNH Wildcats 2012-2013 Postseason Thread

                      Originally posted by WIrinkrat View Post
                      So you're suggesting they break the NCAA rules? Sorry Chuck, you're off base...and I don't care where someone is coaching...if they are in D1 and making a full time salary (and probably a really good one at that at an Ivy) they aren't going to leave to work multiple jobs just so they can be on the staff at UNH. Your opinion of the relative value of working at UNH compared to other schools seems to be kind of inflated.
                      You may be right, and maybe I am off base. You seem to be well-informed on the NCAA rules in this area. Let me ask you this then ... perhaps thinking a little outside the box, but let's say UNH loses one of its current assistants in the next year or two. The other guy stays (Borek OR Tortorella). UNH/Marty Scarano decides he wants to set things up for the future (and having said that, I share Greg's concerns that Marty might not be planning too far ahead). He decides he wants to spring for the Souza/White combo, but Coach Umile wants to stay on board for a transitional year or two. Can Umile become a volunteer head coach, perhaps earning his money as an Assistant AD, and allow the 3 paid coaches to be (1) Borek/Tortorella, (2) Souza and (3) White? That way, Umile gets another year or two to pass the baton, hands it off to one of his trusted assistants (SB or JT) AND there are two ambitious young assistants with D-1 experience returning to their alma mater to handle the recruiting at both ends of the ice, with the potential for a secondary succession plan to emerge later on down the line?

                      I realize there are a LOT of moving parts in there, and a LOT of assumptions too.

                      Or they could just go outside and bring in someone who does things entirely differently? Mike Babcock might be available in 10 years or so, and played in the WHL before finishing his playing career at McGill, so I think he would fit the bill when the time comes ...
                      Sworn Enemy of the Perpetually Offended
                      Montreal Expos Forever ...

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                      • Re: UNH Wildcats 2012-2013 Postseason Thread

                        Originally posted by Chuck Murray View Post
                        Heck - if the University can find $100K for a crappy new logo/marketing program, why can't they add an extra coach to the staff IF it addresses a need AND begins to set things up for an eventual succession plan after Coach Umile decides to hang it up?
                        Different budget.

                        Regarding the logo, the U's recent communication shows that at a minimum they have heard the reaction. Having had a few weeks to think about it, the thing that bothers me the most is that they chose an out of state firm, not keeping the money in NH.
                        I will not be out cheered in my own building.

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                        • Re: UNH Wildcats 2012-2013 Postseason Thread

                          Originally posted by Chuck Murray View Post
                          By all accounts, a nice guy and ambitious young UNH alum that many posters have fresh memories of his playing days, who also wants to be involved in the program. You can bet your bottom dollar that if Patrick Foley or Mark Mowers came on these boards and posted as themselves, they would also attract a huge amount of positive goodwill too.
                          Originally posted by C-H-C View Post
                          Ciocco has the potential to be a top-notch recruiter for some college program. Since he joined the staff of U.S. Hockey Report in the Fall of 2011, he has been a prime contributor to their evaluations of young talent from the bantam level up to the USHL. He's logged a ton of miles going to rinks all over the US and Canada to appraise players at Showcase events, USA Hockey camps, and the like. His evaluations in USHR often predict which youngsters will become Division I vs. III players and who will develop into top-line talent in Division I.
                          Thanks guys, my question was somewhat sarcastic and rhetorical. I'm aware of Ciocco's attributes, but it seems he's becoming UNH's version of Jim Montgomery. Every time a potential addition/replacement to the coaching staff is mentioned his is always the first name mentioned, probably for the reasons Chuck outlined. Which is fine. However there are many other candidates, who have actual experience, (rather than simply potential,) not to mention a better resume as a player at UNH (which presupposes that the coach has to be an alum,) who would be at least as strong, probably stronger, candidates.

                          I would certainly consider Josh a candidate, just not the candidate.
                          UNH Hockey: From "Why Not Us' to "Woe is Us"

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                          • Re: UNH Wildcats 2012-2013 Postseason Thread

                            Originally posted by Felger View Post
                            Thanks guys, my question was somewhat sarcastic and rhetorical. I'm aware of Ciocco's attributes, but it seems he's becoming UNH's version of Jim Montgomery. .
                            Not quite. Jim Montgomery was a 300 point career scorer for Maine and has been a successful coach in the USHL. Plus he's 10-15 years older than Ciocco. However, I do think that he would be a real go getter when it comes to recruiting, although evaluating talent and landing it are two different skills.

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                            • Originally posted by Greg Ambrose View Post
                              Now that Maine has selected a coach, someone who wasn't on anybody's list at the beginning of the process, is their process of selection instructional for UNH? Like Maine, UNH is a program outside the Boston media market, their glory days increasingly in the rear view mirror for a variety of reasons and, most importantly, with a financial base that is not the equal of some of their Hockey East competitors (BC, BU, ND and, yes, UConn), never mind the Big Ten. When Umile announces his retirement I am sure UNH will start off with the same thought process as Maine, get a high profile coach with a solid D1 head coaching resume. But when confronted with the realities that they are not like BC, Michigan, etc. will they shift gears on the fly and take someone not considered at the start of the process? Money and admission policies are going to play a big part of this. Hope Marty is planning ahead.
                              I doubt that Marty is giving much thought to men's hockey coaching succession. Short of a NC, UNH has had a better past 15 years than all but a handful of Div 1 teams, and Umile is relatively young compared o some Div 1 coaches. I think that it would take a few consecutive 2011-2012 seasons to drive Umile to retirement.

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                              • Re: UNH Wildcats 2012-2013 Postseason Thread

                                Originally posted by Greg Ambrose View Post
                                Not quite. Jim Montgomery was a 300 point career scorer for Maine and has been a successful coach in the USHL. Plus he's 10-15 years older than Ciocco. However, I do think that he would be a real go getter when it comes to recruiting, although evaluating talent and landing it are two different skills.
                                In the words of another Boston sportscaster...

                                "You're making my point."
                                UNH Hockey: From "Why Not Us' to "Woe is Us"

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