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  • Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

    Originally posted by Chuck Schwartz View Post
    Well, the first few pages were Dubbs free so at least it was coherent.
    Talk about hitting the nail on the head!

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    • Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

      Originally posted by oldtyme25 View Post
      Fire Mike Eaves?

      Heck Yeah!

      As everyone knows, recruiting is the life blood of any college sport. Mike Eaves has consistently either lost the battle or wasted scholarship dollars on players who have returned little or nothing to the program. The moment you can tell when a program has lost its mojo, is when the home state's best prospects start leaving for greener pastures. What did Barry Alverez do when he got the job, he stated that he was going to build a wall around the state and not let its best players leave for other programs, and it worked!

      Let's look and see how Big Mike has been faring lately with Wisconsin's top home grown prospects:

      Jordan Schmaltz - NHL 1st round pick - North Dakota
      Will Butcher - NTDP - Denver
      Ian McCoshen - USHL - Boston College

      The other area that he has failed miserably is the scholarship dollars he has wasted on Wisconsin Prep Hockey Players who he has offered scholarships to before they played one minute in JR Hockey!

      Current Wisconsin Wi Born Players and where they were recruited from:

      Jake McCabe - NTDP - 6 points
      Keegan Meuer - USHL - 4 points
      Ryan Little - WIAA - 2 points
      Brad Navin - WIAA - 1 point
      Gavin Hartzog - WIAA - 0 points
      Sean Little - WIAA - 0 points
      Jefferson Dahl - WIAA - 0 points
      Matt Pappe - WIAA - 0 points

      Chase Drake - WIAA - 0 points

      Lets also not forget two other former WIAA players and former WI Prep Hockey players of the year who committed to Wisco and never made it to campus

      Travis Erstad
      Cody Strang

      So when you wonder why Wisco Hockey sucks.....take a look at the local players who are getting away and the ones who they landed.

      So, is it time to fire Mike Eaves???

      Yes is the answer!
      the bolded part is what really irks me. I recall reading S. Little, R. Little, M. Paape and looking at their prep stats and going ***? really? then you get a guy like Navin who had great stats (but again, it's Wisconsin hs hockey which is light years behind Minnesota HS, Mass prep, hell even Illinois turns out better prospects, michigan obviously, etc) and hasn't done anything.

      add to that,guys who are supposed to score or at least at a secondary level, Lee, Barnes, LaBate and they're just not panning out that way.

      I mean something has to give. UW fans want to really pin their hopes on just 2 players? Dvorak and Besse? I think it would take 2 each of these types (at least) in consecutive classes along with a Skille or two to really turn this around.
      Everything in its right place, Wisconsin Hockey National Champs!


      "but you're not as confused as him are you. it's not your job to be as confused as Nigel". Tap pt 1.

      "I think it's ****ing stock. What--? Which part of that is unclear to you? I think it sounds stock to my ears. I mean, do you want me to write it down?" Tap Pt. 2

      Who???! So What!!!! Big Deal!!!!

      Comment


      • Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

        My earlier comments were not about whether an individual player panned out or not. It was about the overall systemic failure of Mike Eaves recruiting results. There was a time when Wisconsin rarely lost out on an instate player they wanted, so the fact that they have lost out on the top 3 instate players in the last year is an indication that perhaps the perception of Coach Eaves/Badger Hockey is getting a bit tarnished.

        My comments earlier about WIAA Prep Hockey was only about lack of return they have gotten from their investment and a hope that they will forgo this channel in the future until they see how the prospect performs in a junior hockey setting.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by oldtyme25 View Post
          My earlier comments were not about whether an individual player panned out or not. It was about the overall systemic failure of Mike Eaves recruiting results. There was a time when Wisconsin rarely lost out on an instate player they wanted, so the fact that they have lost out on the top 3 instate players in the last year is an indication that perhaps the perception of Coach Eaves/Badger Hockey is getting a bit tarnished.

          My comments earlier about WIAA Prep Hockey was only about lack of return they have gotten from their investment and a hope that they will forgo this channel in the future until they see how the prospect performs in a junior hockey setting.
          I thought a lot of what you said makes sense. Missing out on top WI recruits should be a concern. And I don't completely disagree with your points on WIAA players. I just don't think it's black and white. There may be cases where you have to offer a talented kid early or lose out on him. That said, you are right on the money that most kids need to play Juniors before playing college. The transition is steep, even coming from MN HS or AAA hockey.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by solovsfett View Post
            the bolded part is what really irks me. I recall reading S. Little, R. Little, M. Paape and looking at their prep stats and going ***? really? then you get a guy like Navin who had great stats (but again, it's Wisconsin hs hockey which is light years behind Minnesota HS, Mass prep, hell even Illinois turns out better prospects, michigan obviously, etc) and hasn't done anything.

            add to that,guys who are supposed to score or at least at a secondary level, Lee, Barnes, LaBate and they're just not panning out that way.

            I mean something has to give. UW fans want to really pin their hopes on just 2 players? Dvorak and Besse? I think it would take 2 each of these types (at least) in consecutive classes along with a Skille or two to really turn this around.
            Even though I know you hate me Solo, you are one of my favorite Badger posters. You are old school like I am, and a good dude. I'm sorry if I was a jerk to you in the past, and I hope the Badgers turn things around. Our rivalry isn't as fun when one of our programs are down.

            Comment


            • Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

              Just a reminder, you only get 18 scholarships to pass around 26 players, and after goalies it's more like 16 scholarships to pass around for 23 players. Majority of these in-state kids (with the exception of McCabe) are likely on 1/2 or less.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by solovsfett View Post
                I mean something has to give. UW fans want to really pin their hopes on just 2 players? Dvorak and Besse? I think it would take 2 each of these types (at least) in consecutive classes along with a Skille or two to really turn this around.
                Bringing ANY players in directly from the WIAA has been, IMHO, the biggest mistakes the Eaves has made in the last few years. As a GENERAL rule, if a player isn't a first or second round NHL draft pick they just don't have the combination of skill, maturity, and experience to be a significant factor in the college game at 18 or 19.

                I don't have a problem with offering to these kids early, but make it clear that they will have to spend AT least one (and often two) season playing in the ushl. You should NEVER be both an extraordinarily young team AND a team full of grinders and role players.

                I don't think that either Turris or Skille should ever have played on game for UW. If a player does not intend to spend at least three seasons in college (I believe that Pavs, C Smith, and Stepan all initially intended to stay 3 years) they are going to be more of a distraction and effort than they add, IMHO again.
                Last edited by Almington; 11-29-2012, 08:06 PM.

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                • Originally posted by Almington View Post
                  Bringing ANY players in directly from the WIAA has been, IMHO, the biggest mistakes the Eaves has made in the last few years. As a GENERAL rule, if a player isn't a first or second round NHL draft pick they just don't have the combination of skill, maturity, and experience to be a significant factor in the college game at 18 or 19.

                  I don't have a problem with offering to these kids early, but make it clear that they will have to spend AT least one (and often two) season playing in the ushl. You should NEVER be both an extraordinarily young team AND a team full of grinders and role players.

                  I don't think that either Turris or Skille should ever have played on game for UW. If a player does not intend to spend at least three seasons in college (I believe that Pavs, C Smith, and Stepan all initially intended to stay 3 years) they are going to be more of a distraction and effort than they add, IMHO again.
                  I agree with you 100% on the first point. Very few kids can come right from ANY highschool ANYWHERE and succeed right away in college. Not many Rau's or Bjugstad's out there. The Gophers got burnt a lot by this in their down period too. Kids need to be patient. It's in their best interest.

                  As to your second point on kids staying 3 years, I also mostly agree. However, I don't think there is much harm in recruiting some blue chip guys who will only stay a few years if A) they produce right away and B) it is balanced out by enough skilled guys who aren't prototypical NHL players who will stick around 3-4 years.

                  Comment


                  • Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

                    Originally posted by Chuck Schwartz View Post
                    Just a reminder, you only get 18 scholarships to pass around 26 players, and after goalies it's more like 16 scholarships to pass around for 23 players. Majority of these in-state kids (with the exception of McCabe) are likely on 1/2 or less.
                    I think a better use of the partial scholarship dollars is offering to the best uncommitted 20 year olds early in the USHL season. They can be the cornerstone of your 4th line and 3rd defensive pair, while giving you some stronger more mature players (24-25 year old seniors) who will stick around for 4 years. Then you can concentrate on filling the other 9 forwards and 4 D with skill players, need to land more skill players!

                    Comment


                    • Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

                      Originally posted by Almington View Post
                      Bringing ANY players in directly from the WIAA has been, IMHO, the biggest mistakes the Eaves has made in the last few years. As a GENERAL rule, if a player isn't a first or second round NHL draft pick they just don't have the combination of skill, maturity, and experience to be a significant factor in the college game at 18 or 19.

                      I don't have a problem with offering to these kids early, but make it clear that they will have to spend AT least one (and often two) season playing in the ushl. You should NEVER be both an extraordinarily young team AND a team full of grinders and role players.
                      Wisconsin has only brought one player in straight from WIAA hockey during Eaves tenure and that's Brad Navin.

                      People around here forget that he initially committed for the 2013 recruiting class. The only reason that Navin was brought in (two years early), was that Jordy Murray abruptly left because the loophole that would allow him to play in Switzerland was going to be closing and he needed to leave when he did. At the time, none of the players recruited for the 2012 class could be accelerated to 2011 because they were still in high school. Navin was the only committed player who could be brought in early.

                      Comment


                      • Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

                        My issue was not about what year the instate players arrived to play. It was that Eaves continued to offer WIAA players scholly's before they had played any Junior hockey games. He will be paying the price for his decision to cast his lot with this group for a couple more years yet.

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                        • Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

                          FWIW, early departures since 2010:

                          Wisconsin--9
                          Boston U--8
                          Denver--7
                          Michigan State--5
                          North Dakota--4
                          Notre Dame--4
                          Boston College--4
                          Minnesota-Duluth--4

                          Comment


                          • Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

                            Originally posted by Chuck Schwartz View Post
                            FWIW, early departures since 2010:

                            Wisconsin--9
                            One of the things that you have to wonder about that is whether some of those top prospects would have stuck around if there would have been a better team around them. Some of them might just get frustrated with being the only talented players on the team and that they were sold a different bill of goods when they were recruited.

                            Of course that's all just conjecture, but it is a possibility.
                            Wisconsin Hockey Recruiting spreadsheet (both Men's and Women's)

                            Comment


                            • Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

                              Originally posted by Chuck Schwartz View Post
                              FWIW, early departures since 2010:

                              Wisconsin--9
                              Boston U--8
                              Denver--7
                              Michigan State--5
                              North Dakota--4
                              Notre Dame--4
                              Boston College--4
                              Minnesota-Duluth--4
                              I'm assuming these are just the numbers for players leaving early for the pros correct?
                              North Dakota
                              National Champions: 1959, 1963, 1980, 1982, 1987, 1997, 2000, 2016

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                              • Re: Fire Mike Eaves?

                                Originally posted by Fighting Sioux 23 View Post
                                I'm assuming these are just the numbers for players leaving early for the pros correct?
                                Yes, although I added Charlie Coyle to BU's number.

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