WISCONSIN Hockey Vol. 22 - Let's not have another cheesy thread title... Wait, What?

[Timothy A]

Re: WISCONSIN Hockey Vol. 22 - Let's not have another cheesy thread title... Wait, W

Wrote about the ice surface tonight if anyone cares. Dug up an article from 2007 when Eaves talked about shrinking the Kohl Center ice to 200x90.

LINK

Thanks for digging that up. I had recalled that he had this KC ice sheet reduction thought. It's never going to happen, that was a pipe dream.
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Ditching the 3 1 1 wouldn't be a big deal, all the players are used to the old system but the Fr, and they are still blank canvasses at this point.

[Almington]

Re: WISCONSIN Hockey Vol. 22 - Let's not have another cheesy thread title... Wait, W

Ditching the 3 1 1 wouldn't be a big deal, all the players are used to the old system but the Fr, and they are still blank canvasses at this point.

Why would you want to return to a system that resulted in a 21-16-4 record resulting in not earning home ice, not making the F5, and not making the NCAAs in 2010-11 and a 17-18-2 record and not earning home ice, not making the F5, and not making the NCAAs in 2011-12?

While I'm not convinced that a 1-1-3 is the right system, I am convinced that the old system wasn't working based on the overall results of the last 2 seasons. I'd rather the coaching staff try something new and fail, than continue to use the same old system that resulted in painfully average results over the last few seasons.

[Chuck Schwartz]

Re: WISCONSIN Hockey Vol. 22 - Let's not have another cheesy thread title... Wait, W

Why would you want to return to a system that resulted in a 21-16-4 record resulting in not earning home ice, not making the F5, and not making the NCAAs in 2010-11 and a 17-18-2 record and not earning home ice, not making the F5, and not making the NCAAs in 2011-12?

While I'm not convinced that a 1-1-3 is the right system, I am convinced that the old system wasn't working based on the overall results of the last 2 seasons. I'd rather the coaching staff try something new and fail, than continue to use the same old system that resulted in painfully average results over the last few seasons.

That's a flawed logic.

Different players, different years, different talent levels. The old offensive system didn't have a problem working back in 09-10.

Maybe it's too early to jump the gun (Ok, I know it's too early even though I frustratingly wrote they need to dump it) but man it's been ugly to watch at times.

Wisconsin already has a bad perception in the minds of recruits in terms of Eaves limiting their offensive creativity, now we're going to play a system that sits back and traps even more? Guys like Lucia and Berenson are laughing.

[oldtyme25]

Re: WISCONSIN Hockey Vol. 22 - Let's not have another cheesy thread title... Wait, W

That's a flawed logic.

Different players, different years, different talent levels. The old offensive system didn't have a problem working back in 09-10.

Maybe it's too early to jump the gun (Ok, I know it's too early even though I frustratingly wrote they need to dump it) but man it's been ugly to watch at times.

Wisconsin already has a bad perception in the minds of recruits in terms of Eaves limiting their offensive creativity, now we're going to play a system that sits back and traps even more? Guys like Lucia and Berenson are laughing.

You win the prize Mr. Schwartz!!!!!

I was waiting to see when someone was going to recognize the white elephant in the room! The 1-1-3 is a Neutral Zone Trap!!!!

Welcome to boring hockey where you have to play trap because you can not compete offensively so you play trap in hopes of winning 2-1.

And yes you are correct, what high end forward wants to play in a trap system?

[Chuck Schwartz]

Re: WISCONSIN Hockey Vol. 22 - Let's not have another cheesy thread title... Wait, W

Zengerle had successful surgery on Monday.

LINK

[Back check]

Zengerle had successful surgery on Monday.

LINK

Good to hear re Zengerle.

I agree with you about Rumpel flight risk possibility. Very strong NCAA goalie crop currently in their junior year. Rumpel will be more of a standout in his junior year, 2013-2014

[markwojo]

Re: WISCONSIN Hockey Vol. 22 - Let's not have another cheesy thread title... Wait, W

Late to the party on some of the discussion on some of the problems surrounding UW.

Yeap attendance is down and that is not a new story. There are a littany of factors that go into that and some certainly fall at the feet of Eaves while many also do not. Ticket prices, parking prices, on ice results (but let's be brutually honest....they are not all that different then the up and down we saw the last decade of Sauer), a crapy economy pinching discretionary income, and the one I think is underaprreciated is where hockey falls into the hierarchy of UW sports. For a long time, hockey was the flagship program for sucess while football and bounceyball floundered in mediocrity (or worse). There has been a prolonged run of succes in football and basketball and I think unfortunately at some point that has had an impact on where hockey sits in the conciousness of potential fans and their wallets. There's a whole new generation that thinks it's cooler to go to football or basketball games long before a hockey game and that simply was not the case as much a couple decades ago. Attendance for last seasons UNO series at the end of October was 20920 which is not all that different then the 19337 for CC this past weekend.

Eaves on the practicing on the Kohl surface is as many others have said more a dig at the folks deciding the facility scheduling then an excuse for his team in my opinoin. Solovsfett, North Dakota can show up and play well regardless of ice surface size because A) they are never second or third fiddle on their home rink and B) their facilities are phenominal and from their locker room they can either walkout and down a hallway onto the Ralph sheet, or up a short staircase onto the Olympic sheet depending on where they are playing that given week. North Dakota hockey is NEVER not going to have access to their ice sheet because of bounceyball, volleyball, wrestling, concerts because they are at the top of the foodchain for their building and not toward the bottom as UW hockey is.

Did Oz make Eaves or did Eaves make Oz? I suspect it is a little of both and bit more of Eaves AND the UW program as it was Oz. Oz has had some success elsewhere, but I'm pretty sure Blais wins at North Dakota with or without Oz in the one year he was in the right place at the right time. If Oz was so great and so awesome at D devlopement, why have the NHL advisors not steered their kids to OSU cause last I checked Oz is not rolling in blue chip dman recruits that are getting drafted in the top few rounds every year? I get OSU is not one of the premier programs as far as tradition lots of other factors, but neither was Notre Dame or Miami before there last coaching hires. I'm not trying to say Oz is not a solid coach and a very very good assistant at the college level, but I am trying to say some of his sucess/reputation is directly attributable to the Wisconsin hockey franchise (history, facilities, fan support, ect) and Eaves. While, I may seem to those that reveer Oz to have just tore down Oz, I do think him leaving (I think he was one of the best assistants when he was an assistant) and replacing assistants in general has been part of (many) problems that have hampered the program. In Oz's case, I think it was a lot of a victim of your own sucess (as you can argue was the case with Hynes and MAYBE even Patrick).

On the not getting top dmen recruits, we didn't always get them under Oz recruiting coordination either. McDonagh, McBain, & Gardiner were guys that the flagship homestate school were not full court press from the get go on and call it luck or a better eye at a younger age then most but it worked out for UW. At this point, UW has been getting commits from well regard 15/16 year olds that time will tell if they turn out like what will likely go down as an unprecedented era of elite dman at UW (or any other school for that matter). Whether it was Oz, luck, Eaves, or whatever, we got spoiled being able to run out a dcorp like we did for a few years.

Mark Johnson....ugggh. Taking a guy that has been coaching womans hockey for a decade to be the head guy at UW would not be a good hire.

[solovsfett]

Re: WISCONSIN Hockey Vol. 22 - Let's not have another cheesy thread title... Wait, W

interesting points markwojo

the most successful years for Eaves were years 2, 3 and 4. made the NCAA's 3 consecutive years and won it all in year 4. Oz was on board only for year 4 (championship) so I don't think he factored to heavily one way or another there...but my question is this, given that success early, why did Eaves decide immediately to change recruiting tactics after winning the NCAA title? it appears he walked from the successful plan into a new plan for recruiting that I have to say has not worked (2010 aside) considering *only* wins/losses and ncaa appearances.

[Timothy A]

Re: WISCONSIN Hockey Vol. 22 - Let's not have another cheesy thread title... Wait, W

Why would you want to return to a system that resulted in a 21-16-4 record resulting in not earning home ice, not making the F5, and not making the NCAAs in 2010-11 and a 17-18-2 record and not earning home ice, not making the F5, and not making the NCAAs in 2011-12?

While I'm not convinced that a 1-1-3 is the right system, I am convinced that the old system wasn't working based on the overall results of the last 2 seasons. I'd rather the coaching staff try something new and fail, than continue to use the same old system that resulted in painfully average results over the last few seasons.

IMHO, it's not the system that is the problem, it's the quality of F's, the uneven recruiting classes, and lack of a stud goalie since Elliott left. Rumpel has the makings of fixing 1/3 of the problem, the uneven class deal is almost hopeless to fix and the quality of F's is fixable, but will it get fixed?

[Almington]

interesting points markwojo

the most successful years for Eaves were years 2, 3 and 4. made the NCAA's 3 consecutive years and won it all in year 4. Oz was on board only for year 4 (championship) so I don't think he factored to heavily one way or another there...but my question is this, given that success early, why did Eaves decide immediately to change recruiting tactics after winning the NCAA title? it appears he walked from the successful plan into a new plan for recruiting that I have to say has not worked (2010 aside) considering *only* wins/losses and ncaa appearances.

I don't think that Eaves really changed his recruiting after 2006, I do think he decided that one-and-done players are more trouble than they are worth (or more specifically, players drafted high in the NHL draft who THINK they should be a one-and-done player). mostly because those players are focused on making the NHL and not doing the little things it takes to win at UW.

I still believe that the 2010 team underachieved inspite of making the champ game in Detroit.

[markwojo]

Re: WISCONSIN Hockey Vol. 22 - Let's not have another cheesy thread title... Wait, W

IMHO, it's not the system that is the problem, it's the quality of F's, the uneven recruiting classes, and lack of a stud goalie since Elliott left. Rumpel has the makings of fixing 1/3 of the problem, the uneven class deal is almost hopeless to fix and the quality of F's is fixable, but will it get fixed?

Ding Ding Ding...we have a winner. Goalie U turned into average goalie U. The uneven balance in classes does seem like a vicious hopeless cycle at this point. We have the feast or famine of extremely young teams turning into extrememly veteran teams a few years later. Problem is when we are extrememly young, we take our lumps. Agree F recruiting/balance always seems just a touch off. We always seem to have a few really good forwards, but generally seem like we are short one or two more.

[MaizeRage]

Re: WISCONSIN Hockey Vol. 22 - Let's not have another cheesy thread title... Wait, W

So....Bill Butters just quit today.

[TUSCHWI]

Re: WISCONSIN Hockey Vol. 22 - Let's not have another cheesy thread title... Wait, W

So....Bill Butters just quit today.

I just saw that. Wonder what's up..

[TUSCHWI]

Re: WISCONSIN Hockey Vol. 22 - Let's not have another cheesy thread title... Wait, W

That's a flawed logic.

Different players, different years, different talent levels. The old offensive system didn't have a problem working back in 09-10.

Maybe it's too early to jump the gun (Ok, I know it's too early even though I frustratingly wrote they need to dump it) but man it's been ugly to watch at times.

Wisconsin already has a bad perception in the minds of recruits in terms of Eaves limiting their offensive creativity, now we're going to play a system that sits back and traps even more? Guys like Lucia and Berenson are laughing.

Chuck, completely agree with you. Spot on, especially with Lucia and Berenson laughing. Not a good feeling.

[solovsfett]

Re: WISCONSIN Hockey Vol. 22 - Let's not have another cheesy thread title... Wait, W

http://www.uwbadgers.com/sports/m-ho...110712aae.html

well, not sure what this means. I'm not sure Butters brings enough to the table anymore (given he'd been out of the game for a while and his passion I think lies elsewhere at this point) to consider this a huge loss.