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  • Re: NCAA Change the Tourney

    Originally posted by Priceless View Post
    No, you aren't.

    The tournament champion of the "autobid conferences" would have only earned an-large berth in 2009 when Air Force finished #14. Other than that, no tournament champion has been rated high enough to get an invite. The highest-ranked champion was Holy Cross in 2006 (#21). Bemidji State finished #8 but did not win the conference autobid.

    The autobid is absolutely needed for those conference(s) to earn an invitation to the Big Dance.
    what? nobody is talking about tournament champions, i said conference champions, as did all the other posters before me. sigh. everyone already agrees having tournament auto bids is a good idea. the gray area is conf. champs. but anyway. nice relevant post, lol. its funny to think you were so eager to respond and mash that reply button so hard that you didnt even stop to read it. but its generally true that people dont really read things, they just respond to what they want to have read. lol the funniest part is that you truncated my comment down to spotlighting the word conference and you still didn't bother to read it correctly. lol
    Last edited by nudgy_olsen; 04-12-2011, 02:41 PM. Reason: more lolz

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    • Re: NCAA Change the Tourney

      Originally posted by billmich88888 View Post
      if air force hadn`t won their tourney, they certainly would have ranked below the line to get an at large bid....
      They would have been #20, well below the cut line.

      Originally posted by nudgy_olsen View Post
      what? nobody is talking about tournament champions, i said conference champions, as did all the other posters before me. sigh. everyone already agrees having tournament auto bids is a good idea. the gray area is conf. champs. but anyway. nice relevant post, lol. its funny to think you were so eager to respond and mash that reply button so hard that you didnt even stop to read it. but its generally true that people dont really read things, they just respond to what they want to have read. lol the funniest part is that you truncated my comment down to spotlighting the word conference and you still didn't bother to read it correctly. lol
      Let me rephrase, since you seem to be a stickler.

      No, you aren't.

      The regular season champion of the "autobid conferences" would have only earned an-large berth in 2009 when Bemidji State finished #8. Other than that, no regular season champion has been rated high enough to get an invite.

      The autobid is absolutely needed for those conference(s) to earn an invitation to the Big Dance.

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      • Re: NCAA Change the Tourney

        Originally posted by Rover View Post
        I'm curious if anybody feels the way I do upon completion of what seemed to be a successful tournament, which is that the whole NCAA hockey tourament process really doesn't need any wholesale changes after all. I think I can sum up my feelings in two thoughts: 1) No more St. Louis for the regionals, and 2) do a better job of making regionals more attractive (lower ticket prices, better promotion).
        I agree with you.

        But I think there's a legitimate discussion about how important "atmosphere" is and how much making the regionals attractive could accomplish. IMO, you could promote them better and let in everyone for free, and you'd still have an attendance problem, unless there's a local team involved. The NCAA hockey generally is a niche sport, so it's questionable how much effect promotion would have locally. For fans of the teams, for many the cost of the ticket is much less of a concern than the cost of travel and accomodations. Travel to conference tournaments and the FF can be planned in advance. Travel to regionals, in the current setup, can't.
        Last edited by CLS; 04-12-2011, 02:56 PM. Reason: spelling

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        • Re: NCAA Change the Tourney

          so you're saying that when the big ten conf starts, 12 of the 16 slots are going to be auto-locked up. and the 2nd place team in a conference could potentially not get an invite because we want to make sure its fair for RIT to get in? You know that team that won the national championship this year? They were 4th in their conference, despite having a .700 win record, and as few losses as UND.

          So assuming BTC exists this year, DU, UNH, UMD, Notre Dame, or Miami would have had to stay home completely with their >.650 overall win %, in order to make it fair for RIT or whatever AHA or ECAC team happens to make it to the top so that they can get in? Get real.

          They already had this before, it was called the CC exemption (they won the WCHA conf title, and didn't get an NCAA inv), and then they removed it because it was a terrible idea. But to try and re-implement it, not for the sake of CC's situation, but under a different disguise for the "fairness" that AHA's luckbox of the year gets in is not only completely unfair to the 2nd place finisher of a high SOS, but redundant all together.

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          • Re: NCAA Change the Tourney

            The "CC Rule" was removed because the NCAA frowns upon giving 2 autobids to a conference in any sport. It won't be coming back anytime soon. If the BTHC is exempted and given an autobid from the beginning and the other 5 conferences remain, there will be 6 autobids and 10 at-large berths as there have been for most of the 16-team tournament history.

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            • Re: NCAA Change the Tourney

              Originally posted by nudgy_olsen View Post
              so you're saying that when the big ten conf starts, 12 of the 16 slots are going to be auto-locked up. and the 2nd place team in a conference could potentially not get an invite because we want to make sure its fair for RIT to get in? You know that team that won the national championship this year? They were 4th in their conference, despite having a .700 win record, and as few losses as UND.

              So assuming BTC exists this year, DU, UNH, UMD, Notre Dame, or Miami would have had to stay home completely with their >.650 overall win %, in order to make it fair for RIT or whatever AHA or ECAC team happens to make it to the top so that they can get in? Get real.

              They already had this before, it was called the CC exemption (they won the WCHA conf title, and didn't get an NCAA inv), and then they removed it because it was a terrible idea. But to try and re-implement it, not for the sake of CC's situation, but under a different disguise for the "fairness" that AHA's luckbox of the year gets in is not only completely unfair to the 2nd place finisher of a high SOS, but redundant all together.
              Priceless isn’t suggesting anything of the sort. He was responding to your statement:
              justifying an autobid for a conference champ is redundant, as they are most likely going to be an at-large candidate anyway.
              That’s not true for AHA, and for the CHA when it existed. In most years the regular season champion is not an at-large candidate.

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              • Re: NCAA Change the Tourney

                Originally posted by CLS View Post
                That’s not true for AHA, and for the CHA when it existed. In most years the regular season champion is not an at-large candidate.
                and that's fine, it doesn't mean theres a flaw in the system. AHA teams have barely made a dent in the NCAAs in the chances they've been given. To think sticking another one in there for the sake of fairness is going to help out is silly. like i said, the team that won the national title this year, finished 4th in their conference, and lost the first game of their conference tournament. were they deserving of a bid? absolutely. great 6-0 non-conf rec, and had just as few losses as North Dakota. replacing them with the team that won the AHA is not only situationally unfair, but also unequal in terms of team potential.

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                • Re: NCAA Change the Tourney

                  Originally posted by nudgy_olsen View Post
                  and that's fine, it doesn't mean theres a flaw in the system. AHA teams have barely made a dent in the NCAAs in the chances they've been given. To think sticking another one in there for the sake of fairness is going to help out is silly. like i said, the team that won the national title this year, finished 4th in their conference, and lost the first game of their conference tournament. were they deserving of a bid? absolutely. great 6-0 non-conf rec, and had just as few losses as North Dakota. replacing them with the team that won the AHA is not only situationally unfair, but also unequal in terms of team potential.
                  I violently agree. Exactly one poster (not Priceless) suggested adding an autobid for regular season champions and he got almost no support. You're preaching to the choir.

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                  • Re: NCAA Change the Tourney

                    Originally posted by CLS View Post
                    I violently agree. Exactly one poster (not Priceless) suggested adding an autobid for regular season champions and he got almost no support. You're preaching to the choir.
                    Let's remember... the autobid is at the discretion of the league... they are the ones that decide it to give it to the post-season tournament champions. They are under no obligation to do so.
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                    • Re: NCAA Change the Tourney

                      Originally posted by Patman View Post
                      Let's remember... the autobid is at the discretion of the league... they are the ones that decide it to give it to the post-season tournament champions. They are under no obligation to do so.
                      In Division I basketball, in both the men's and women's tournament, the regular-season Ivy League champion gets the league's auto bid; they do not hold a post-season tournament. Until only several years ago, the Big Ten also sent their regular season champion, their league tournament is a relatively recent innovation for them.

                      While it is not feasible, I'd much prefer that all the league tournaments be replaced collectively by a broader field...you'd play the same games in the same weekends, except for expanded overall stakes.... on the one hand, you have to funnel teams into the tournament only through autobid or at-large. That imperative intersects with the randomness that occurs whenever league tournaments produce different results than league seasons. The result sometimes seems like a bit of a traffic jam.

                      Theoretically, if you replace every one of the league tournaments with a broader national field at the end of everyone's regular season instead, it sounds like you could get just about everything everyone is asking for (the only problem being you'd be taking away something that few want to give up....)

                      The top eight teams nationally get first round bye (1st place in x leagues, plus best y of z 2nd place teams), then take the next best 16, for an overall tournament field of 24. For some leagues, top three teams are in; for other leagues, top two teams are in, for another league, maybe only top team gets in...and you also have three or four wildcards beyond that as well, to spice it up (and round up to 24).

                      Most of the rest of the hosting timelines and decisions and ancillary details follow in a more reliable and predictable way as well, or at least I would hope....

                      Naturally the post-season tournaments won't be replaced with an expanded national field because the money flows (and power fiefdoms!) are different.....still, I think this kind of format would be a lot more exciting than what we have now....regular season becomes magnified, AND the playoffs become more electric as well....
                      Last edited by FreshFish; 04-12-2011, 07:09 PM.
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