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Im sick of the BTHC fearmongering

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  • Im sick of the BTHC fearmongering

    I cant believe adding 1 school can supposivly will hurt college hockey. I mean michigan just added lacrosse yet you dont have teams folding there lacrosse programs. College hockey has abig problem that nobody wants to say because they think youll hate college hockey. Many small schools in the CCHA have used playing 2-3 schools a year as theree sole source of revenue. Why are smalll schools in the WCHA doing well why the CCHA supposively cant?

  • #2
    Re: Im sick of the BTHC fearmongering

    First, quit eviscerating the English language.

    Second, these schools have reasonable points- if you can only make money off two or three games a year and you're about to lose those games, you're screwed. These are not Ivy League schools with multi-billion dollar endowments; they are not major sports' schools with basketball or football programs that can keep them afloat. These are mostly small colleges with little name recognition and, in most cases, pretty small endowments. If you take away their main sources of revenue each year, they will not only not make profit, but they will begin to hemorrhage money, and thus will not be able to afford keeping their teams.

    This is simple economics. I don't know why the smaller WCHA teams are doing so well with a different approach than the CCHA teams; good for them. However, as a completely neutral (and uninformed) observer from the East, I have to take issue with your assumption that since the smaller WCHA teams can build sustainable success without a handful of major money-makers per season, then so can the CCHA teams. Each team's situation is unique, and it is possible that many of the CCHA teams simply have no other avenues for making the money necessary to keep their programs around. Who knows? But if as many people are saying that some of these teams will have to fold as you make it seem, there must be some truth behind it all.

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    • #3
      Re: Im sick of the BTHC fearmongering

      Originally posted by kdiff77 View Post
      First, quit eviscerating the English language.

      Second, these schools have reasonable points- if you can only make money off two or three games a year and you're about to lose those games, you're screwed. These are not Ivy League schools with multi-billion dollar endowments; they are not major sports' schools with basketball or football programs that can keep them afloat. These are mostly small colleges with little name recognition and, in most cases, pretty small endowments. If you take away their main sources of revenue each year, they will not only not make profit, but they will begin to hemorrhage money, and thus will not be able to afford keeping their teams.

      This is simple economics. I don't know why the smaller WCHA teams are doing so well with a different approach than the CCHA teams; good for them. However, as a completely neutral (and uninformed) observer from the East, I have to take issue with your assumption that since the smaller WCHA teams can build sustainable success without a handful of major money-makers per season, then so can the CCHA teams. Each team's situation is unique, and it is possible that many of the CCHA teams simply have no other avenues for making the money necessary to keep their programs around. Who knows? But if as many people are saying that some of these teams will have to fold as you make it seem, there must be some truth behind it all.
      As a Minnesota State fan, I'm not at all sure that the WCHA small programs will do okay once the Gophers and Badgers leave. We'll not only lose the revenue from those particular games, but I fear that a lot of folks in the Mankato area will no longer see MSU hockey as being in a "big-time" conference once the Gophers leave. Oh, I know they've said they'll still schedule the other Minnesota teams, but I don't believe for a minute that they'll come to Mankato, and even the games in Minneapolis will only be every few years.

      We have a lot of other problems, so it is going to be difficult to separate the various effects in the next few years. For example, I expect a big drop in season-ticket sales this coming year after the 11th place finish this year. I know a lot of season-ticket holders who have told me that they've finally had enough, and won't be renewing. The attendance slide may already be well underway by the time the Gophers actually leave the conference.
      My guy is a hard-nosed hockey player who is not afraid to crash the net. Your guy is a goon who runs the goalie.

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      • #4
        Re: Im sick of the BTHC fearmongering

        Originally posted by kdiff77 View Post
        First, quit eviscerating the English language.

        Second, these schools have reasonable points- if you can only make money off two or three games a year and you're about to lose those games, you're screwed. These are not Ivy League schools with multi-billion dollar endowments; they are not major sports' schools with basketball or football programs that can keep them afloat. These are mostly small colleges with little name recognition and, in most cases, pretty small endowments. If you take away their main sources of revenue each year, they will not only not make profit, but they will begin to hemorrhage money, and thus will not be able to afford keeping their teams.

        This is simple economics. I don't know why the smaller WCHA teams are doing so well with a different approach than the CCHA teams; good for them. However, as a completely neutral (and uninformed) observer from the East, I have to take issue with your assumption that since the smaller WCHA teams can build sustainable success without a handful of major money-makers per season, then so can the CCHA teams. Each team's situation is unique, and it is possible that many of the CCHA teams simply have no other avenues for making the money necessary to keep their programs around. Who knows? But if as many people are saying that some of these teams will have to fold as you make it seem, there must be some truth behind it all.
        How is that the BTHC fault? Isnt that the fault of the individual schools?

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        • #5
          Re: Im sick of the BTHC fearmongering

          Originally posted by gophfan View Post
          How is that the BTHC fault? Isnt that the fault of the individual schools?
          Why does it have to be somebody's fault? Some things are just facts. The fact is that without Minnesota/Wisconsin home games, the revenue of some of the smaller WCHA teams will suffer - from the direct effect of lost revenue at those games and from the indirect effect of less overall interest in the program.

          As to the amount, impact, and implications of that lost revenue - that's where we start wandering into opinion territory...
          If you don't change the world today, how can it be any better tomorrow?

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          • #6
            Re: Im sick of the BTHC fearmongering

            Originally posted by MavsFan View Post
            ....but I fear that a lot of folks in the Mankato area will no longer see MSU hockey as being in a "big-time" conference once the Gophers leave....
            That's a very interesting opinion. One that I have to really think over.

            I normally don't get into the BT arguments, but do have to post that you have a particularly interesting point that I'm not sure I belive. Still, a great point.

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            • #7
              Re: Im sick of the BTHC fearmongering

              Originally posted by alfablue View Post
              That's a very interesting opinion. One that I have to really think over.

              I normally don't get into the BT arguments, but do have to post that you have a particularly interesting point that I'm not sure I belive. Still, a great point.
              BTHC hockey will be awesome! Every game will be tough! Great exposure for players! Great action for fans to watch! I can't wait!!!!

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              • #8
                Re: Im sick of the BTHC fearmongering

                Originally posted by Big Papa View Post
                BTHC hockey will be awesome! Every game will be tough! Great exposure for players! Great action for fans to watch! I can't wait!!!!
                that I don't disagree with.

                But for an MSU fan, will they see the WCHA as some kind of inferior conference now? That's a very interesting thought. My first reaction was "no way", but then I considered it, and there's a point to that, whether correct or not- it's about fan preception.

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                • #9
                  Re: Im sick of the BTHC fearmongering

                  Originally posted by MavsFan View Post
                  . We'll not only lose the revenue from those particular games, but I fear that a lot of folks in the Mankato area will no longer see MSU hockey as being in a "big-time" conference once the Gophers leave.
                  Wow, I wonder how that makes UND, DU, UMD, SCSU, CC feel. I guess the WCHA won't be big time anymore. Who knew.
                  Slap Shot - 444 might want to consider a restraining order.
                  dggoddard - Minnesota is THE ELITE Program in all of college hockey.
                  wasmania - you have to be the very best to get ice time with the great gophers!

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                  • #10
                    Re: Im sick of the BTHC fearmongering

                    Originally posted by 4four4 View Post
                    Wow, I wonder how that makes UND, DU, UMD, SCSU, CC feel. I guess the WCHA won't be big time anymore. Who knew.
                    There is a chunk of fans that view their schools in the WCHA/CCHA in Minnesota and Michigan "big time" hockey because they play in a conference with Minnesota, Wisconsin, Michigan and Michigan State simply because of college football/basketball. I'm not going to lie and say it wasn't easier to draw in a casual fan to a game against Northern Michigan simply by mentioning that WMU swept Michigan State earlier in the season.

                    How big a chunk that is and how many of them totally bail on college hockey is the question and probably varies from school to school.
                    "I went over the facts in my head, and admired how much uglier the situation had just become. Over the years I've learned that ignorance is more than just bliss. It's freaking orgasmic ecstasy".- Harry Dresden, Blood Rites


                    Western Michigan Bronco Hockey- 2012 Mason Cup Champions

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                    • #11
                      Re: Im sick of the BTHC fearmongering

                      Originally posted by LynahFan View Post
                      Why does it have to be somebody's fault? Some things are just facts. The fact is that without Minnesota/Wisconsin home games, the revenue of some of the smaller WCHA teams will suffer - from the direct effect of lost revenue at those games and from the indirect effect of less overall interest in the program.

                      As to the amount, impact, and implications of that lost revenue - that's where we start wandering into opinion territory...
                      This. It's not anyone's FAULT, per se; but is it going to happen? Probably.

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                      • #12
                        Re: Im sick of the BTHC fearmongering

                        Easy on the Ivy league. Most of their "multi-billion dollar endowment" is tied up in academic education rather than men's ice hockey, unlike North Dakota or Penn State. Could it be that smaller college hockey schools are disappearing due to the increased cost of recruiting (scholarships) and paying (salaries and benefits) college hockey players? Yup.


                        "I can see a whole mess of trees, but where's the forest?" - Captain Peter "Wrong Way" Peach Fuzz.

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                        • #13
                          Re: Im sick of the BTHC fearmongering

                          Originally posted by 4four4 View Post
                          Wow, I wonder how that makes UND, DU, UMD, SCSU, CC feel. I guess the WCHA won't be big time anymore. Who knew.
                          I think you can take DU, NoDak and CC out of that equation as I think the poster's point was an in-state rivalry with the flagship team.
                          "Hockey is the only tribe I belong to." --Jack Falla

                          "Why, as a matter of fact, I suggested starting a hockey program to Father Callahan, our president. He was downright interested until we came to the use of sticks, and then he threw up his hands. He said, 'No, that game is not for our University. Notre Dame will never endorse any game that puts a club in the hands of an Irishman.' " -- Knute Rockne: All American

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                          • #14
                            Re: Im sick of the BTHC fearmongering

                            Originally posted by 4four4 View Post
                            Wow, I wonder how that makes UND, DU, UMD, SCSU, CC feel. I guess the WCHA won't be big time anymore. Who knew.
                            Obviously, they are not going down at all. But it's possible that some fans will precieve that they are. that's what I'm thinking is interesting- and am not so sure it's true or not....

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                            • #15
                              Re: Im sick of the BTHC fearmongering

                              Originally posted by Jeff_Jackson_for_Pres. View Post
                              I think you can take DU, NoDak and CC out of that equation as I think the poster's point was an in-state rivalry with the flagship team.
                              correct, there is a large difference when a Mankato fan can say "we not only play in the best conference in the State, it's the best conference in the Nation, and we are going to beat Minnesota when they come to town", and saying, "well, the WCHA isn't chopped liver, and we might get to play Minnesota in Mpls once in a while, maybe, and then we will beat them, if we get a game at all".
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                              The reason for the talent in the west? Because MN didn't rely on Canada.

                              Originally posted by MN Pond Hockey
                              Menards could have sold a lot of rope

                              this morning in Grand Forks if North Dakota had trees.

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