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LSSU Laker Hockey 2011-12

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  • Re: LSSU Laker Hockey 2011-12

    Originally posted by jnacc View Post
    Judging from this AD's comments, it certainly appears that the hoped for merger between the "left overs" of the WCHA/CCHA is not on the table and the best we can hope for is "a new look CCHA!"

    We as fans can certainly voice our opinions and desires to the AD and even the school president but we're going to have to accept the fact that they have little control and influence over the powers that be in the new WCHA...in short, it appears they do not want us and we cannot force our way in.

    How excited will fans be over a conference that consists of Ferris, B.G., LSSU, UAH, Niagra and Robert Morris??? Do you think that fans would embrace a Laker team in such a division even if they are competitive? I suspect crowds will average no more than 12-1400 and I wonder if that will be enough to sustain the program?
    Good evening, gentlemen.

    I share the same concerns as those I have quoted above. In my team's thread I went and looked up the attendance for home non-conference games in which we played teams that could very likely resemble future CCHA opponents that will take the place of the Big Ten schools leaving. It wasn't pretty. Hopefully you can fare better than we have the past couple seasons at gate.

    I wish you the best of luck.
    FERRIS STATE UNIVERSITY: 2012 FROZEN FOUR


    God, that was fun...

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    • Re: LSSU Laker Hockey 2011-12

      Originally posted by Lakerblue View Post
      The CHA, circa 2007:

      Wayne State (closed)
      Finlay (closed)
      Niagara (moved to ECAC)
      BSU (moved to WCHA, only to be dumped by larger programs)
      UAH (independant, struggling)
      Air Force (moved to AHA)

      Robert Morris was added later.

      Not exactly a stunning predictor of future succes when, as I see it, the possiblity of a revamped CCHA looks more, and more, and more like a revamped CHA.
      I surely want to see us in the "new" WCHA, but if they don't want us and we have to rework the CCHA, there likely will be more stability to it than the old CHA. That's assuming teams like Niagara, Robert Morris, Mercyhurst and Canisius are added. The CHA had instability written all over it. Teams were from all over the place geographically ; e.g. Bemidji, Air Force, UAH. Air Force wanted to be in the same conference as Army. Wayne Sate was rejected by the CCHA. Findlay was never much of a program. Now will the fans support a revamped CCHA? I don't know. If I still lived in the Soo area, I'd always be attending Laker games regardless of who they were playing and what conference they were in. But whether more casual fans would provide the same level of support, who knows. Personally I think putting a winning team on the ice will go a long way towards putting more fans in the stands regardless of which conference we wind up in.

      Comment


      • Re: LSSU Laker Hockey 2011-12

        Originally posted by Bill View Post
        Now will the fans support a revamped CCHA? I don't know..... Personally I think putting a winning team on the ice will go a long way towards putting more fans in the stands regardless of which conference we wind up in.
        I wonder...part of me says sure, winning always attracts a crowd but the other side says that those accustomed to a high level of play brought on by teams like Michigan, Notre Dame and other elite schools will simply not be satisfied by the large drop off in talent shown by teams like Robert Morris and they will stay away even if the Lakers are winning.

        Much has been made about the Eagles success at the gate but remember that they only averaged 500 or so fans a game during their "winning" regular season. It was only in the 2nd round against the T-birds did attendance double and then triple but I have to ask, did they once sell out the Pullar?

        Now some of you may say that we are talking about Junior A Tier II hockey and you cannot compare that to NCAA D-1 hockey but let’s be honest here folks, such a proposed "new CCHA" would be D-1 in name only and for all intent and purposes would be a D-2 caliber conference and would such a conference really be able to attract 3000 fans a game????

        Comment


        • Re: LSSU Laker Hockey 2011-12

          Originally posted by Neil Diamond View Post
          The high school football, high school basketball, and college basketball vultures are hoovering overhead, hoping it is only a matter of time before they can swoop down on the hockey corpse they see as, if not mortally wounded, at least with serious enough wounds to change the sport culture of the EUP (how's that for creative license???)
          I have lived in the Sault for over 25 years. I don't see all of these vultures flying around hoping for the demise of Laker hockey. Sure, there are a few haters here and there, but for the most part, people in this region would love to see the University and its hockey program flourish.

          The Evening News writer was just throwing out his thoughts on where he thinks LSSU hockey will end up. It was titled a "commentary". Who cares if he covers a lot of basketball? It was just his opinion. Take it with a grain of salt.

          Comment


          • Re: LSSU Laker Hockey 2011-12

            Originally posted by jnacc View Post
            I wonder...part of me says sure, winning always attracts a crowd but the other side says that those accustomed to a high level of play brought on by teams like Michigan, Notre Dame and other elite schools will simply not be satisfied by the large drop off in talent shown by teams like Robert Morris and they will stay away even if the Lakers are winning.

            Much has been made about the Eagles success at the gate but remember that they only averaged 500 or so fans a game during their "winning" regular season. It was only in the 2nd round against the T-birds did attendance double and then triple but I have to ask, did they once sell out the Pullar?

            Now some of you may say that we are talking about Junior A Tier II hockey and you cannot compare that to NCAA D-1 hockey but let’s be honest here folks, such a proposed "new CCHA" would be D-1 in name only and for all intent and purposes would be a D-2 caliber conference and would such a conference really be able to attract 3000 fans a game????
            If Robert Morris, Niagara, Canisius and Mercyhurst came over from Atlantic Hockey, the retooled CCHA would probably be half Div 1 schools and half Div 2 schools, all playing Div 1 hockey. Granted they wouldn't be the big Div 1 schools we're used to seeing.

            Comment


            • Re: LSSU Laker Hockey 2011-12

              Cool! I sent a request to join the group.
              Last edited by LSSULaker889294; 07-18-2011, 11:25 PM.
              LSSU hockey-3 time NCAA champs 1988, 1992, 1994

              Comment


              • Re: LSSU Laker Hockey 2011-12

                Originally posted by DopeyBaker View Post
                I have lived in the Sault for over 25 years. I don't see all of these vultures flying around hoping for the demise of Laker hockey. Sure, there are a few haters here and there, but for the most part, people in this region would love to see the University and its hockey program flourish.

                The Evening News writer was just throwing out his thoughts on where he thinks LSSU hockey will end up. It was titled a "commentary". Who cares if he covers a lot of basketball? It was just his opinion. Take it with a grain of salt.
                Hi Pete

                You and I obviously run in different crowds. I'm around the "vultures" on a daily basis; I hear their comments. I've been around them at meetings where the number one goal is to develop a plan that takes the focus off hockey and places it elsewhere. I've seen their utter frustration at the "hockey culture" they live in. I see their happiness when Laker hockey struggles. I see their dismay when the Eagles draw 1,000 fans to a game. I see their celebratory mood when Soo High hockey is eliminated early from state tournament play. I hear the same excuses year after year why our high school basketball and football teams never win a big championship: because of the hockey culture...hockey sticks are placed in kids hands before they can walk (or so the story goes); kids are made to focus on hockey by their parents; kids are forced to play hockey twelve months out of the year. If not for that, our high school football team would be winning state championships, as would our basketball teams. So hockey is a convenient scapegoat for the relative lack of success experienced by our high school teams.

                Don't tell me there isn't an anti-hockey cadre in the Soo, whose number one target is Laker hockey.

                Then I ask them to do this: pretend the Soo is not in Upper Michigan, but instead Central Texas. Pretend the town doesn't have a hockey culture, but rather a football culture. Now pretend that instead of Laker hockey being the big dog in our local sports scene, instead high school football is.

                Then they, especially the 'football people', tell me to kindly bugger off.

                They are not upset we are a town with a tunnel vision towards one sport; they are upset that tunnel vision isn't directed on their sport.

                Comment


                • Re: LSSU Laker Hockey 2011-12

                  Without a doubt there are basketball people in our town for whom hockey is a foreign and unpleasant sport, which they neither understand nor support. I think these people are a relative loud minority -- because this city really is a deep hockey-first city. Sadly, the Lakers haven't provided many thrills the past few years. And winning ultimately matters.

                  But lets not fall into this negativity trap -- this trap which paints everything as horrible, which paints everything as negative. Let us not give into this thought process that says the Lakers are in horrible trouble because they only drew 2,000 or 2,200 per game average the past few seasons. We in Laker Country need to stop this hand-wringing. This program has played mostly terrible hockey, certainly boring hockey, for many years. This program has played very few important games over the past decade -- and won very few of them. The CCHA is a depressing league, poorly run, with struggling programs. And yet, in a town with a small population, with a crippling recession, and despite the fear and panic mongering from the "leaders" on the Hill and the basketball people in town -- STILL -- our Lakers brought in over 2,000 people on most nights. Its cold, its dark, the snow is piled up to the roof. Nobody has any money. The school has done a poor job selling Laker hockey, the coach is a snooze, the team is generally losing, and is generally bland -- and STILL the team brings out 2,000+ fans.

                  The Soo has what, 13,000 people? (Don't tell me about Soo Ontario either).

                  This is the sort of thing I am talking about. I fall into the trap too easily myself. We need to remind ourselves, and then remind the school, that Laker hockey is alive and well. We want a better league, or a leadersip position in a new league? Lets act like we deserve it. Lets take control.

                  No WCHA? That will be terrible -- but what are our options if this happens? I say LSSU takes charge. Put the league offices in the Soo. Take the position that LSSU is the best situated college hockey school in the remaining mess. If we must band together and take on UAH, Ferris, BGSU, and Robert Morris, Niagara, Mercyhurst -- then lets take a position that LSSU is the biggest, best, more traditional-laden team of that group.
                  Last edited by Lakerblue; 07-19-2011, 10:51 AM.

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                  • Re: LSSU Laker Hockey 2011-12

                    Holy **** a lot is going on in college hockey this summer. I hope the Lakers find their niche in the college hockey landscape for the 2013-14 season. I think we would all like to see some of the WCHA teams in our barn in the future but it seems that may not be an option. Whatever happens I just want to see the Lakers in action at Abel Arena come october for many years to come! Came across this write up on Zach Trotman from the Bruins camp a few weeks ago:

                    89 Zach Trotman
                    Vitals: 6-4, 202
                    Acquired: 7th round in 2010 (210th overall)
                    2010-11 amateur team: Lake Superior State Lakers (CCHA)
                    Signing status: Unsigned
                    Camp notes: One of the most pleasant surprises of any B’s prospect in attendance. Big man moves well with a good stride, initial quickness and agility. Skates with his head up and makes all the requisite breakouts and lead passes. Effective on the point with a quick wrister or big bomb that he mixes up nicely. Looks to be on a strong upward developmental curve as an older player who turns 21 next month. Entering his junior season at Lake Superior State after leading all team defenders in scoring a year ago. Still raw, but appears to have all the requisite tools that would allow him to play at the highest level. Trotman is another project player, but one who given the right time and chance to come along at a steady pace, could pay off for Boston as the last prospect picked in the 2010 NHL draft.

                    Comment


                    • Re: LSSU Laker Hockey 2011-12

                      The CCHA has talked to Atlantic Hockey about the possibility of adding Robert Morris, Niagara, Canisius and Mercyhurst:

                      http://www.westerncollegehockeyblog.com/

                      Comment


                      • Re: LSSU Laker Hockey 2011-12

                        I don't pay a ton of attention to LSSU, but what exactly has happened to their recruiting over the last 10-12 years? Is this purely a function of coaching or were there other factors at play.

                        Comment


                        • Re: LSSU Laker Hockey 2011-12

                          Originally posted by AVFC View Post
                          I don't pay a ton of attention to LSSU, but what exactly has happened to their recruiting over the last 10-12 years? Is this purely a function of coaching or were there other factors at play.
                          There were certainly other factors at play. Here is their 1992 NCAA Championship team's roster, with age, class and place of birth:

                          FORWARDS
                          Clayton Beddoes (21, So, Bentley, Alta.)
                          Paul Constantin (23, Sr, Burlington, Ont.)
                          Vincent Faucher (24, Sr, Dorion, PQ)
                          John Hendry (21, Jr, Toronto, Ont.)
                          Dean Hulett (20, Jr, San Juan, PR)
                          Sandy Moger (22, Sr, 100 Mile House, B.C.)
                          Mike Morin (20, Fr, Melville, Sask.)
                          Jay Ness (21, So, Grand Forks, ND)
                          Brian Rolston (19, Fr, Flint, MI)
                          Wayne Strachan (19, Fr, Fort Frances, Ont.)
                          Rob Valicevic (20, Fr, Detroit, MI)

                          DEFENSE
                          Mark Astley (22, Sr, Calgary, Alta.)
                          Mike Bachusz (22, Jr, Waterford, MI)
                          Steve Barnes (21, So, Gravenhurst, Ont.)
                          Tim Hanley (21, Fr, Windsor, Ont.)
                          Jim Peters (22, So, Barrie, Ont.)
                          Michael Smith (20, Jr, Winnipeg, Man.)
                          Darren Wetherill (21, So, Regina, Sask.)

                          GOALIES
                          Blaine Lacher (21, Fr, Medicine Hat, Alta.)
                          Darrin Madeley (23, Jr, Holland Landing, Ont.)

                          Easily half of these kids would end up in the CHL today, and several of the rest would prefer the WCHA to the CCHA. Lake Superior's recruiting grounds dried up. Some of the issue, of course, is that the coaches in the late 1990s did not adapt as this process was happening. But to blame this entirely on the coaching staff would be to ignore the major trend in college hockey over the last 20 years.

                          "The game of hockey, though much in vogue on the ice in New England and other parts of the United States, is not much known here."

                          --The Montreal Gazette, March 4, 1875.

                          Comment


                          • Re: LSSU Laker Hockey 2011-12

                            Originally posted by Bill View Post
                            The CCHA has talked to Atlantic Hockey about the possibility of adding Robert Morris, Niagara, Canisius and Mercyhurst:

                            http://www.westerncollegehockeyblog.com/
                            It seems that the pieces are all falling into place...some big questions remain such as what to do with Alaska and where will Western Michigan go but all and all the Lakers will most likely be in a conference that many of us did not wish to see them in.
                            The upside is that the Lakers will certainly be one of the if not the top dog...heck I believe Cansisus, Niagra and Mercyhurst play in arenas that seat less than 2000 and I imagine that their facilities are substandard. The downside is that this is a HUGE drop from the current structure of the CCHA and Lake State will be part of one of the weakest college hockey conferences.

                            Easily half of these kids would end up in the CHL today, and several of the rest would prefer the WCHA to the CCHA. Lake Superior's recruiting grounds dried up. Some of the issue, of course, is that the coaches in the late 1990s did not adapt as this process was happening. But to blame this entirely on the coaching staff would be to ignore the major trend in college hockey over the last 20 years.
                            Pretty much bang on....people have to remember that back in the mid to late 80's, the OHL only had 15 teams and education packages were almost unheard of....today, there are 20 teams and all players receive standard education packages that at a minimum pay full tuition and books making it hard for NCAA teams to recruit against them. There were also something like 35-40 D-1 programs at the time and schools like Ohio State, Miami and Notre Dame didn't give a hoot about their hockey programs...much of course has changed since then and Lake State was unable to adapt and keep up with the changes.

                            Comment


                            • Re: LSSU Laker Hockey 2011-12

                              I am sickened at the thought of being in the CHA cicra 2013. I wish that LSSU would, in lieu of heading west, demand a complete dismantling of the CCHA and create new league. I want to see UAH in this mix -- if only because I don't give a rat's fanny about what the AHA teams feel about travel. Grow up if you want to play D-I sports. Besides, UAH has a larger facility than almost all of the mentioned AHA teams combined.

                              But what a raggy, cruddy, bottom-feeder league:

                              LSSU
                              BGSU
                              Ferris
                              Mercyhurt
                              Niagara
                              Canisious (of however you spell that place)
                              UAH

                              What a joke. And the Laker leadership seems to be just plodding along, tossing up their hands, and dropping on all fours begging for for scraps from mindlessly dull AHA teams.

                              And what of Fairbanks? I hope they move the WCHA. I still think the best option is for Tech, LSSU, NMU, Bemidji, UAA, and UAF to all join together in their own league and let southern Minnesota and southern Michigan rot.

                              The drop in LSSU's fortunes? Jeff Jackson left. He was / is a top-flight colleg hockey coach. End of discussion. The NCAA clearinghouse played a part, but i think the ACT scores required did little to hurt college hockey recruiting because the players who choose to play NCAA hockey have to make taht choice at 15-16 years old, before many ever take an ACT test.

                              As for the OHL issue -- this is a nonstarter to me. Mike Modano went to the CHL, Doug Weight played NCAA. There has always been players who play in the CHL, and there have always been players in the NCAA. If the OHL was a factor in any decline at LSSU, it would have been an equal decline all around the NCAA.

                              Besides, if a kid in 1994 was going to skip the CHL -- LSSU would've been a top target. Brand new beautiful rink, top coaches, championships, passionate fans, and on the boarder with Ontario. Add into that mix the rather generous admissions standards for LSSU, and you get the picture that the OHL was never going to damage LSSU's program.

                              Nope -- the real loss was losing Jackson. There are college coaches who win, and many many more who can't figure out the NCAA game. Jerry York won a ton with BGSU before moving to Boston College. BGSU hasn't been seen since. Dean Blais won at North Dakota and now at Omaha, using Kemp's players to win more games than Kemp ever dreamed. Maine was a machine under Shawn Walsh. George Gwozdecky built Miami from nothing, and then turned Denver into a national champion twice. Jackson is a proven winner.

                              LSSU followed Jackson with Borek (overmatched), Anzalone (past his prime), and Roque (boring hockey). What changed? Nothing. Not a darned thing. Same great building. Same facilities. Same admission requirements. Same proximity to Canada. Same school. A few more CHL teams and a few more NCAA teams -- but that doesn't matter in North Dakota or Boston College. I think the CHL argument is a soft excuse. The hard truth is that coaches MATTER a whole lot in college sports. Period.

                              Great coaches find, recruit, and develop great players. Good coaches usually have good players. Mediocre coaches usually find their level -- and have mediocre players.
                              Last edited by Lakerblue; 07-19-2011, 06:30 PM.

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                              • Re: LSSU Laker Hockey 2011-12

                                Originally posted by Lakerblue View Post
                                LSSU
                                BGSU
                                Ferris
                                Mercyhurt
                                Niagara
                                Canisious (of however you spell that place)
                                UAH
                                And there you will have your first D II men's league, if only in name only.

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