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EaglesNest
03-07-2011, 01:49 PM
just wondering... if EC had the 2nd toughest schedule in the league,and they win the west tourney..
why are they travelling ??

EC809
03-07-2011, 01:49 PM
You might have to carry the purple and gold banner for that one. I can't imagine too many people will be able to make the trip unless Elmira puts together a bus trip.

I told Albert he better get the all the Boys from the Great White North down here for the game.

Pioneers#1
03-07-2011, 01:49 PM
There are also a ton more regional cross over games in basketball. There were what..7...cross over games this year?

And I say it again...go by the criteria...UWS gets in over Castleton, period. People whine they want to go by numbers, and now they want the committee to toss it aside and just pick teams...can't have it both ways

So what exactly is the criteria that got UWS into the NCAA Tourny?

Its just not right though for a team who lost 12 games to get in, period.

I dont care what "criteria" you go by, a team with a much better record(Castleton or Utica) and with multiple less losses than a team who gets in, is just not fair.

Besides your "criteria" that you say got UWS and other teams into the NCAA Tourny, dont you think Castleton or Utica should have gotten into the Tourny?

altazo
03-07-2011, 01:50 PM
SNC would have had a bye either way. It actually cost Hamline a direct ticket to the QF round

This is the truth.

Pioneers#1
03-07-2011, 01:52 PM
just wondering... if EC had the 2nd toughest schedule in the league,and they win the west tourney..
why are they travelling ??

Dident Utica College have the 2nd toughest schedule and EC had the #1 toughest schedule in D-III?

Thats what i heard...

EC809
03-07-2011, 01:53 PM
I hope the Soaring Eagles are coming to the game with EXACTLY that mindset. BTW, we had 1000 people at both games on the weekend. Hope you enjoy your trip to Adrian. Safe drive.:cool:

I live in Davison,Mi Closest Elmira game I have been to EVER!!!!They Won't have that mind set. They don't care what we/I think.

LakerFan99
03-07-2011, 01:56 PM
Dident Utica College have the 2nd toughest schedule and EC had the #1 toughest schedule in D-III?

Thats what i heard...

It's easy to boast a high SOS when you're below .500 in those games.

There is NO criteria that would have gotten Utica in. End of story. You want to be in? Don't lose to Neumann 4 times.

3rdLiner
03-07-2011, 02:11 PM
The West Region should be embarrassed to send a 12 loss team to the tournament. They have had some very good teams in the past that may have gotten screwed the same way that Salem, Castleton, and Utica are getting screwed this year. However if you want credibility you do not want to send a 12 loss team to represent your region. That makes the tournament less interesting and is a slight to the other teams in the tournament and to NCAA D-III hockey as a whole. It is not a perfect system but a little effort on the committees behalf would have saved face for all of the teams.

3rdLiner
03-07-2011, 02:16 PM
Also, having a good SOS is great but shouldn't you win a few more of those games? Otherwise it just proves that you are not a legit contender? I know Castleton did not play the best teams, however all of the bad teams they played they beat pretty easily. At least with Castleton in the mix you have a wild card that may win, I just don't see UWS having a very good shot.
Castleton is undefeated on the road this year, including wins at Midd, Williams, Norwich, NEC, Hamilton, Amherst
They had the 2nd best offense in the country, 2nd best PP, 2nd best winning percentage, goaltending in the top 10, leading scorer in the country, they can compete with anyone. I think UWS did not show that during the course of the year.

PSUChamps2001
03-07-2011, 02:17 PM
You know I don't really care for UWS, but I hope the take out Hamline and SNC and make it to Minn just to shut some people up.

NorthernBlight
03-07-2011, 02:24 PM
The West Region should be embarrassed to send a 12 loss team to the tournament. They have had some very good teams in the past that may have gotten screwed the same way that Salem, Castleton, and Utica are getting screwed this year. However if you want credibility you do not want to send a 12 loss team to represent your region. That makes the tournament less interesting and is a slight to the other teams in the tournament and to NCAA D-III hockey as a whole. It is not a perfect system but a little effort on the committees behalf would have saved face for all of the teams.

Good to see a wizard is mingling among the peasantfolk today. I won't bother asking to know how you know so much about teams youve never seen and selection systems you clearly don't understand, but how about this:

I'll put Superior up against anyone you got. Game time, one hour. See you there.

joeyc3402
03-07-2011, 02:25 PM
The West Region should be embarrassed to send a 12 loss team to the tournament.

The East should be embarrassed not to be able to have anyone else beat out a 12 loss team.

NUProf
03-07-2011, 02:40 PM
The West Region should be embarrassed to send a 12 loss team to the tournament. They have had some very good teams in the past that may have gotten screwed the same way that Salem, Castleton, and Utica are getting screwed this year. However if you want credibility you do not want to send a 12 loss team to represent your region. That makes the tournament less interesting and is a slight to the other teams in the tournament and to NCAA D-III hockey as a whole. It is not a perfect system but a little effort on the committees behalf would have saved face for all of the teams.
The committee did do exactly that, which is something that many of us did not do at the outset of the process.
Look at the data - Here are the two teams ranks on WP, OWP, and OOWP
Castleton 4th 54th 44th

UWS 29th 6th 17th

In addition if we look at winning percentage of team that they beat, Castleton ranks 30th, UWS ranks 18th

UWS succeeded against a better class of teams than Castleton did. Castleton had one huge win against Norwich, beyond that not so much. The committee made the right call.

dmac1103
03-07-2011, 02:43 PM
Castleton 27 games played 7 against ranked Opponents & Wisconsin-Superior 29 games played 17 against ranked Opponents that is what is going to stand out in the NCAA committee when they start to match up the numbers. That also includes a win against the topped rank team in their region, if memory serves correctly when the Adrian fans a few years ago were up in arms about having only 1 loss on their record and did not make the tournament people threw SOS right in their face. Well the same rules apply here according to the NCAA website In-Region SOS (Weighted OWP-OOWP) Castleton .483 & Superior .541 Opp Avg Win Percentage (Region) Castleton .477 & Superior .547 Opp Opp Avg Win Perc (Region) Castleton .495 & Superior .530.

peddler
03-07-2011, 02:47 PM
Castleton 27 games played 7 against ranked Opponents & Wisconsin-Superior 29 games played 17 against ranked Opponents that is what is going to stand out in the NCAA committee when they start to match up the numbers. That also includes a win against the topped rank team in their region, if memory serves correctly when the Adrian fans a few years ago were up in arms about having only 1 loss on their record and did not make the tournament people threw SOS right in their face. Well the same rules apply here according to the NCAA website In-Region SOS (Weighted OWP-OOWP) Castleton .483 & Superior .541 Opp Avg Win Percentage (Region) Castleton .477 & Superior .547 Opp Opp Avg Win Perc (Region) Castleton .495 & Superior .530.

+1 well said

pierre maguire
03-07-2011, 02:50 PM
Sorry I haven't been following this thread and if I repeat anything give me a break, but if you ask me, Castleton, Salem and whatever other "new" schools feel like they got the shaft, welcome to the club! I look at it as more of an initiation.... your first real competitive year where you made a splash in the uscho coaches poll a la Neumann 2006 and you got screwed in the end because you're the new kid on the block. Plain and simple, no respect for you and your programs....yet! Probably viewed as a "fluke" year by most (committee included). Do it again, and then you'll have the attention and respect you deserve. Beef up your out of conference (a little), have another solid season and I don't doubt you'll earn a ticket.

Better luck next year!

snc1
03-07-2011, 02:51 PM
Also, having a good SOS is great but shouldn't you win a few more of those games? Otherwise it just proves that you are not a legit contender? I know Castleton did not play the best teams, however all of the bad teams they played they beat pretty easily. At least with Castleton in the mix you have a wild card that may win, I just don't see UWS having a very good shot.
Castleton is undefeated on the road this year, including wins at Midd, Williams, Norwich, NEC, Hamilton, Amherst
They had the 2nd best offense in the country, 2nd best PP, 2nd best winning percentage, goaltending in the top 10, leading scorer in the country, they can compete with anyone. I think UWS did not show that during the course of the year.

Your team has all that and didnt even make it to their conf. tourney final? At least UWS made it that far. Like NUprof says, get your conference AQ and theres nothing to worry about.

BlueDevilRadio
03-07-2011, 02:59 PM
I'm not going to feed the cry babies out there whining over statistics and power rankings. I'll offer my .02 cents on seeing UW-Superior play three times this season.

UW-Soup is a good choice for the bid. They are a fast team and have a healthy amount of contributors. No specific player or line stands out on the stat sheet. Very balanced scoring. When UW-Soup is clicking they're nearly as dangerous as St. Norbert. However, when their off, their off. They have been a rollercoaster club this season. I think the jackets were the right pick for a western team.

Now whether their more deserving then say Castleton, that's another thought entirely.

Edit: UW-Soup's situation is very similar to that of UW-Stout a few years back. We lost to SNC in OT for the Peter's Cup and we ended up with a bid that season.

PrezdeJohnson09
03-07-2011, 03:10 PM
Edit: UW-Soup's situation is very similar to that of UW-Stout a few years back. We lost to SNC in OT for the Peter's Cup and we ended up with a bid that season.

Did you have 12 losses that year?

FormerCoach
03-07-2011, 03:45 PM
Understood, but I can't help but look at this through the eyes of some of the players. Imagine being a Castleton player having to deal with a 12-loss UWS team getting in over them? I understand the process, but it's still hard.

I'll also ask again, is 12 losses the most ever by a Pool-C team?

Imagine Castleton dealing with losing to a 13 loss team in the semi finals of their conference tournament....trust me, losing in the semis is worse than losing in the finals, especially when you are heavily favored. Castleton will be in the NCAA's in time and I predict next year...