Boston University 2010-11 Part III - Is That So Much To Ask?

[Jofa]

Re: Boston University 2010-11 Part III - Is That So Much To Ask?

Fair enough although I'd say only Poti was a huge loss. Thought Ryan Whitney played three years?

Sorry forgot you were only talking 2 or less years.

[Terrier520]

Re: Boston University 2010-11 Part III - Is That So Much To Ask?

I dont think FF is an arbitrary measure at all I think its everything in college hockey success for the supposed elite programs. We are talking about having to win 2 or sometimes 1 game to get there, not like hoops where its always 4 wins. And BU will be missing the Ncaa's for the 4th time in 10 years, and they had a good shot at an NC in the last 10 maybe twice (06, 09) not 5 times. Thats not meeting your formula. And I dont remember the bounce or two in the BC, MSU,UND tournament losses those were routs, BU however benefitted greatly from an own goal or two or three in 2009.

You know, in 86 game 6, the Red Sox weren't going to win, minus the lucky bounce. The game was tied. Or, to put it this way, BU was in a position to win those games. BU had dominated the OT session against Miami. In the UVM game, Vermont scored 3 in the second period on 16 shots. Outside of that, it was 1 goal on 11 shots. BU was the better team and came out on top. They might have won, even if it didn't go off a UVM player. And we can't forget that if the puck didn't go in off a UNH hand, the GWG would have gone in from Wilson. And even if somehow Wilson misses it, OT still starts with a BU PP for about a minute. So I'm not going to say that "BU almost blew it" in each game because htey got some lucky bounces.

And yes, Jofa, you have to win 1 or 2 games. But what's the problem if the team you lose to winds up winning the NC, or coming in second? BU hasn't lost to bad teams in the tournament.

[J.D.]

Re: Boston University 2010-11 Part III - Is That So Much To Ask?

Were you at the game in 2000? Otherwise, you may have watched some of the game, but the Celtics were on instead of the overtimes.

Ha, wasn't the BU/SLU game still on after the Celtics? At least that's how I remember it...

This I could say was a legitimate stinker. BC went on to the national championship game, BU got smoked. BC outplayed BU during the game, but I contend that BU could have beaten anyone except BC that night.

It's hard to say BU would have beaten anyone that night when you consider they lost 5-0. We'll never know.

This isn't Michigan choking in the first round to Air Force, or NoDak 09 losing to a one-and-done UNH team. The teams they lost to (for the most part) have gone on to do damage in the tournament.

Air Force took UVM to OT the next day and UNH went toe to toe with BU in the regional final. I don't think those are great examples. But, anyway, I just think there are more "good" (not great) teams in college hockey these days. We've seen plenty of upsets in the tourney the last few years.

It's also going to be harder to win 20 games. BU won't be able to beat up on weak teams anymore.

Disagree with this. The bottom dwellers in Hockey East rotate from year to year and BC/BU really should be in the top four most years. 20 wins should be the norm IMO (at least).

And we can't forget that if the puck didn't go in off a UNH hand, the GWG would have gone in from Wilson.

Hmm I don't remember it this way...youtube?

[Jofa]

Re: Boston University 2010-11 Part III - Is That So Much To Ask?

You know, in 86 game 6, the Red Sox weren't going to win, minus the lucky bounce. The game was tied. Or, to put it this way, BU was in a position to win those games. BU had dominated the OT session against Miami. In the UVM game, Vermont scored 3 in the second period on 16 shots. Outside of that, it was 1 goal on 11 shots. BU was the better team and came out on top. They might have won, even if it didn't go off a UVM player. And we can't forget that if the puck didn't go in off a UNH hand, the GWG would have gone in from Wilson. And even if somehow Wilson misses it, OT still starts with a BU PP for about a minute. So I'm not going to say that "BU almost blew it" in each game because htey got some lucky bounces.

And yes, Jofa, you have to win 1 or 2 games. But what's the problem if the team you lose to winds up winning the NC, or coming in second? BU hasn't lost to bad teams in the tournament.

I hate to be jumping in with the BC boys on these issues but I just think they are helluva alot more objective then the BU guys are on these topics (Parker, NCAA's, elite program) alteast this time. To try to spin like some are doing that BU has been a force in the tournament and were a bounce or two from more FF"s, the record and eyeball test doesnt bare that out. And the year 2000 "almost FF" is beyond the 10 year window now. In addition Nick is right about the tournament opponents that BU beat, save for Miami (2009) and UNH (06, 09) the wins have been against significantly lesser programs.

[slurpees]

Re: Boston University 2010-11 Part III - Is That So Much To Ask?

Minor diversion: From the email sent to season ticket holders to renew tickets, apparently DU is playing here next season.

[pirate]

Re: Boston University 2010-11 Part III - Is That So Much To Ask?

I think that you Eagle fans have been a little spoiled by the past few years. Most other fanbases have accepted that the tournament has become a series of coin tosses. If you consistently make the tournament with a reasonable chance of winning the games in front of you, then you're in "striking distance". To be fair, BU probably should have turned one or two more of their regional final appearances in the oughts into Frozen Four appearances, but there not off the pace much from what you can reasonably expect from a top tier program.

Given the health scares for both coaches it would be wise for everybody to consider that the status quo could change at their pace and not ours...not because of a health emergency but it isn't out of the realm of possibility that either one takes more time at the end of the season to ponder their future than they did when they were 40. If Jerry wins another one would he 'leave on a high note'?, you never know.

In terms of BU's performance, I have to bring up what I said the other day...where is our surprise year? We can talk about being good, having 20 win seasons and just missing but where is our ok year with a big finish that got us to the F4 when we probably weren't really that good? Aside from a few upsets in the HE quarters, when has BU exceeded late season expectations? I could tolerate the disappointments if we did something other when we had the vastly superior team, and still needed a miracle to pull out the NC.

We've certainly had a few years lately when our only way in was to win the HE tourney, have we done that? It frustrates me to not get to the NCAA's because we should have the talent to be a scary opponent, even if we are the 15 seed. This year, if we were the last team in and BC was #1, do you think they'd be thrilled to have us in their region? Think anybody would be happy to play a team with our talent, coaching experience etc? But we don't even get there. It aint the building, it isn't the volume of talent, we have a great trainer, we have plenty of guys in the NHL, we have fan support etc. On paper we are in the NCAA's 80% of the time and the F4 every few years.

Tell me Jack Parker is a no character bum and I'll ask you to step outside and say that...tell me the team is meeting or exceeding its capability and I'll ask you to step out of the hot sun.


edit: sorry, this sat waiting to go out for a while, I see some of the same ground has been covered but will leave it as is

[slurpees]

Re: Boston University 2010-11 Part III - Is That So Much To Ask?

Hmm I don't remember it this way...youtube?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dmQ_2a6WPo0 8:00

[Boston22]

Re: Boston University 2010-11 Part III - Is That So Much To Ask?

I think a lot of the difference between BU and BC over the years has been the recruiting, especially with local talent. Not trying to flame here, but what New England kids has BU gotten, where they went toe-to-toe with BC, in recent memory?

I can't count Warsofsky and Coyle because they always wanted to go to BU and didn't even consider any other school.

I can't count Alex Chiassion, Sahir Gill, Robert Polesello or Cason Hohmann because they aren't from New England.

You would probably have to go back to Dan Spang, Ryan Whitney and Brian McConnell, right?

[Agganis]

Re: Boston University 2010-11 Part III - Is That So Much To Ask?

I think a lot of the difference between BU and BC over the years has been the recruiting, especially with local talent. Not trying to flame here, but what New England kids has BU gotten, where they went toe-to-toe with BC, in recent memory?

I can't count Warsofsky and Coyle because they always wanted to go to BU and didn't even consider any other school.

I can't count Alex Chiassion, Sahir Gill, Robert Polesello or Cason Hohmann because they aren't from New England.

You would probably have to go back to Dan Spang, Ryan Whitney and Brian McConnell, right?

I'm not doing an exhaustive list, but I'm sure BC wouldn't have complained if Nick Bonino took his talents from CT to Chestnut Hill.

[J.D.]

Re: Boston University 2010-11 Part III - Is That So Much To Ask?

Minor diversion: From the email sent to season ticket holders to renew tickets, apparently DU is playing here next season.

Hmm considering BC played two at Denver this year, possibly part of a BC/BU weekend?

If Jerry wins another one would he 'leave on a high note'?, you never know.

No idea what Parker's contract status is, but I'm pretty sure York signed an extension this year...

[limey]

Re: Boston University 2010-11 Part III - Is That So Much To Ask?

Wrong again limey. Saw both regionals. And I am just presenting my opinion on this, not trying to cause a meltdown and I'm not trolling...

Where did you see the '00 SLU-BU game?

[J.D.]

Re: Boston University 2010-11 Part III - Is That So Much To Ask?

I think a lot of the difference between BU and BC over the years has been the recruiting, especially with local talent.

On paper, recruiting has been pretty even--which brought me to my first point of OVERALL player/team development...York wins that.

As for the local talent, I'm not gonna pretend to know which kids chose BC over BU. It does seem like BC has been getting more of the local talent, but perhaps BU has a different recruiting philosophy.

[slurpees]

Re: Boston University 2010-11 Part III - Is That So Much To Ask?

Hmm considering BC played two at Denver this year, possibly part of a BC/BU weekend?

According to the DU thread, this is what will be happening, so one game for each I assume. Didn't you play two at DU this season? Wouldn't that mean they'd be making another trip east in 12-13 then? That's how BU's deal with Michigan went.

[Terrier520]

Re: Boston University 2010-11 Part III - Is That So Much To Ask?

I hate to be jumping in with the BC boys on these issues but I just think they are helluva alot more objective then the BU guys are on these topics (Parker, NCAA's, elite program) alteast this time. To try to spin like some are doing that BU has been a force in the tournament and were a bounce or two from more FF"s, the record and eyeball test doesnt bare that out. And the year 2000 "almost FF" is beyond the 10 year window now. In addition Nick is right about the tournament opponents that BU beat, save for Miami (2009) and UNH (06, 09) the wins have been against significantly lesser programs.

BC aside, what programs have had excellent decades? Denver? FF 2x (back to back). Perhaps NoDak; they went 6 times, but only won once. Minnesota won 2 titles (back to back) and was in the Frozen Four another time. They were bounced in the first round three times as well and have just one NCAA win since 2005. Wisconsin was 1-for-2 in the 2000s. Maine went 0-for-5 in Frozen Fours in the decade.

So of the list of the top programs of the decade in terms of Frozen Fours, which would you rather be?

[J.D.]

Re: Boston University 2010-11 Part III - Is That So Much To Ask?

BC aside, what programs have had excellent decades? Denver? FF 2x (back to back). Perhaps NoDak; they went 6 times, but only won once. Minnesota won 2 titles (back to back) and was in the Frozen Four another time. They were bounced in the first round three times as well and have just one NCAA win since 2005. Wisconsin was 1-for-2 in the 2000s. Maine went 0-for-5 in Frozen Fours in the decade.

So of the list of the top programs of the decade in terms of Frozen Fours, which would you rather be?

If you're counting 2000...

1. BC
2. Minnesota
3. Denver
4. UND
5/6. Michigan State/Wisconsin
7. BU