Americans-Canadians

[D2D]

Re: Americans-Canadians

The credits you attribute to me should go to Trillium.

Thanks, just edited my post.

[GoBucky36]

Re: Americans-Canadians

Id say both countries are pretty equal.

[Trillium]

Re: Americans-Canadians

Last week... ....Silly You.....BC's season ended in early march

She's referring to the fact that the BC men just won the national championship.

[CanHockGuy]

Re: Americans-Canadians

Id say both countries are pretty equal.

The gap is certainly tightening. Great for hockey in North America, the others are now forced to keep up. Invest now, have some foresight, and the future will be bright.

[NJCPolarBear]

Re: Americans-Canadians

My question was really WHY do the US colleges import so many carpetbagger Canadians in the first place? Don't tell me "talent"...there is plenty of talent right here in the US...and even if there are not quite the #'s here...who cares? We're talking about a NON-REVENUE SPORT like women's hockey....what difference does it make?

Many countries have rules that limit "foreigners" from playing there...I know in Japan, they strictly limit the # of Americans who can play pro baseball [maybe 2 per team max]...and I even think the Cannucks limit the number of Americans who can play that stupid brand of Canadian Football [not that any decent player would want to play there anyway].

The point is WHY do we as taxpayers allow our college sports teams to be dominated [most D1 teams are HALF Cannuck, some are more than 50%] by non-citizens who have never paid a dime to create or fund that college...a pure one-way street. While many of our girls are then deprived of the chance to play college hockey. It's crazy.

Stay in Canada and build your own College program.

[OnMAA]

Re: Americans-Canadians

She's referring to the fact that the BC men just won the national championship.

I knew that....

Was in a round about way trying to point out to SillyWench that she was addressing the wrong audience.

[GoBucky36]

Re: Americans-Canadians

My question was really WHY do the US colleges import so many carpetbagger Canadians in the first place? Don't tell me "talent"...there is plenty of talent right here in the US...and even if there are not quite the #'s here...who cares? We're talking about a NON-REVENUE SPORT like women's hockey....what difference does it make?

Many countries have rules that limit "foreigners" from playing there...I know in Japan, they strictly limit the # of Americans who can play pro baseball [maybe 2 per team max]...and I even think the Cannucks limit the number of Americans who can play that stupid brand of Canadian Football [not that any decent player would want to play there anyway].

The point is WHY do we as taxpayers allow our college sports teams to be dominated [most D1 teams are HALF Cannuck, some are more than 50%] by non-citizens who have never paid a dime to create or fund that college...a pure one-way street. While many of our girls are then deprived of the chance to play college hockey. It's crazy.

Stay in Canada and build your own College program.

Everyone wants to win and if that means importing players from Canada, so be it. I dont care where youre from, if you put on a Wisconsin jersey and help the team win, I will cheer for you.

[5 4 Fighting]

Re: Americans-Canadians

My question was really WHY do the US colleges import so many carpetbagger Canadians in the first place? Don't tell me "talent"...there is plenty of talent right here in the US...and even if there are not quite the #'s here...who cares? We're talking about a NON-REVENUE SPORT like women's hockey....what difference does it make?

Many countries have rules that limit "foreigners" from playing there...I know in Japan, they strictly limit the # of Americans who can play pro baseball [maybe 2 per team max]...and I even think the Cannucks limit the number of Americans who can play that stupid brand of Canadian Football [not that any decent player would want to play there anyway].

The point is WHY do we as taxpayers allow our college sports teams to be dominated [most D1 teams are HALF Cannuck, some are more than 50%] by non-citizens who have never paid a dime to create or fund that college...a pure one-way street. While many of our girls are then deprived of the chance to play college hockey. It's crazy.

Stay in Canada and build your own College program.

Brooky....is that you?

[OnMAA]

Re: Americans-Canadians

My question was really WHY do the US colleges import so many carpetbagger Canadians in the first place? Don't tell me "talent"...there is plenty of talent right here in the US...and even if there are not quite the #'s here...who cares? We're talking about a NON-REVENUE SPORT like women's hockey....what difference does it make?

Many countries have rules that limit "foreigners" from playing there...I know in Japan, they strictly limit the # of Americans who can play pro baseball [maybe 2 per team max]...and I even think the Cannucks limit the number of Americans who can play that stupid brand of Canadian Football [not that any decent player would want to play there anyway].

The point is WHY do we as taxpayers allow our college sports teams to be dominated [most D1 teams are HALF Cannuck, some are more than 50%] by non-citizens who have never paid a dime to create or fund that college...a pure one-way street. While many of our girls are then deprived of the chance to play college hockey. It's crazy.

Stay in Canada and build your own College program.

Well college teams try to field the best teams, so they recruit the best talent at their disposal. Hate to disappoint you, but most Canuck players in the US D1 system make the teams they play for better. Without them the quality of play would a significantly reduced by virtue of the fact that the D1 talent pool is reduced by 40-45%. If you really think that there is enough similar caliber available in the US to replace that 45%, you would have seen a trend develop years ago for colleges to take more homegrown talent. That has not happened. As long as Canadians are offered significant FA offers or scholarships, they will continue to come.

If you really believe in the principle of US only at home, you should direct your venting to-wards the NCAA/US Schools, not to-wards the Canadian players.

[CanHockGuy]

Re: Americans-Canadians

My question was really WHY do the US colleges import so many carpetbagger Canadians in the first place? Don't tell me "talent"...there is plenty of talent right here in the US...and even if there are not quite the #'s here...who cares? We're talking about a NON-REVENUE SPORT like women's hockey....what difference does it make?

Many countries have rules that limit "foreigners" from playing there...I know in Japan, they strictly limit the # of Americans who can play pro baseball [maybe 2 per team max]...and I even think the Cannucks limit the number of Americans who can play that stupid brand of Canadian Football [not that any decent player would want to play there anyway].

The point is WHY do we as taxpayers allow our college sports teams to be dominated [most D1 teams are HALF Cannuck, some are more than 50%] by non-citizens who have never paid a dime to create or fund that college...a pure one-way street. While many of our girls are then deprived of the chance to play college hockey. It's crazy.

Stay in Canada and build your own College program.

What is a carpetbagger? We'll start from there.

[OnMAA]

Re: Americans-Canadians

What is a carpetbagger? We'll start from there.

Was wondering about that term myself, as it sounded "offensive". So I looked up what it meant and found that it is a US based term, stemming from the Civil war era:

Etymology: from their carrying all their belongings in carpetbags
Date: 1868
1 : a Northerner in the South after the American Civil War usually seeking private gain under the reconstruction governments
2 : outsider; especially : a nonresident or new resident who seeks private gain from an area often by meddling in its business or politics

[Trillium]

Re: Americans-Canadians

Was wondering about that term myself, as it sounded "offensive". So I looked up what it meant and found that it is a US based term, stemming from the Civil war era:

Etymology: from their carrying all their belongings in carpetbags
Date: 1868
1 : a Northerner in the South after the American Civil War usually seeking private gain under the reconstruction governments
2 : outsider; especially : a nonresident or new resident who seeks private gain from an area often by meddling in its business or politics

d*mn Yankees.

[notfromaroundhere]

Re: Americans-Canadians

What is a carpetbagger? We'll start from there.

As a relative expert on the subject of things southern (as compared to the Canadians), the explanations given above were technically correct but don't truly explain the negativity felt by southerners when using the term.

The "carpet bag" truly was a bag made from a remnant of carpet and was used for travel that wasn't considered long-term, where you might use a steamer trunk for example., as carpet bags were not large nor sturdy.

Many northern businessmen came south carrying carpet bags after the US Civil War who were there to make a quick buck in a business deal and return north. Southerners had a tradition of being welcoming to those wishing to join them to stay and build a community. If you were bringing money to invest and build and stay, you were always welcomed. You quickly became part of the community and business was done very personally in the south. They took great offense to these "carpet baggers" who came in great numbers to feast off the financial ruin of many successful businesses that were wrecked during the war and then leave the community usually worse than when they arrived.

Some may argue that Canadians coming south to play hockey in the US and then return back home may be the equivalent. I'd rather not look at them this way, as for the most part, they are recruited to the US (unlike the carpetbaggers of the 19th century) by the coaches who are trying to compete and as players are just trying to enjoy their sport but get a good education first. Yes, there may be some who really are out to just manage their hockey career (taking scholarships at lesser schools than they would have attended in Canada just to say they played D1), but for the most part I can't be angry at the Canadians playing here.

I think you'd see more Americans going to University in Canada if the finances made sense. While Canadian schools are cheap for Canadians, I believe it is far more expensive for Americans than staying south of the border considering the limited moneys available for scholarships. I think the interest would be there, as my own daughter who very much enjoyed the time we spent in Canada at tournaments over the years asked me a few years ago whether playing college hockey in Canada would be an option.

However, as mentioned above, Canada's university system has a different mission than that of the US - it doesn't value athletics the same; its programs are oriented more towards practical degrees (for local employers as opposed to American employers - it is amazing how few businesses understand Canadian school degrees here). I'm not even sure that they value having many international students in their population - or if they do, it doesn't seem to be as pervasive as the interest American universities demonstrate towards international students. It is a missed opportunity on the part of Canadians, although I could understand that their system could very easily be overrun by Americans if they made it easy to get admission and cheap and the Canadians would come up with a derrogatory term such as carpet bagger for the students who come north for the cheap school, crowding out the locals and then returning south and taking their schooling with them.

My $.02 - about the equivalent of Trillium's 3 cents Canadian these days given the exchange rates.

[Trillium]

Re: Americans-Canadians

I think you'd see more Americans going to University in Canada if the finances made sense. While Canadian schools are cheap for Canadians, I believe it is far more expensive for Americans than staying south of the border considering the limited moneys available for scholarships. I think the interest would be there, as my own daughter who very much enjoyed the time we spent in Canada at tournaments over the years asked me a few years ago whether playing college hockey in Canada would be an option.

However, as mentioned above, Canada's university system has a different mission than that of the US - it doesn't value athletics the same; its programs are oriented more towards practical degrees (for local employers as opposed to American employers - it is amazing how few businesses understand Canadian school degrees here). I'm not even sure that they value having many international students in their population - or if they do, it doesn't seem to be as pervasive as the interest American universities demonstrate towards international students. It is a missed opportunity on the part of Canadians, although I could understand that their system could very easily be overrun by Americans if they made it easy to get admission and cheap

BTW, thanks for the very interesting history lesson.

Actually, I think you will find that, even with the inflated tuition charges for international students, a Canadian university education is still quite reasonably priced as compared to paying full freight at an equivalent top private US college.

I know that Canadian friends of mine who have lived and raised a family in the NYC area for the past 15+ years, are planning on sending their 3 children to top schools in Canada for reasons of economics. Similarly, we got to know two prosperous American couples from the East Coast on a cruise, and they indicated that they as well as all of their extended family members went to McGill for their educations. Carpet-baggers! [In my graduating class (many years ago now), there actually were several students from other countries, including the US, Bermuda, Hong Kong, China and Europe, too.]

But in addition to potential cost advantages of schooling in Canada vs US, part of the problem Americans face in attending top US schools--exacerbated by those lacking legacy or athletic recruit status--is that it can be akin to winning a lottery merely to gain admission. This is another advantage to considering top Canadian universities. McGill for example, is very well regarded and highly ranked internationally relative to many very good US schools. As a result of the different admissions system, anyone with marks in the high-80's will be able to attend if they wish--no essays, SATs, insufficient hooks, ethnic status, or other subjective assessments complicate your chances.

You are right in saying that Canadian universities don't specifically value internationals (nor any other geographic, ethnic, demographic, economic or psychographic distribution) in offering admission. Nor do they discriminate on those bases. They value straight marks alone. If the students with the best marks applying all happened to be girls from China, the entire incoming class at that university would all then be Chinese girls (well at least in the short term until the public revolted and got the government involved).

So, Canadian universities might very well be worth considering for some US student athletes from families not eligible for US scholarship/financial aid, and with good marks.

IIRC, I believe a couple of US hockey players have signed NLI's to St. Francis Xavier for next season. St. FX is a very highly regarded school in Atlantic Canada according to the MacLean rankings (Canadian equivalent to USNWR) with a highly ranked hockey program too. I have also seen a few Americans listed on some of the other Canadian school hockey rosters previously (but very few to-date). So it certainly does occur.

For the record too, many of the Canadians who go to the US for school end up staying in the US either because they got a job there upon graduation and/or met an American and then got married ....my niece was one of them who did both. This, by the above-noted definition, of course means they aren't then carpetbaggers at all.

[RStarr]

Re: Americans-Canadians

I support the import of Canadians (and no, not to eat!). Without, we would not have been graced by Sara Bauer. Seriously? Sara Bauer is God's gift to the world, not just hockey. Its Sara freaking Bauer.


I love you Sara!!!