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View Full Version : RPI Off-Season Thread 2010 -- The Calm Before the Storm



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Red Cloud
03-08-2010, 02:18 PM
Oh yea, I'm DEFINITELY disappointed with our FIRST winning season since I first began to attend RPI. I'll stop ridiculous assumptions when you stop defining when we tell ourselves the truth.

Ignore that poseur. If he's willing to brand an entire season a failure based on one disappointing weekend, he deserves to be shunned.

This team was picked to finish TENTH. We were a goal away from having this past weekend off. If he's disappointed by that, he'll never be satisfied. **** him.

Red Cloud
03-08-2010, 02:35 PM
What ARE you talking about? Please explain. But, don't give the "they're men of fine character"etc. I'm sure they are, I'm sure you probably are as well, but that doesn't mean I want to watch you play hockey. RC, the game is played to be won.

You see everything in black and white, but we live in a gray world. That is why you will never understand why your point of view on this is, quite frankly, idiotic.

Let's take a trip back in time, back when Dan Fridgen was the head coach. Let me start by saying this: I consider Mr. Fridgen to be a friend. I saw him last month for the first time in a couple of years and had a great conversation with him. I miss talking to him and having him around regularly.

That said, let's be all the way real here. By the time he left the Institute, his list of supporters among the boosters was getting pretty slim. Teams were underperforming - that is, playing more poorly than they had been expected to do - and the quality of recruits was down significantly. People were not happy.

A new coach comes in, and far too many people started expecting the sun and the moon and the stars right away. The approach was simple, perhaps too simple for a person such as yourself to understand - Seth Appert learned how to win from some of the best in the game. Now, he decided, he would work to emulate their success. But it just wasn't possible with the players he inherited. It was a different system than they were recruited to play. Some took to the system well. Others didn't. All should be commended for giving it their best (at least, those who did).

The "bedwetters," of which you are a prime example, were impatient. They didn't want to hear about what it took to build a foundation of a solid, winning program. They didn't want to wait for the cake to finish baking, they wanted to eat it now. They wanted results in 2007-08, not 2010-11.

The first three years were painful, it's true. No one was jumping for joy at the losses, the heartaches, the entire seasons of misery. But those of us who were willing to look past the records (the forest) and see the groundwork being laid for a successful future (the trees) had consolation. The bedwetters continue to refuse consolation.

Last season, I think, turned out worse than even those optimistic about the direction of the program thought it would be. Last season, the naysayers came out in full force, only to be oddly silenced after the win over Dartmouth in the first round. That will happen. The best laid plans of mice and men are often go awry. But we could still see the basis. The foundation. We could see the building blocks in place for future glory.

Tell me, crossbar, who is Jacob Laliberte? Who is Luke Curadi? Do you know these people? Vaguely heard of them? Did you know who Jerry D'Amigo was before October? If not, I can understand your trepidation, but your opinion of the state of the program comes from a position of extreme ignorance.

The best team doesn't always win, and the better team did not walk away from Houston Field House this weekend with a ticket to the next round. The team had a bad weekend and paid for it with the end of their season. Yes, I wish things had been different. The game is played to be won - but playing for the short-term means a longer, more difficult long-term. I had thought that was a lesson that had been learned with bitter tears in the early part of the last decade, but perhaps I was mistaken. Some people are content to repeat the mistakes of yesteryear if it earns them instant gratification. And that's why you are upset - you have no instant gratification.

Meanwhile, down the stretch, when the team IS more successful because of these last few seasons of tears (of which this season was NOT one of them - precisely BECAUSE they put together the record you so ruefully disdain), you will care not about what happened before it, or why it was that they are successful. All you will care about is that they are winning and now you're happy.

But you won't be anywhere nearly as happy as those of us who paid attention, who saw the building blocks going into place, who saw the greater plan, and are now watching it reach fruition.

You know what should be the most embarassing part of all for you? Fans of other teams - Union, St. Lawrence, and Colgate already in just this thread alone - see what is happening and have noted that they expect bright things ahead based on it. You're a supposed supporter of this team, and you don't see ANYTHING.

That's sad. I pity you.

knsmith
03-08-2010, 02:36 PM
You guys are ignoring the fact that Fridgen left the cupboard completely empty for Appert when he took over. The local recruiting luck had completely filtered out of the system and the secondary benefits we'd had from when he had the local guys had also completely faded. We were signing far less talented guys far later than other ECAC school; we were just picking up the scraps. If a change wasn't made, we would have become what Brown has been the past few years.

hockeymascot
03-08-2010, 03:06 PM
You guys are ignoring the fact that Fridgen left the cupboard completely empty for Appert when he took over. The local recruiting luck had completely filtered out of the system and the secondary benefits we'd had from when he had the local guys had also completely faded. We were signing far less talented guys far later than other ECAC school; we were just picking up the scraps. If a change wasn't made, we would have become what Brown has been the past few years.

Hey Ken, completely empty is not accurate! That is a slap in the face to the players that were at RPI for four years. Let's blame Coach Appert's lack of success on Fridgen scraps! (Croxton, Lange, McDonald, Eizenman) If it were completely empty, the 2005-2006 record would have been worse.

Why even compare the two? Different time, different parameters, different players, and different administrative support, not to mention the budgets.

This weekend was totally unexpected. Coach Appert will learn from it and move forward, as will the players. Time for us fans to do the same.

Sorry for the intrusion.

FlagDUDE08
03-08-2010, 03:17 PM
Hey Ken, completely empty is not accurate! That is a slap in the face to the players that were at RPI for four years. Let's blame Coach Appert's lack of success on Fridgen scraps! (Croxton, Lange, McDonald, Eizenman) If it were completely empty, the 2005-2006 record would have been worse.

Why even compare the two? Different time, different parameters, different players, and different administrative support, not to mention the budgets.

This weekend was totally unexpected. Coach Appert will learn from it and move forward, as will the players. Time for us fans to do the same.

Sorry for the intrusion.

Don't worry one bit about intruding. You want to talk about RPI men's hockey? This is definitely the place to do it. I think some of the concern was whether or not the NHL had their eye on any of Fridgen's players, or whether they decided to make something of themselves while playing in college. They all had their talents. Farynuk and Croxton were impressively good at "Squish the Midget". MacDonald was an offensive powerhouse, and if he were on the present-day team, I'm sure he'd give Chase Polacek a run for his money on the scoresheet.

There is some merit to what knsmith is saying, because Appert's system is so much more different than Fridgen's system. This is why some of the players like Kipp, Cyr, and Harvard-player-who-must-not-be-named were either cut or left. I wouldn't put all the blame on the recruits, but it has to be a shocker to suddenly have to play a different system than what you were recruited for.

Red Cloud
03-08-2010, 03:24 PM
Hey Ken, completely empty is not accurate! That is a slap in the face to the players that were at RPI for four years. Let's blame Coach Appert's lack of success on Fridgen scraps! (Croxton, Lange, McDonald, Eizenman) If it were completely empty, the 2005-2006 record would have been worse.

Croxton never played for Appert. MacDonald wouldn't have if he hadn't had cancer. Eizenman, like MacDonald, had one year. Mathias Lange set a school record for losses in a career.

So yes, "Ken" (not his name) was accurate.

engineerhockeyfan
03-08-2010, 03:48 PM
I have been reading these posts all day, and I'm still not sure why we are talking about Fridgen.
He has been gone for four years now. Let it go.
I have some questions about this team, and I think that they are all resolved with the youth of our talent.
Anyone who thinks that this was not a successful season has to have his head examined.
We almost doubled our win total for last year. Add to that the number of one goal losses, and you can see that we are thisclose to a 25 to 30 win season.
I am not happy that we have lost all of the games that seemed to be "must wins" this season.
The loss to Union in the tournament, the loss in the Freakout, the loss to Colgate, and last night.
With the exception of the Freakout, we were in all of those games. And just maybe a little more experience from our talented players, we might have won all the rest.
We are on the right track, and I can't wait for next year to begin.
Don't forget that two of our talented players from last year had disappointing seasons. Cullen and Helfrich have an opportunity to come back strong next year, and there is no reason to believe that they can't come back.
Even without the talented recruits, this team is ready to bring their game to the next level. :D

babo
03-08-2010, 03:50 PM
I cannot wait to be able to follow the RPI threads on a more regular basis...it's like reading a history book and feeling the passion of the writer who did the research on the topic...you guys teach me something every time I read and I needd the time to go back through the threads and weave it all together.

Is there an archive? A 'best of' series? The last thing I want to have happen is to have Red Cloud rip me a new one when I come up with a bone headed uninformed comment...:eek:

Red Cloud
03-08-2010, 03:53 PM
Is there an archive? A 'best of' series? The last thing I want to have happen is to have Red Cloud rip me a new one when I come up with a bone headed uninformed comment...:eek:

Babo, I can dig where you're coming from. I know you won't act as though you know something for sure when in reality it's not true. :D

Sorry we didn't get to meet this season. Next year!

GreatLakerMohawk
03-08-2010, 03:53 PM
I cannot wait to be able to follow the RPI threads on a more regular basis...it's like reading a history book and feeling the passion of the writer who did the research on the topic...you guys teach me something every time I read and I needd the time to go back through the threads and weave it all together.

Is there an archive? A 'best of' series? The last thing I want to have happen is to have Red Cloud rip me a new one when I come up with a bone headed uninformed comment...:eek:

I think some of the folks here would be happy to give you a bit of a break. We at least know you're new to everything here. ;)

FlagDUDE08
03-08-2010, 03:53 PM
I cannot wait to be able to follow the RPI threads on a more regular basis...it's like reading a history book and feeling the passion of the writer who did the research on the topic...you guys teach me something every time I read and I needd the time to go back through the threads and weave it all together.

Is there an archive? A 'best of' series? The last thing I want to have happen is to have Red Cloud rip me a new one when I come up with a bone headed uninformed comment...:eek:

I don't think that there is a "best of" series, but you could probably filter on RPI in the search tool and look through those posts. I'm sure you'll find something interesting.

hockeymascot
03-08-2010, 03:53 PM
Croxton never played for Appert. MacDonald wouldn't have if he hadn't had cancer. Eizenman, like MacDonald, had one year. Mathias Lange set a school record for losses in a career.

So yes, "Ken" (not his name) was accurate.

Since you are comparing players under different coaches, who have different systems, then the players performance is tough to evaluate purely from a statistical perspective. For example, Lange might have faired better in a system with more emphasis on team D.

babo
03-08-2010, 03:55 PM
I don't think that there is a "best of" series, but you could probably filter on RPI in the search tool and look through those posts. I'm sure you'll find something interesting.

Thanks FD08...I am still learning the ropes...:)

Havasu M
03-08-2010, 03:56 PM
Fridgen's biggest injury loss was Valentin blowing his knee out in December. Forced to play Kipp who assisted on two St Lawrence goals and knocked RPI out of home ice and a long playoff run. We know what happened to Kipp in the Appert rein. With Valentin in they may have had an NCAA bid. That being said the cupboard was bare which you can see from point totals for the seniors the last few years. Kerins had a great year but was the only O senior.

hockeymascot
03-08-2010, 03:57 PM
Where was Helfrich this weekend? Was he hurt?

GreatLakerMohawk
03-08-2010, 03:57 PM
Where was Helfrich this weekend? Was he hurt?

Healthy scratch in Games 2 and 3.

babo
03-08-2010, 03:58 PM
Sorry we didn't get to meet this season. Next year!

Absolutely...we don't know yet when Big Red will be there...but we'll be there for sure!:D

Ralph Baer
03-08-2010, 04:00 PM
I don't think that there is a "best of" series, but you could probably filter on RPI in the search tool and look through those posts. I'm sure you'll find something interesting.

Of course it will also bring up posts about the Rating Percentage Index, of which there are a lot, especially this time of year. :D

I would suggest searching for threads with RPI in the title rather than searching for a post containing the letter sequence RPI.

DrDemento
03-08-2010, 04:02 PM
I cannot wait to be able to follow the RPI threads on a more regular basis...it's like reading a history book and feeling the passion of the writer who did the research on the topic...you guys teach me something every time I read and I needd the time to go back through the threads and weave it all together.

Is there an archive? A 'best of' series? The last thing I want to have happen is to have Red Cloud rip me a new one when I come up with a bone headed uninformed comment...:eek:

As you follow along and contribute-you will find that there are posters with all sorts of historical perspectives. Ralph and I have been following this team since the early to mid 60's. Some others have also been following for a long time. Others are more recent additions. But one thing is certain, all are passionate about RPI hockey. Many of us consider these boys like family and we rise and fall with them. It is our passion and we feel all the highs and lows.You will also find that most of the posters do their homework-this is about the most knowledgable group of college hockey fans that you could find anywhere. But sometimes, we do get a little carried away. :)

Dutchfan
03-08-2010, 04:03 PM
I have been away for a while but following developments closely. I must admit that I have mixed emotions about RPI's exit. Selfishly, I did not relish another Union - RPI showdown though I have no doubt that it would have been great hockey, regardless of the outcome. On the other hand, particularly over the course of this season, I have come to greatly respect and appreciate the RPI program and particularly its fans who are knowledgeable, loyal and perhaps above all, passionate about their team. So from an outsider, try to take solace in all of the positives and look forward to good days ahead.

This.

For the Appert doubters: coaching changes, especially when bringing in a rookie coach take years to bear fruits. Nate Leaman's first few years at Union were a disaster, but he's developed far beyond my early expectations both tactically and in recruiting. Give it at most 2 more years and RPI will get to Atlantic City and maybe further.