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Ralph Baer
04-01-2017, 12:36 PM
A lot of emphasis on the HC, and not much on the ACs both of whom were from the same BCHL organization which has always struggled. The question always is will the new HC be able to bring in the right ACs who can identify, evaluate, and most of all recruit?

SA could recruit. It may be very important, but it isn't clear that it is number one.

Waite21
04-01-2017, 03:24 PM
My biggest worry is that we won't see a noticeable change until SAJ retires, which if she's anything like the spouse of her former employer, will be quite a long time. :eek:

Who was SAJ's former employer - Grandma Moses' husband?

jericho
04-01-2017, 04:28 PM
Who was SAJ's former employer - Grandma Moses' husband?

He's injecting politics into the thread. He's talking about Bill and Hillary Clinton, but instead of just saying that Flaggy thinks he's being sly.

FlagDUDE08
04-01-2017, 04:37 PM
Who was SAJ's former employer - Grandma Moses' husband?

Bill Clinton... prior to coming to RPI, she was head of the NRC. That's why a bunch of politicians from the Clinton days were commencement speakers while I was at the 'tute.

vicious
04-01-2017, 04:45 PM
Agree. Can recall the folks who were angry with Appert in years 2 and 3 and they never really lost their hate for him in the decent years.

I think part of the problem was that Appert came in promising an uptempo, high powered offense - expectations that may have been too high. We saw many seasons where solid, talented recruits came in but the offense never really produced. In his defense, the 2009-10 season was strong and the 2009-13 period probably would have been better had Jerry D'Amigo and Brandon Pirri stuck around. But I think there was so much optimism when Appert was hired people just assumed the team would be back to challenging for a league title and trips to Albany/LP would be the rule and not the exception, and when those expectations weren't met, the frustration really ramped up. Appert himself seemed to admit this a few weeks ago when he told Ken Schott that he hoped the school would evaluate him more on the graduation rate, community service, character building, and other factors (of which he can justifiably be very proud) than the W-L record.

Whenever the new hire is made McElroy and the new coach should be really clear at the outset about what they think is working, what needs fixing, what the long-term goals are, and how long they think it will take to get there. There can and should be lots of congrats for the new coach and optimism for the future, but a realistic idea of what to expect would help cool some of the frustration out there and maybe even buy the new coach some time to turn things around. Everyone knows there are no guarantees, but if they think the program is 3-4 years away from contending from a league title, say that. If it's 6-7 years, say that. But amid all the congrats and good feelings about the new hire, be realistic about what needs to be done. And I think the school needs to extend an olive branch to hockey alumni and do what it takes to restore their faith in the program (given their response to the Record story, I am not holding my breath).

Ralph Baer
04-01-2017, 08:42 PM
I think part of the problem was that Appert came in promising an uptempo, high powered offense - expectations that may have been too high. We saw many seasons where solid, talented recruits came in but the offense never really produced. In his defense, the 2009-10 season was strong and the 2009-13 period probably would have been better had Jerry D'Amigo and Brandon Pirri stuck around. But I think there was so much optimism when Appert was hired people just assumed the team would be back to challenging for a league title and trips to Albany/LP would be the rule and not the exception, and when those expectations weren't met, the frustration really ramped up. Appert himself seemed to admit this a few weeks ago when he told Ken Schott that he hoped the school would evaluate him more on the graduation rate, community service, character building, and other factors (of which he can justifiably be very proud) than the W-L record.

Whenever the new hire is made McElroy and the new coach should be really clear at the outset about what they think is working, what needs fixing, what the long-term goals are, and how long they think it will take to get there. There can and should be lots of congrats for the new coach and optimism for the future, but a realistic idea of what to expect would help cool some of the frustration out there and maybe even buy the new coach some time to turn things around. Everyone knows there are no guarantees, but if they think the program is 3-4 years away from contending from a league title, say that. If it's 6-7 years, say that. But amid all the congrats and good feelings about the new hire, be realistic about what needs to be done. And I think the school needs to extend an olive branch to hockey alumni and do what it takes to restore their faith in the program (given their response to the Record story, I am not holding my breath).


I agree that our expectations were quite high since we expected an improvement over Fridgen. I think that we had a right to that expectation especially after seeing an improvement in the quality of the recruits.

The more I read here, the more I am concerned about our current AD's ability to evaluate hockey coaches, both in the past and the new hire. Hopefully he is listening to others who are in the know about hockey coaches.

realet
04-01-2017, 09:21 PM
I think part of the problem was that Appert came in promising an uptempo, high powered offense - expectations that may have been too high. We saw many seasons where solid, talented recruits came in but the offense never really produced. In his defense, the 2009-10 season was strong and the 2009-13 period probably would have been better had Jerry D'Amigo and Brandon Pirri stuck around. But I think there was so much optimism when Appert was hired people just assumed the team would be back to challenging for a league title and trips to Albany/LP would be the rule and not the exception, and when those expectations weren't met, the frustration really ramped up. Appert himself seemed to admit this a few weeks ago when he told Ken Schott that he hoped the school would evaluate him more on the graduation rate, community service, character building, and other factors (of which he can justifiably be very proud) than the W-L record.

Whenever the new hire is made McElroy and the new coach should be really clear at the outset about what they think is working, what needs fixing, what the long-term goals are, and how long they think it will take to get there. There can and should be lots of congrats for the new coach and optimism for the future, but a realistic idea of what to expect would help cool some of the frustration out there and maybe even buy the new coach some time to turn things around. Everyone knows there are no guarantees, but if they think the program is 3-4 years away from contending from a league title, say that. If it's 6-7 years, say that. But amid all the congrats and good feelings about the new hire, be realistic about what needs to be done. And I think the school needs to extend an olive branch to hockey alumni and do what it takes to restore their faith in the program (given their response to the Record story, I am not holding my breath).

This is a pretty good elegy for the Appert era and the current state of the program, honestly.

The two key turning points, IMHO, were two things Appert had zero control over. Pirri and D'Amigo both going pro after their freshman years was a serious blow to the master plan, and one I don't think anyone could have really foreseen. That summer in 2010 was bizarre in the slow bleed of talent across college hockey as the months progressed. The 2011 Engineers were still pretty decent in the end, one can only wonder how much better they could have been.

The other, as I alluded to at WaP, was the injury to Kasdorf in 2013. That was a death blow to a team that could have been among the best in the country with him in the lineup - and while I fervently hope he proves me wrong for his pro career, I don't think he was really quite the same after that.

Now, that's not to say that there weren't things that could have been better coaching-wise. And as I mentioned before, if luck is preparation meeting opportunity, bad luck can just as well be a lack of that. Those 2011 and 2014 teams that could have been better were clearly riding the razor's edge and both fell off when departures and injuries happened.

The Lake Placid drought is important, there's no question. Nationally, only Omaha has gone longer without playing in a conference semifinal (2001 - not counting AIC or ASU who have never played in one). It's been 15 years now, when it used to be practically every year right before this stretch. Going a step further, only Lake State (1996) and Dartmouth (1980) have gone longer without appearing in a championship game (2000 for RPI, and again, not including AIC or ASU, and also the Alaska schools). It's painful. It's not the reason Appert was fired but it was absolutely a contributing factor, and the new coach is going to have to tangle with it immediately because it's still a sore point.

Ralph Baer
04-02-2017, 12:30 AM
Today is 2 April 2017. There are 182 days (26 weeks) until RPI's next game.


This is based upon 1 October 2017 for the start of next season.

AspyDad
04-02-2017, 09:00 AM
http://www.timesunion.com/tuplus-sports/article/Iorizzo-RPI-needs-to-rebuild-trust-of-hockey-11043872.php#photo-12650735

Stay@homeDad
04-02-2017, 11:15 AM
http://www.timesunion.com/tuplus-sports/article/Iorizzo-RPI-needs-to-rebuild-trust-of-hockey-11043872.php#photo-12650735

Thanks for posting something no one can read unless they have a subscription.....

realet
04-02-2017, 11:39 AM
Thanks for posting something no one can read unless they have a subscription.....

Click here. (http://tinyurl.com/l2lk8u9)

Jasma
04-02-2017, 11:53 AM
Click here. (http://tinyurl.com/l2lk8u9)

Really not much there. He is correct that there is a rift and RPI needs to repair that before the program can move forward, but the rest of the column is thin on details and background.
No mention of the rumored improvements to field house, or what, if any plans there are to address the secretary, strength coach and fundraising issues. He mentions the attendance figures, but not how light the crowds were the last 2 months. A new coach is not the entire answer to this program's woes.

FlagDUDE08
04-02-2017, 12:26 PM
Thanks for posting something no one can read unless they have a subscription.....

...or you know how to use the developers tools on your browser. Surprised they don't take you to a completely different page; it reminds me a bit of the ECAC's PPV that is easy to hack with Javascript.

Wicked Slappaahs
04-02-2017, 01:04 PM
A reactionary piece-- 3 days following Mr. Blum's excellent work done in the Record. Little new info other than The AD's willingness to go on record, a courtesy that wasn't extended to the Record.

Bradz
04-02-2017, 01:24 PM
Since it is apparently down to Riga and Barr does McElroy take the one with a long-proven record of accomplishment of success, has been a finalist for other HC positions, and if not given this job will end up on the other side soon, or does he just pick an alumnus because he is an alumnus and might make some people happy?

jericho
04-02-2017, 01:32 PM
Since it is apparently down to Riga and Barr does McElroy take the one with a long-proven record of accomplishment of success, has been a finalist for other HC positions, and if not given this job will end up on the other side soon, or does he just pick an alumnus because he is an alumnus and might make some people happy?

Everything you said about Riga applies to Ben. I guess if Riga isn't the pick then you won't be posting here anymore

Ralph Baer
04-02-2017, 01:39 PM
Everything you said about Riga applies to Ben. I guess if Riga isn't the pick then you won't be posting here anymore

Has he been a finalist for a HC position before?

Bradz
04-02-2017, 01:45 PM
"Everything you said about Riga applies to Ben. I guess if Riga isn't the pick then you won't be posting here anymore"

As a Mike Adessa era guy, I don't care who, as long as some real thought is given to the decision and it is in the best interest of the program. I don't agree about Ben, but that doesn't mean he wouldn't do a great job. If Riga gets it does that mean you won't be posting anymore?

RegalFan
04-02-2017, 06:03 PM
Click here. (http://tinyurl.com/l2lk8u9)


http://www.timesunion.com/tuplus-sports/article/Iorizzo-RPI-needs-to-rebuild-trust-of-hockey-11043872.php#photo-12650735

Can't get the article with either link.


Since it is apparently down to Riga and Barr does McElroy take the one with a long-proven record of accomplishment of success, has been a finalist for other HC positions, and if not given this job will end up on the other side soon, or does he just pick an alumnus because he is an alumnus and might make some people happy?

Why is it apparent that it is down to these two candidates? Does the article in paper give an indication that this is the direction the AD is going?

Waite21
04-02-2017, 07:04 PM
If I may digress from the subject of hockey for a moment -

RPI's baseball team had its home opener today (it wasn't an artistic success). There's an action photograph on the rpiathletics website.

The photograph shows an RPI player in a home white uniform, finishing his swing and getting ready to head for first base.

The thing that struck me about the photograph is that he appears to be standing on an entirely artificial turf field. No grass or dirt anywhere, even around home plate.

A question for those who are up in the Troy area - has the Tute actually resurfaced the baseball field in this manner, or is the photo on rpiathletics a file photo, taken during a game at some other site?