UNH Wildcats 2016-17 Vol II -- We Do Have a Hockey Season Here!?!

[deltabravo62]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 Vol II -- We Do Have a Hockey Season Here!?!

Wow, this thread certainly turned ugly. I will not report any more of my thoughts about any UNH games that I attend, that is for sure. Good bye.

Hopefully the mud slinging will die back down so we can get back to the decent conversation we were having beforehand...

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 Vol II -- We Do Have a Hockey Season Here!?!

Haha, ok whatever you say Chuck. You would recognize grandstanding...

I'll start with this one because it's the "best". Maybe a minor goof, but you should understand there's a huge difference between Regan serving as a back-up because of an injury mid-season to a scholarship goalie and counting on Lazarro for one-two seasons as a planned back up. Do you really not see this? I think you do and It proves my point that all you do is try to argue semantics and BS to validate whatever reality or argument you've already decided upon...

Your axe to grind on Poturalski is pitiful - especially when you try to get into his head and decide he didn't care or work hard for his alma mater and teammates. He was called by his coaches - "one of the best to ever play at UNH". I'm sure that was inspite of his loathsome effort? You responded as I predicted you would and it's just as transparent as ever - just as your cute emojis never hide your condescension towards others. Don't worry, I'm happy to respond to you in the manner you've addressed so many over the years.

As for the ENG - again, you avoid the reality of the situation. Pulling your goalie down two with two minutes to play can be a good message to your team (more importantly - you do what you think gives you the best chance to win. Period.) You imply that the goal is scored immediately - when it's often scored with say 30 seconds left. Now it's three with thirty seconds left. Yes, at some point a game is over - but you took your shot. Players need to know you believe in their shot, took it and most importantly that as a coach if you think you have a shot you leave nothing on the table. Again, you simply made inaccurate and unrealistic points to reach your preconceived conclusion. Which is some Mish-mash about pulling your goalie with a minute left being good and a minute and a half left being pandering? Yes, that's dull.

If you want to rehash the Clark debate - go back and re-read the mountains of words I argued on this forum. If you want to keep harping on one line - that was simply posted to re-affirm data and in-game observation then yeah I question your ability to debate the issue knowledgeably. you can consider this your Christmas gift I suppose.

BTW - I love your take on warm-ups. Tell me, when a goalie works on his blocker/glove are they NOT working on stopping the puck with their blocker/glove? I would think that would be tough with no one shooting to score? Please watch a warm-up one time so you can at least learn it's an extended period of time and they do many drills (i.e. Some to get a goalie feeling the puck and some to shoot to score). It's nuance I know, but maybe we can start there and progress to evaluation...

Many coaches across all sports and levels use warm/ups for overall evaluation (for recruiting in particular) and pre-game evaluation. Maybe youth soccer is different? Are you able to evaluate practice at your level or is it impossible for you since kids are just working on stuff? Y'know, preparing for a game...

When - if ever - you're ready to discuss what actually occurs in situations regarding hockey and UNH, willing to understand and discuss entire arguments and not cherry pick things you find amusing (often hypocritically to your own steadfast beliefs - only wins matter, unless you're trying to win against long odds and then you're just trying to win to look good. Which is lame!) or exercise any objectivity perhaps we can pick these conversations up again. Feel free to shoot me an email - since its so important to you to spare the other posters that you...didn't. Otherwise, just go poke holes in your Poturalski voodoo doll and let the rest of us talk about what's actually occurring, right now...

Honestly, can't you just put me on your "ignore" list, Dan? Wouldn't that be easier? If I'm not up to your lofty standards of posting, I can live with that. I'm sure there are others on here who probably dislike my posts as much as you do, or at least disagree with the content. Some have actually provided persuasive arguments and *gasp* changed my mind on things. Two big ones come to mind:

* UNH Football Head Coach Sean McDonnell - after 5 years at the helm, he had compiled a 23-33 record with 4 losing seasons, and with the last 3 seasons being 12-22. Not exactly up to the standards of Coach Bowes, and I was outspoken on here about him failing to measure up. e.cat came to Coach's defense in a very strong and logical way, and explained why/how he saw things turning around quickly. And to his credit, that was before the start of the 13 years of sustained success. A couple of years in, it was obvious the things e.cat had to say were on point, so I switched my opinion (once it was obvious it wasn't just the "Santos bounce"), and I have been on board ever since.

* UNH Hockey Head Coach Dick Umile - up until a couple of years ago, my take on Coach Umile was very sympathetic. Even in the "Open Letter to Coach Umile" before that, I conceded that he had earned his keep, and had earned the right to ride out of town on his terms, but should be open to bringing in younger assistants (this was back during the Lassonde/Borek era, I think?) to improve his recruiting, which was already on the wane. But tapping into some old contacts and resources (and a couple of reliable folks on this board) painted a very unflattering picture of his involvement level with his program. In short, while McDonnell was still busting a gut trying to win championships, that was no longer realistically the case for Umile. So my assessment/opinion on that subject has changed (in the other direction).

* UNH AD Marty "BS35+4" Scarano - this is still a work in progress. There has been a (belated) turn in fortunes with Men's Hoops, and his patience with Football (and especially the crowning success of the new stadium) have been positive check-marks in his favor. But being a Hockey fan first and foremost, the demise of the Hockey programs (especially the flagship Men's program) has been very disappointing, and the lack of action to resolve those issues was concerning. I won't bore everyone to death with a rehash over the McCloskey incident - which I still think was opportunistically overplayed - but Coach Witt seems to finally be making some progress in turning things around. And with the "renegotiation" of Umile's lifetime deal down to 3 years (with the apparent Souza provision), the AD is arguably playing the "long game" but only time will tell if the latter was a masterstroke OR just re-arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. If it fails, though, understand that a decade of UNH Hockey will have effectively been "flushed" - Umile's last 3 years, presumably 5 years on Souza afterwards, and another 2 years for a potential successor (national search, etc. - which could have happened already). It's a huge gamble, and the jury will be out a while longer.

I'll touch briefly on the other issues before folks drop off into comas ...

* Lazzaro - never said he was going to intentionally replace a 2nd scholarship goalie. But as was the case with Regan (and a few others over the years), it happens. I just get the feeling that one of either Clark or Robinson won't be here next season. And we know for sure Tirone won't be here the season after next. So I suspect Lazzaro (frosh) is the long range plan for 3rd goalie, and (like Regan and others before him) may be only an injury/incident away from #2. Obviously, that's a lot of "maybe's" ... and I may be wrong in the end.

* Poturalski - just was never a huge fan to begin with. The less said, the better. You are free to disagree.

* ENG - I've never had an issue with 2 goals down. NEVER. I've been specific in saying 3 or more goals down in the regular season. Recall this discussion was triggered when UNH pulled Tirone down 3 goals with roughly 3 minutes to play at Dartmouth. Message - "I believe in you guys". Dartmouth scores an ENG one (1) minute later, and Tirone goes back in immediately after. Message?? (on further reflection, I agree - dull).

* Warm-ups vs. practice - you seem to think they're one and the same - I don't. My experience is that as much as a coach wants to think good practice habits should continue through warm-ups and into games, that's the ideal - not the norm. Practices (or "training", as in my other sport) are WAY more important than warm-ups. To equate the two is hopeful at best. Practices last a long time, warm-ups are only a few minutes, no? And FWIW - I've actually played the goalie position in both of my sports, so your lecture is amusing. Maybe it's my age nowadays, but in thinking back to my younger days, I honestly never viewed warm-ups as anything significant, other than to just get loose. I wasn't going to accomplish anything in 5 minutes that hadn't been accomplished over several hours in practice earlier in the week. If you're a coach on the recruiting trail, looking for insights and the only access you get to a player is warm-ups and then the game, and you don't get to see someone in extended practice settings (or training camps, offseason tourneys, etc.) hey - you take what you can get, I understand. But the idea that someone is going to try to assess a player and weight their performance in warm-ups ... that's some very thin ice.

I enjoy your posts, Dan. Not so much when you're attacking me, or belittling my assessments ... but I'm a big boy, and I can handle it. Keep bringing it to the table though, and hope we can continue to debate/argue (or even agree once in awhile) and spur more discussion looking ahead. The next few UNH Hockey seasons will likely provide us all with plenty of fodder for discussion. And we'll need all hands on deck (you too, Snively65).

[deltabravo62]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 Vol II -- We Do Have a Hockey Season Here!?!

I guess we just can't leave this alone. Enjoy the rest of the season, I'm not going to participate in this nonsense.

[E.J. Smith]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 Vol II -- We Do Have a Hockey Season Here!?!

I guess we just can't leave this alone. Enjoy the rest of the season, I'm not going to participate in this nonsense.

Ridiculous response and post. And I say that as someone who has enjoyed your contributions to this thread.

One, toughen up.
Two, why do people always feel the need to announce they're leaving? Should we take up a collection and get you a card?
Three, how are you participating in what Dan and Chuck have going?
Four, you must have a brutal time at parties. Do you make everyone in the room talk about the same topic, one at a time? Chuck and Dan happen to be having a conversation in the same room that you're in, that doesn't mean you're part of it unless you want to be part of it.

Why can't you post what you want, let those who want to respond to your posts respond, and you in turn choose who you want to respond to? I'm pretty sure most of the people on this thread have the mental capacity to keep track of the various posts and topics being discussed and respond to the ones that interest them. It's not that hard.

[Greg Ambrose]

Wow, this thread certainly turned ugly. I will not report any more of my thoughts about any UNH games that I attend, that is for sure. Good bye.

I get a kick out of the two guys slinging the mud. One lives in Colorado and, my guess, has not seen the team live this year. The other lives in Newfields but, for whatever reason, opts not to go to the games. The other thing that bemuses me is the tortured debate about where to play guys like Salvaggio, McNicholas and Hill. We are not exactly talking the second coming of Krog, Haydar, and Souza here.

UNH is mediocre at best. They are fortunate to be playing in Hockey East which is having a very down year. The fondest wish for any UNH fan is that the team somehow cobbles together enough wins in the second half to get home ice in the first round of the HE playoffs, which will give them a chance to advance. That's it.

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 Vol II -- We Do Have a Hockey Season Here!?!

I get a kick out of the two guys slinging the mud. One lives in Colorado and, my guess, has not seen the team live this year. The other lives in Newfields but, for whatever reason, opts not to go to the games.

Effingwoods, Greg. Newfields is just SO 2003. Please do keep up.

[defensive]And you don't exactly have to be a super sleuth to figure out "whatever reason" keeps me from (too) many games in the UNH Hockey season. It's something a few folks on here have managed to figure out. I catch enough grief on here sharing as much boring and irrelevant personal information already to veer into anything close to self-promotion, so I'll just have to leave you to your own devices. But let's be general and say 90% of my in season Saturday nights are committed elsewhere, which means Friday nights tend to become "Date Nights" at the WIS Estate - especially when the missus is not a big hockey fan. That puts a huge crimp on attending regularly, like the old days. But life is good, and I wouldn't have it any other way. [/defensive]

FWIW there have been many times I've thought it would be easier to re-emerge under a semi-clever cover ID. But (perhaps like you?) it's always just felt right to be myself (warts and all), and be 100% accountable for what I post on here. I fully understand why others don't. They're the sane ones, to be fair. Responding after midnight doesn't exactly help make my case for sanity, either. G'night all.

[Greg Ambrose]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 Vol II -- We Do Have a Hockey Season Here!?!

Effingwoods, Greg. Newfields is just SO 2003. Please do keep up.

[defensive]And you don't exactly have to be a super sleuth to figure out "whatever reason" keeps me from (too) many games in the UNH Hockey season. It's something a few folks on here have managed to figure out. I catch enough grief on here sharing as much boring and irrelevant personal information already to veer into anything close to self-promotion, so I'll just have to leave you to your own devices. But let's be general and say 90% of my in season Saturday nights are committed elsewhere, which means Friday nights tend to become "Date Nights" at the WIS Estate - especially when the missus is not a big hockey fan. That puts a huge crimp on attending regularly, like the old days. But life is good, and I wouldn't have it any other way. [/defensive]

FWIW there have been many times I've thought it would be easier to re-emerge under a semi-clever cover ID. But (perhaps like you?) it's always just felt right to be myself (warts and all), and be 100% accountable for what I post on here. I fully understand why others don't. They're the sane ones, to be fair. Responding after midnight doesn't exactly help make my case for sanity, either. G'night all.

Two comments. Sorry for placing you in the wrong hamlet. And, not always.

[After the Whistle]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 Vol II -- We Do Have a Hockey Season Here!?!

I get a kick out of the two guys slinging the mud. One lives in Colorado and, my guess, has not seen the team live this year. The other lives in Newfields but, for whatever reason, opts not to go to the games. The other thing that bemuses me is the tortured debate about where to play guys like Salvaggio, McNicholas and Hill. We are not exactly talking the second coming of Krog, Haydar, and Souza here.

UNH is mediocre at best. They are fortunate to be playing in Hockey East which is having a very down year. The fondest wish for any UNH fan is that the team somehow cobbles together enough wins in the second half to get home ice in the first round of the HE playoffs, which will give them a chance to advance. That's it.

Wow Greg, this appears to be a little strong. I have always read your posts with a feeling that
I needed to pay attention and that perhaps I was learning some unique pieces of UNH hockey history. I guess I saw you as the team historian. But..."The other thing that bemuses me is the tortured debate about where to play guys like Salvaggio, McNicholas and Hill. We are not exactly talking the second coming of Krog, Haydar, and Souza here." Would you have us continue to rehash the old days and not talk about the only thing that we feel we know and have at least an opinion on - this years team. I saw all of those guys too, and yes they were fun and truly great hockey players in their time. But they ain't coming back, so we talk about Salvaggio, McNickolas and Hill.
Why would you belittle folks for doing that?

[scoreboard]

Ridiculous response and post. And I say that as someone who has enjoyed your contributions to this thread.

One, toughen up.
Two, why do people always feel the need to announce they're leaving? Should we take up a collection and get you a card?
Three, how are you participating in what Dan and Chuck have going?
Four, you must have a brutal time at parties. Do you make everyone in the room talk about the same topic, one at a time? Chuck and Dan happen to be having a conversation in the same room that you're in, that doesn't mean you're part of it unless you want to be part of it.

Why can't you post what you want, let those who want to respond to your posts respond, and you in turn choose who you want to respond to? I'm pretty sure most of the people on this thread have the mental capacity to keep track of the various posts and topics being discussed and respond to the ones that interest them. It's not that hard.

I agree with you 100%. This is a message board. Let people banter back and forth. I find the differing opinions interesting. I personally blame this infighting on Umile. Our team has faltered and now Cats fans are turning on each other. Remember the good old days when the fights were with BC, BU and Maine fans? Now the BC and BU fans won't waste their breath on us and the Maine fans can't pose an argument. To think of it, we can't even win a fight against Bentley fans.

[Greg Ambrose]

Wow Greg, this appears to be a little strong. I have always read your posts with a feeling that
I needed to pay attention and that perhaps I was learning some unique pieces of UNH hockey history. I guess I saw you as the team historian. But..."The other thing that bemuses me is the tortured debate about where to play guys like Salvaggio, McNicholas and Hill. We are not exactly talking the second coming of Krog, Haydar, and Souza here." Would you have us continue to rehash the old days and not talk about the only thing that we feel we know and have at least an opinion on - this years team. I saw all of those guys too, and yes they were fun and truly great hockey players in their time. But they ain't coming back, so we talk about Salvaggio, McNickolas and Hill.
Why would you belittle folks for doing that?

"Belittle" is too much of a perjorative and, if my comments came across that way, I apologize. But the fact is that this team is not very good. Losses to Bentley, ASU, CC, Dartmouth, etc. prove that. They are fortunate to have played the bottom feeders in a very weak Hockey East up to now. Wins against a terrible Maine team and UMass, which got swept at home by ASU, do not give me any indication of strength when it comes to UNH. Perhaps they will improve in the second half. Let's hope so. But to think that rearranging the proverbial deck chairs on the titanic is going to somehow vault them into contention is like chasing fool's gold.

And, btw, having been around as long as I have, I think I have some cred when it comes to talking about what you need in order to win. I've seen winning hockey on Whittemore Center ice. In fact, I saw it in spades until a few years ago. Not now though.

[Greg Ambrose]

I agree with you 100%. This is a message board. Let people banter back and forth. I find the differing opinions interesting. I personally blame this infighting on Umile. Our team has faltered and now Cats fans are turning on each other. Remember the good old days when the fights were with BC, BU and Maine fans? Now the BC and BU fans won't waste their breath on us and the Maine fans can't pose an argument. To think of it, we can't even win a fight against Bentley fans.

You blame the spat between Chuck and Dan on Umile? Really? You need to get a grip. You should have been here back in the old days, circa 1999 to 2003 say. What you are reading now is nothing. Anybody remember the debate after Michael Ayers played the game up in Maine after he had his hand sliced? There were posters who felt Umile should be brought up on charges of player endangerment. This forum is tame in comparison.

[scoreboard]

You blame the spat between Chuck and Dan on Umile? Really? You need to get a grip. You should have been here back in the old days, circa 1999 to 2003 say. What you are reading now is nothing. Anybody remember the debate after Michael Ayers played the game up in Maine after he had his hand sliced? There were posters who felt Umile should be brought up on charges of player endangerment. This forum is tame in comparison.

For your information I have been a UNH fan for a very long time. You also need to get a grip and realize my post was lighthearted. You need to hang up your skates....

[scoreboard]

And, btw, having been around as long as I have, I think I have some cred when it comes to talking about what you need in order to win.

A quote from Greg Ambose (AKA Bill Clinton) Early November 2016

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 Vol II -- We Do Have a Hockey Season Here!?!

Ooohh boy, it looks like the contentiousness is getting contagious ...

You blame the spat between Chuck and Dan on Umile? Really? You need to get a grip. You should have been here back in the old days, circa 1999 to 2003 say. What you are reading now is nothing. Anybody remember the debate after Michael Ayers played the game up in Maine after he had his hand sliced? There were posters who felt Umile should be brought up on charges of player endangerment. This forum is tame in comparison.

So true. Those were the "Wild West" days of USCHO. Pre-social media, when message boards were still close to cutting edge. This is all tame by comparison. For the sake of the others, I'll say this ... when things get heated on here, imagine like it's a hockey fight when two posters throw down and go at each other. Eventually we "punch" ourselves out, there are rarely "third men in", no one really "wins", and (at least in my experience?) 95% of the time it's water over the dam, and we return to the usual back-and-forth. I won't speak for Dan, but he's been around here a long time by his own admission, and I'm sure he's seen this happen dozens of times. We'll live.

To paraphrase EJ ... folks, if you're not directly involved, chill. No one is going to drag you into it unwillingly.

As far as the Umile connection from scoreboard, I'm thinking that was kinda in jest, but he does have a point. There is a lot of frustration with the State of UNH Hockey nowadays, and *maybe* this is one of the ways that manifests itself? There is also probably a generation gap of sorts at play here, as many of us long-timers tend to see the present situation through the lens of the high times in the late '90's and early '00's (or the height of the Holt era) ... while newer and/or younger fans don't have that distraction, and want to discuss the present situation without the old-timers (including me) telling them how crappy or mediocre things are nowadays at UNH. I get it.

But, what do both generations of fans have in common? Yup, Coach Umile ... whose continued presence as head coach ties the present situation to the past glories/semi-glories, and if nothing else invites most of these uncomfortable comparisons. Fair or not, this will be continuing until the day he finally steps aside, circa March 2018. It is what it is.

A quote from Bill Clinton. Early November 2016

Well played, sir.

[After the Whistle]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2016-17 Vol II -- We Do Have a Hockey Season Here!?!

"Belittle" is too much of a perjorative and, if my comments came across that way, I apologize. But the fact is that this team is not very good. Losses to Bentley, ASU, CC, Dartmouth, etc. prove that. They are fortunate to have played the bottom feeders in a very weak Hockey East up to now. Wins against a terrible Maine team and UMass, which got swept at home by ASU, do not give me any indication of strength when it comes to UNH. Perhaps they will improve in the second half. Let's hope so. But to think that rearranging the proverbial deck chairs on the titanic is going to somehow vault them into contention is like chasing fool's gold.

And, btw, having been around as long as I have, I think I have some cred when it comes to talking about what you need in order to win. I've seen winning hockey on Whittemore Center ice. In fact, I saw it in spades until a few years ago. Not now though.

As did I. Perhaps all of them with 4-5 exceptions. 90% of the away games too. I have some cred also. One difference is that I continue to attend. Just because i don't have 1000 posts doesn't mean I am ignorant. Did you make the welcome home after the overtime loss to Maine. It was at 12 midnight that Sunday when they returned to Durham. I respect your history and know you are a fan, but I will continue to attend and hope. And this is the only team I can speculate at the present time.