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MadCityRich
03-23-2016, 04:51 PM
Pretend that the WCHA and those traditions never existed coz they're never coming back.

With that in mind - if this is happening in a vacuum - is adding Notre Dame to our existing 6 team conference a good thing?



Of course it is.
I smell what you're cookin', but we were told the Big Ten HC will be Big Ten schools. We all knew it wouldn't be more than 6, and 6 sucks, but to me it was like giving the eff yoo to those aforementioned teams. In a vacuum, Notre Dame fine; but ASU for christsakes? As long as the BTHC now wants to add "non-conference" teams, why not go back begging to NoDak, DU, CC, UMD and other strong hockey schools?

I know, I know. It will never happen, but I've never been a fan of the Bi6, errr Bi7 HC.

Get off my lawn.

Almington
03-23-2016, 05:12 PM
Me as well, but I take it a step further, I disliked it when SCSU joined. I don't think it's a necessity to have an 8th team. The 7th team doesn't make the playoffs. Other than UW's improbable WCHA tourney win a few years ago, the top 2 teams win the tourney anyway.

Flip the current tournament on its head:

Top 2 seeds host a single elimination quarterfinals (1st place with bye if just 7 teams) and semifinals. Top remaining seed hosts final two in best of three for the championship.

Wisko McBadgerton
03-23-2016, 05:47 PM
I smell what you're cookin', but we were told the Big Ten HC will be Big Ten schools. We all knew it wouldn't be more than 6, and 6 sucks, but to me it was like giving the eff yoo to those aforementioned teams. In a vacuum, Notre Dame fine; but ASU for christsakes? As long as the BTHC now wants to add "non-conference" teams, why not go back begging to NoDak, DU, CC, UMD and other strong hockey schools?

I know, I know. It will never happen, but I've never been a fan of the Bi6, errr Bi7 HC.

Get off my lawn.

Well, if another B1G school gets hockey for '17 or maybe '18 then ASU is probably out. So there is really some (small) chance of keeping to the long held traditions of the Big 10.

For example Rutgers could come up with money for a program. :p

mnstate0fhockey
03-23-2016, 06:22 PM
Personally I think it's a bull**** move. We snub traditions like the old WCHA (ND, CC, DU UMD, etc), start the BTHC for BTN, then add these guys? **** 'em.

"Show me the money."

Keep in mind, Notre Dame, Michigan, and Michigan State were long time members of the WCHA. The realignment has been tough getting used to, but I try to remember that this isn't the first major conference shake up and probably won't be the last. It will take some time getting used to, but I believe a time will come when these rivalries grow and it feels like the new normal.

WiscTJK
03-23-2016, 06:25 PM
I was against this big 6 conference from the beginning but it's here to stay.

I will say I can easily develop a hate for Rudy and the gold helmets, in fact I am there already.....

RedStripes
03-23-2016, 06:35 PM
Flip the current tournament on its head:

Top 2 seeds host a single elimination quarterfinals (1st place with bye if just 7 teams) and semifinals. Top remaining seed hosts final two in best of three for the championship.

Not a bad idea. The negative to having the highest seed host the final or host the entire playoff tourney is that it makes it really hard for any interested fans the conference tourney an annual trip. I understand that the pool of fans who want to do so is diminished right now. But as one who likes to make the annual pilgrimage, I would much prefer rotating the host school for the tourney. Over a series of years, we could make a trip to all of the conference schools.

Almington
03-23-2016, 08:31 PM
Not a bad idea. The negative to having the highest seed host the final or host the entire playoff tourney is that it makes it really hard for any interested fans the conference tourney an annual trip. I understand that the pool of fans who want to do so is diminished right now. But as one who likes to make the annual pilgrimage, I would much prefer rotating the host school for the tourney. Over a series of years, we could make a trip to all of the conference schools.

Maybe, but with just two teams the possibility of not having a local team could make the attendance a complete disaster.

RedStripes
03-23-2016, 08:44 PM
Maybe, but with just two teams the possibility of not having a local team could make the attendance a complete disaster.

My post wasn't too clear. I actually meant having a complete conference tourney similar to now, just rotating the campus sites from year to year. I think that'd be better than letting the #1 seed host. I get this is unlikely to ever happen but there doesn't seem to be any shortage of wishful thinking around here this week.

BuB
03-23-2016, 11:06 PM
I don't have a Twitter account so I don't follow anyone - but I did go to Mark Osiecki's twitter page just for the heck of it. He does have an inordinate number of Wisconsin tweets - noting the MBB teams Sweet 16 appearance and Matt Lepay's call of the Koenig game winner - in addition to wishing the team good luck. Coincidence, or is he playing up to the potential future fan base?

Stauber1
03-23-2016, 11:24 PM
My post wasn't too clear. I actually meant having a complete conference tourney similar to now, just rotating the campus sites from year to year. I think that'd be better than letting the #1 seed host. I get this is unlikely to ever happen but there doesn't seem to be any shortage of wishful thinking around here this week.

It seems evident to me that the Big 10 will move to an on-campus first round series hosted at the high seed - just as every other conference does. What they decide to do for the championship weekend still seems up in the air.

Scottyp
03-24-2016, 12:18 AM
Everyone (even Barry!) recognizes a 6 team conference isn't cutting it, adding Notre Dame is a no brainer. And it allows the BIG and ND to begin the long slow dance that the BIG wants to end in total conference affiliation. We'll see how that works out.

Not that I am a conspiracy theorist, but I also think the hockey BIG is getting miffed that no other schools want to add hockey. The flirtation with Omaha might just be a rather political inducement to convince Nebraska to think seriously about starting a hockey program. The last thing Nebraska wants to see is a flourishing Omaha program in the Big Ten. They could use that logic with adding Notre Dame to nudge Purdue, Indiana and NU. Maybe they will ask Iowa State or Southern Illinois to start one soon...

Timothy A
03-24-2016, 07:14 AM
we were told the Big Ten HC will be Big Ten schools. We all knew it wouldn't be more than 6, and 6 sucks, but to me it was like giving the eff yoo to those aforementioned teams.

This is a great point. Why set up a B6 league with strictly B6 teams, then a few years later, start adding non B6 teams to the league? If that's the route, why F up the WCHA in the first place? Oh yeah......$$$$$$$$. If they want an 8th team, screw ASU and just go for UND, DU, UMD or MT. If your gonna mix a drink, add enough booze to the thing.

solovsfett
03-24-2016, 07:17 AM
This is a great point. Why set up a B6 league with strictly B6 teams, then a few years later, start adding non B6 teams to the league? If that's the route, why F up the WCHA in the first place? Oh yeah......$$$$$$$$. If they want an 8th team, screw ASU and just go for UND, DU, UMD or MT. If your gonna mix a drink, add enough booze to the thing.

agreed!

bucky15
03-24-2016, 07:17 AM
It seems evident to me that the Big 10 will move to an on-campus first round series hosted at the high seed - just as every other conference does. What they decide to do for the championship weekend still seems up in the air.

Downtown Chicago.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TST3BbW4-Us

Watch out for flying pucks below.

solovsfett
03-24-2016, 07:20 AM
https://twitter.com/Buccigross/status/712011295361527808

I agree Mr. Buccigross, time for a REBOOT in Madison. Bring in a new guy with no ties to prior regime's and give him a chance to breathe new life into the program

mnstate0fhockey
03-24-2016, 08:07 AM
This is a great point. Why set up a B6 league with strictly B6 teams, then a few years later, start adding non B6 teams to the league? If that's the route, why F up the WCHA in the first place? Oh yeah......$$$$$$$$. If they want an 8th team, screw ASU and just go for UND, DU, UMD or MT. If your gonna mix a drink, add enough booze to the thing.

I don't think they thought the whole thing out before jumping in. Now they realize how disdvantageous having only 6 teams in the conference is and how much it is hurting the brand.

The Hallucination
03-24-2016, 08:25 AM
I'm not feeling the hostility to Notre Dame, nor to any of the discussed 8th teams. Notre Dame is a tourney team this year, so better than a lot of what we've got, and South Bend is an acceptable roadtrip distance. (We were there once, but it was in a giant *** snow storm, so I'd like to check it out in conditions that actually allow seeing a bit of the city/campus.) We went to Omaha twice when they were in the WCHA and loved it both times - seriously, way better than St. Cloud, or Bemidji, as far as a fun road trip. Never been to Miami of Ohio, but it makes some geographical sense and I'd be happy to check it out.

ASU is a bit of an odd pick but to the extent we're becoming old people with jobs and can swing the occasional flight, it would be a nice escape in the winter - and whether or not they join the conference I want a series there, especially if they could do back to back non-con series with one of the Colorado schools. I have an epic trip in my head where we fly into one, drive through some national parks, and fly out the other, bookended by hockey weekends... but now I'm just rambling about fun hockey trip scheduling fantasies.

Anyway, I don't mind Notre Dame, I think it makes some sense, and there are cases to be made for the others. There are certainly old WCHA schools I miss more (Denver, CC, Nodak), some I definitely have no desire to ever visit again (Bemidji, St. Cloud, probably also Mankato), and some I'd put tied with some of these others (Duluth - I have a fair amount of hatred for them but there are arguments for anyway; Tech - Houghton makes me wish I was dead though I know others like it for reasons I cannot appreciate).

Wisko McBadgerton
03-24-2016, 09:59 AM
To clear up something I posted about Don Granato's job that was incorrect earlier: The NTDP coaches (The other is Danton Cole) stay with the same group for two years. Don and asst. Nick Fohr had the U-18's last year (including the gold at the IIHF U18 World Championships) and took over the incoming U17's this year.

Wisko McBadgerton
03-24-2016, 11:09 AM
This is a great point. Why set up a B6 league with strictly B6 teams, then a few years later, start adding non B6 teams to the league? If that's the route, why F up the WCHA in the first place? Oh yeah......$$$$$$$$. If they want an 8th team, screw ASU and just go for UND, DU, UMD or MT. If your gonna mix a drink, add enough booze to the thing.

As soon as (actually, no doubt it was before) Pegula wrote a check to PSU, B1G hockey was happening. There was no stopping it. (But frankly, realignment of some sort was coming soon anyway, IMHO.)

I love the metaphor, (happy trails MM) and I would love to have the old schools in conference but it isn't ever happening. UND, UMD, and MT have nothing in common with the B1G schools and their huge enrollments, massive endowments, and giant research facilities. Not to mention their P5 status. The B1G office doesn't want the other UND on status and academic principles and the other UND would be crazy to join. Right now they have a lot of power within the NACHO,(or anywhere else they want to be) but in the B1G they would have zero say in anything and just be along for the ride. Why in the world would they want that? DU might have a very slight edge over the others as they could bring LAX along too. So maybe if DU begged the B1G... but still, a small private liberal arts college has zero in common with the B1G schools. At least Notre Dame has a $10 billion endowment to ensure stability. Comparatively, DU's endowment isn't enough to tip the waiters at ND's alumni breakfast. All would be antithetical arrangements.

Granted UW doesn't get much from ND joining in terms of rivalry but the CCHA schools do and MN has played them regularly as of late, so it's a good fit in the long run. As far as ASU goes, outside of research, they are much more simpatico as a large well funded school with a huge alumni base. Like ND, they're also a P5 member which would give the B1G yet another strong NCAA voice in its quest to take total control of college hockey.

As far as actual hockey goes, ASU isn't a D-III play up and we can perhaps expect them to follow a similar (if maybe slower) trajectory to PSU. Or who knows? Maybe they are even more successful if it can catch on. The best draft eligible player in the world is from AZ. There's at least 5 or 6 invitees to the NTDP evaluation camp from TX and AZ. (WI has one in Ty Emberson.) There's talent in the desert if they can corral it.

To me the thing is with ASU is it would be good for college hockey to have them successful and growing. The B1G teams have alumni and name recognition in AZ and perhaps give a financial benefit to a new program. And they certainly bring stability in that B1G schools can afford hockey even if no one shows up, so there's no question of anyone going anywhere. Short term we don't benefit, but long term helping a PAC-12 hockey conference get off the ground would be great for the sport and is the right thing to do. (Which is maybe why the evil B1G wouldn't do it, I suppose.) And lastly, 8 teams and 28 games is a much better number for a conference.

Almington
03-24-2016, 11:23 AM
The issue with 28 conference games is that we are back to just 6 NC games. Something would have to give because UW could not continue to play UND and CC/DU every year along with playing NMU at GB and playing Hockey East teams annually.

Personally, it's more important that we keep playing the HE teams over just former WCHA rivals.

IIRC, UMN would have Zero NC games after the mariucci classic, North Star Cup and promise to travel to the 4th MN school who isn't at the NSC.