UNH Wildcats 2013-14 Season Thread (Part 2)

[Greg Ambrose]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2013-14 Season Thread (Part 2)

Last night after the game my friends and I had probably the earliest season ending post mortem in recent memory. The way UNH played this weekend was downright depressing. We all know that they are not very talented but, based on last weekend's sweep, I thought the team had come to recognize that they would at least play with the defensive intensity that they showed against Notre Dame. In my book it really doesn't take a huge amount of talent to be a good defensive forward. What it takes is the willingness to put yourself in the middle of the ice, the willingness to take the body when necessary, and the willingness to have the stick down on the ice to deflect and intercept passes. But that is all predicated on skating, isn't it? The drive to bust your gut, get back there and prevent scoring chances. Sadly, very sadly, that was all missing from UNH's game the last two nights. I don't want to minimize UVM's effort in both games but all have to agree that UNH made their job a lot easier.

So the season is pretty much a loss, kind of like two years ago. Except for Pesce and TVR (if he comes back) there isn't any high end talent on this team. My favorite forward the past few weeks has been Willows. He has been skating hard and been opportunistic. Any coach would love to have him. But last night post-game we were discussing where he would be slotted on UNH teams of old. I am not talking Mowers/Krog era of the late '90's but 11 years ago, the last time UNH made the FF. That team had Gare, Hemingway, Collins, Saviano so, at best Willows would have been a third line center. This, as I see it, is how far UNH has fallen. Sure, in the last five years, with Butler and Thompson, they had some go to guys but UNH still did not have any depth. Now we have zilch.

So what do we see going forward? Obviously we are stuck with the forwards we have. The question for me is how good the incoming group is (CHC?). I see and hear that we have at least two forwards coming in who are top 100 North American on the NHL Central Scouting Bureau list. That means to me that they might be drafted anywhere from the 3rd to 6th round. Not an equal to some of BC's recruits but certainly better than what UNH has brought in in the recent past. I guess what I want to see next year is that these kids come in, get some real ice time, and show improvement as the year goes on. If the progress is as flat line as this year's freshman class then I think it will be time for a change. No, Umile won't be let go but how about the assistants? They're the ones who are the talent evaluators. I know it's a tough business but there comes a point where we can all see that the program has become a pale imitation of what it has been and, as a result, someone should be held accountable. Question is, who is going to have the stones to make (demand) the change?

BTW, I want everybody to know how depressing it is for the this 40+ year fan of the Wildcats to sit here on February 8, a month before the regular season ends, and type this post. But what alternative is there? If the team has quit, which it did this weekend, why should I not do the same?

[unh1982]

Last night after the game my friends and I had probably the earliest season ending post mortem in recent memory. The way UNH played this weekend was downright depressing. We all know that they are not very talented but, based on last weekend's sweep, I thought the team had come to recognize that they would at least play with the defensive intensity that they showed against Notre Dame. In my book it really doesn't take a huge amount of talent to be a good defensive forward. What it takes is the willingness to put yourself in the middle of the ice, the willingness to take the body when necessary, and the willingness to have the stick down on the ice to deflect and intercept passes. But that is all predicated on skating, isn't it? The drive to bust your gut, get back there and prevent scoring chances. Sadly, very sadly, that was all missing from UNH's game the last two nights. I don't want to minimize UVM's effort in both games but all have to agree that UNH made their job a lot easier.

So the season is pretty much a loss, kind of like two years ago. Except for Pesce and TVR (if he comes back) there isn't any high end talent on this team. My favorite forward the past few weeks has been Willows. He has been skating hard and been opportunistic. Any coach would love to have him. But last night post-game we were discussing where he would be slotted on UNH teams of old. I am not talking Mowers/Krog era of the late '90's but 11 years ago, the last time UNH made the FF. That team had Gare, Hemingway, Collins, Saviano so, at best Willows would have been a third line center. This, as I see it, is how far UNH has fallen. Sure, in the last five years, with Butler and Thompson, they had some go to guys but UNH still did not have any depth. Now we have zilch.

So what do we see going forward? Obviously we are stuck with the forwards we have. The question for me is how good the incoming group is (CHC?). I see and hear that we have at least two forwards coming in who are top 100 North American on the NHL Central Scouting Bureau list. That means to me that they might be drafted anywhere from the 3rd to 6th round. Not an equal to some of BC's recruits but certainly better than what UNH has brought in in the recent past. I guess what I want to see next year is that these kids come in, get some real ice time, and show improvement as the year goes on. If the progress is as flat line as this year's freshman class then I think it will be time for a change. No, Umile won't be let go but how about the assistants? They're the ones who are the talent evaluators. I know it's a tough business but there comes a point where we can all see that the program has become a pale imitation of what it has been and, as a result, someone should be held accountable. Question is, who is going to have the stones to make (demand) the change?

BTW, I want everybody to know how depressing it is for the this 40+ year fan of the Wildcats to sit here on February 8, a month before the regular season ends, and type this post. But what alternative is there? If the team has quit, which it did this weekend, why should I not do the same?

your not alone, I gave up also.

[freak]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2013-14 Season Thread (Part 2)

Josh's team tied for 26th in PWR with 33 points, 2 points behind UNH, tied for 23rd.

Ummm....okay? Is that supposed to discredit the arguments he was making?

The foreign language requirement issue was brought up earlier in the thread and somebody dismissed it as trivial. I thought it was relevant, seeing as Ciocco had previously addressed that very argument in detail.

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2013-14 Season Thread (Part 2)

Like Scott basically said... the situation does not look good to say the least. Basically UNH needs to win the reaming 4 games and I'm afraid with the inconsistent play they have shown all year that is a tough thing to ask for. BU is always a tough opponent for UNH too. Say they find a way to win out. They will finish with 24 points.

Above us:
Northeastern has: 1 @Mass, 2 vs Maine, H&H with BU. Say they finish 3-2... they finish with 23 points.
Tied:
Maine has: 2 vs MC, 2 @ NU, 2 vs PC. Say they finish 3-3 (or 3-2-1)... they finish with 22(or 23) points
Below us:
Providence has: 2 vs. ND, H&H with Mass, and 2 at Maine. Say they go 4-2 over their last six... they finish with 23 points.
Vermont has: 2 vs BC, 2 @ MC, 2 vs. Lowell. Say they go 4-2 over their last six... they finish with 22 points.

I think most people would agree BC and Lowell are pretty well out of the picture....
So UNH needs two of those scenarios to play out in order to get a bye (top 5) and three scenarios to play out to get home ice (top 4).

This is a possible scenario I'm looking at to get home ice....
Vermont can win both against MC and split in the their two other series(BC, Lowell)(or get swept in one). End w/ 22 points
Providence can win both against UMass but then needs to split the other two series (ND&ME). End w/ 23 points
Maine can with both against MC, then get swept by NU, and split with PC. End w/ 22 points

(I apologize to Merrimack. No offense that I have you losing your last six games in my scenario. If you could get a win against Maine and or Vermont that'd be cool.)

Now that is some glass half full kind of stuff right there. Trust me I'm not senile and I know how the annual story goes for UNH. But as Scott said, were not eliminated mathematically and I'm just running through a possible scenario of how things "could" end. Now if UNH plans on finishing with anything less than 24 points then they will need some real magic from other teams in order to get a bye or home ice. I'm not going to even bother trying to plan out that situation. It's prob. still possible but highly unlikely/not a chance UNH would get home ice with less than 24 points(even w/ 24 points it's going to be a stretch). Stating the obvious... the easiest way to get home ice is for UNH to win their last 4 games and get some help else where. Yes, a lot of things need to align/ fall into place but not completely out of the question. Now for reality... I Personally think I just wasted like 30 minutes of my life because UNH will prob go 2-2 over this stretch,finish in 7th, and make all other scenarios(& this post) essentially useless/insignificant. Life of a UNH fan...
Anyway..these scenarios are getting harder and harder to do after every game lost... and it's a shame that UNH not only has to go out and win their last 4 game (highly unlikely IMO as I said) but also need a lot of help/ luck from other teams and how they finish down the stretch. This weekend was just demoralizing. Nothing against Vermont because they're a good team, but to come away from this weekend with nothing is horrible. And at HOME! Makes it inexcusable....

Ryan, I gotta laugh ... I love the effort and in-depth analysis of what needs to happen to get UNH back with home ice and a play-in round bye. But from early on, I was thinking exactly the part of your post I highlighted in RED towards the end, and was almost relieved and reassured of your sanity when I saw you finally add it in.

unh1982 and Greg - I'm unfortunately of the same mind. I can (and have) tolerated and *suffered* through a lot of disappointments with the teams and the program over the years. But I cannot tolerate a simple baseline lack of effort. In a way, I was glad Coach did not hide his displeasure with Friday night's effort, as he has sometimes had a tendency to cover for some past poor efforts. There are some players out there who are still putting out max effort ... but there are a notable number who clearly got amnesia about just how they swept the previous series, and came up FAR short of the necessary commitment.

Let's face it ... this is a dyed-in-the-wool .500 team. They are a .500 team at home. They are a .500 team away from home. They were a .500 team before the December break, and they're basically a .500 team since. They are a .500 team with TvR, and they're a .500 team without TvR. And with BU next up on the schedule - regardless of their record - there's a very good chance the 'Cats will be playing .500 hockey for the next two weekends.

Then they will host a play-in game against UMass or BU or Merrimack, and they will win. Some of us will get psyched, figure this is the big turnaround, and then they will win one of the first two games in the Quarters, teasing us about the trip to Boston. But just as sure as water finds its level, UNH will do so again, lose "valiantly" and then they will fittingly finish their postseason at .500 too.

[Snively65]

Ummm....okay? Is that supposed to discredit the arguments he was making?

The foreign language requirement issue was brought up earlier in the thread and somebody dismissed it as trivial. I thought it was relevant, seeing as Ciocco had previously addressed that very argument in detail.

No, I did not mean to imply anything negative about AA, as they are having their best season in a long time, and perhaps Josh is in part responsible for that. His job is recruiting in probably the toughest environment in Div 1. I think that UNH blew it by not making him an assistant last year.

As for language requirements, Bentley has benefitted with three players from BC and three from Alberta this season (having the 2012 Walter Brown Award winner from St Louis and the highest scoring D-man this year in Div 1 from Los Angeles has not hurt either). Anyone remember Joey Juneau, who could not speak any English on his arrival at RPI, where he earned BS and MS degrees in aeronautical engineering in his four years of a stellar collegiate hockey career before playing for the Bruins? I agree with Josh that a two-year language requirement is absurd, even if it seems like an easily reachable task for Div. 1 recruits.

[Ryan422]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2013-14 Season Thread (Part 2)

Ummm....okay? Is that supposed to discredit the arguments he was making?

The foreign language requirement issue was brought up earlier in the thread and somebody dismissed it as trivial. I thought it was relevant, seeing as Ciocco had previously addressed that very argument in detail.

Okay if people are going to use this as a legitimate reason for the lack of success on the ice then there needs to be some clarification/ facts. I'm not closely involved in the team or school so I don't know all the facts.

It sounds like this issue is more about 'special admits' for athletes than it is about the specific second language requirement. I don't know a ton about special admits but I know it goes on. I know it has become a big thing at big football/basketball schools. I think some football schools will have 50-75 percent of their players are special admits. But I don't know or haven't heard a lot about special admits for hockey players around the nation. I'm sure it goes on and it probably goes on a lot at some schools. Every school does not have special admits for athletes though(I'm sure a lot do, probably most would be my guess). Someone used a hypothetical with a recruit saying 10 schools want an athlete. 9 will use special admits and UNH would not. So what I was asking was some info to back that claim up. Now if anyone has this information it'd be interesting to look at. If no one does and someone has some spare time on their hands to maybe look at hockey east or top 20 schools and what their policy is on special admits for athletes to back up this claim. That'd be cool. If someone could gather their policy and how many athletes (preferably hockey players) are special admits. It may be hard to get all schools since private schools don't need to release that information.

Now what I'm really interested in is UNH and what their policy is. I admit I don't know really anything about this policy so if someone could fill me in and point me to some school paperwork/references to back it up.(UNH is a public university so this info is supposed to be available to the public) If no one does maybe someday when I have some time I'll try to find out but if someone has this info now, offer it up:
1) Has UNH ever had special admits for athletes?
3) If they did, what year did they get rid of special admits?
4) If they used to have them, how many athletes(preferably hockey players) were special admits each year? (It'd be interesting to compare # of special admits to success each year.)
5) What year did they change the language requirement from 1 to 2?

Now if UNH used to have special admits(Say from '95-'05) then certainly that could be a major cause for the lack of talent on the team. Certainly if the facts show that, for example, in 1999 & 2003 50 percent of the team was special admits and now it's zero.

Now if UNH has never had special admits for athletes then I'm still skeptical about changing the language requirement from 1 to 2 as being a major reason for the lack of talent/success for UNH. It certainly effects getting some recruits once in awhile though for sure. I'm not that ignorant. But I have posted on this subject before and I think I have made some good points. I know people have made up their mind and wont change their opinion. That's cool, I get that. And Ciocco made some really good points as well. But not all kids do the bare minimum to graduate high school. And in another hypothetical... I'm a good athlete or my son is. He's a really good hockey player and wants to play in college, good enough for D1. Going into high school I know colleges require 2 years of a language and I don't know a school will give me a special admit so I would want to get my two years of a language out of the way my first two years in HS. Now certainly some players who are really, really good may do the bare minimum to graduate HS and just rely on a special admit to whatever school they can. Probably wouldn't be too hard if you're that good. Maybe I'm way off in my 2 hypotheticals since I've never been a D1 coach or D1 recruit but I don't think it's unrealistic. But my guess is UNH isn't losing these real top quality players 'just' because of the language/ special admit policy if the alternative for a kid is to go play at Michigan/N. Dakota/Minn. Maybe they do and miss out on a good recruit here and there because he doesn't want to or hasn't taken 2 years of a language. I'll give you that. But that's not really something you can quantify in either direction. All teams/ schools miss out on or get recruits for a variety of reasons.

But in general I feel like there is plenty of talent out there in Canada & U.S. to field a good team who meet UNH admissions requirements. It's not like UNH is an Ivy league schools w/ Ivy league admission requirements who doesn't have special admits for athletes that pretty much results in not being able to recruit anyone and can't field a competitive team.


But this issue of lack of talent isn't only about the second language requirement and getting players from BC. Why isn't UNH getting top players from the U.S. anymore? Like Massachusetts. Can't blame that on the language requirement. But if there's been a change in the special admissions policy for athletes(???) then that is a debate I can get on board with.

[freak]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2013-14 Season Thread (Part 2)

It does sound like any "special admits" policy has changed. It has becoming a running joke on the boards, but according to Ciocco (who is close to his family), after he decommitted from NU, Gaudreau had a strong interest in UNH. Gaudreau's best friend is a Wildcat. But according to Ciocco, admissions wouldn't even look at his application because it was past the deadline and they had already refused other sports as well.

[C-H-C]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2013-14 Season Thread (Part 2)

But this issue of lack of talent isn't only about the second language requirement and getting players from BC. Why isn't UNH getting top players from the U.S. anymore? Like Massachusetts.

I applaud your passion and the articulate presentation of your concerns/questions. As for the future, Shane Eiserman is likely to be drafted by an NHL team this June and most would consider him a "top player". He is from West Newbury, MA and will be at UNH next fall.

Ara Nazarian, a junior at Malden Catholic, is considered a top player from Massachusetts. He is on track to come to UNH in either 2015 or 16.

UNH will never become the most desirable destination for most of the top players who grow up inside Interstate 495 in eastern Massachusetts. Those type of players will prefer to play at BC and/or BU - or Harvard if the kid excels at academics.

It's a reasonable expectation for UNH to recruit one top player from Massachusetts every year. BTW, although many consider Western Mass a part of New York State, Tyler Kelleher is from Longmeadow, MA. He was the top scorer for both the US NTDP Under-17 and Under-18 teams before he came to UNH.

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2013-14 Season Thread (Part 2)

I applaud your passion and the articulate presentation of your concerns/questions. As for the future, Shane Eiserman is likely to be drafted by an NHL team this June and most would consider him a "top player". He is from West Newbury, MA and will be at UNH next fall.

Too bad Shane's first name wasn't "Steve" instead. Listening to the PA at The Whitt over the next few years promises to be a throwback blast regardless for this long-time Red Wings' diehard.

[scoreboard]

Ummm....okay? Is that supposed to discredit the arguments he was making?

The foreign language requirement issue was brought up earlier in the thread and somebody dismissed it as trivial. I thought it was relevant, seeing as Ciocco had previously addressed that very argument in detail.

The foreign language requirement is trivial. Most schools require 2 years now. Not to mention, you can't compare policies of the 90's to today. The world is much more global now. Also, UNH players seem to have a more likely chance of playing pro in Europe than they do in America. Knowing a second language may actually be helpful to their future.

[thegeese]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2013-14 Season Thread (Part 2)

Let me pass along what I sawfrom the games this past weekend. If you go back and watch the video archive from the weekend broadcasts please notice that UNH had a hard time catching passes, winning board battles, winning faceoffs, winning foot races to the puck all weekend. Say what you may about your likes or dislikes about this team, those are not normal characteristics of this bunch. Compare that to the ND weekend when they won a high % of faceoffs and board battles etc. They controlled all of those situations that weekend. This Team physically hit their wall this weekend. Watch the archive. A tired player has problems handling passes, reaction times are slower, don't have the leg strength to win the board battles. I noticed situations when players were falling down just by trying to take hard turns to get back in the play. Tired players are slow to read and react to game situations as well. I thought that they were gased from their first shift Friday night. It happens. Vermont is not a team with abnormal size or exceptional footspeed. They don't really have any players that are likely to be placed on the All Hockey East team etc. Their defense is of average speed and size, and they have as many smallish forwards as UNH does. But they were fresh and rejuvenated. With the injury situations, ( not making excuses just using it as reference) the 3 oldest Def have been skating well in excess of 30 minutes a night for the past 3 weekends. The bottom 3 haven't picked up any additional on their share of reps in that time. Tough to keep up with long term. They key forwards are also getting exorbident time as well. They have had a tough post holiday stretch- Hoilday tournament- 2 against UNO- 2 against Union- 2 against Maine- 2 against ND- 2 against Vermont. Must be easy to play only 2 games a week? They practice hard 4 days a week- with old school coaches- ban the water bottle style- if 5 side boards is good for you then 10 must be better. Happens to every team- check the Bruins schedule out- I am sure they have had some unexplainable games. Vermont was off last weekend- do you think they had to put out as much energy last weekend as UNH did? Doesn't take much effort to pop open a Natty light.
The sky isn't falling down and the end of the world is not this week. Hopefully they can get their legs underneath them and get things going back in the right direction again. It is unfortunate, but the empty weekend they have coming up is in 2 weeks, and they face Merrimack and the playoffs after that. Hindsight says it would have been great to have had that last week or the week before. Don't question their intensity or enthusiasm. They care more than you do about results. There is not a person there that doesn't care.

[freak]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2013-14 Season Thread (Part 2)

The foreign language requirement is trivial. Most schools require 2 years now. Not to mention, you can't compare policies of the 90's to today. The world is much more global now. Also, UNH players seem to have a more likely chance of playing pro in Europe than they do in America. Knowing a second language may actually be helpful to their future.

I think that the point is that UNH admissions will not budge on the requirement, while other schools might treat it more as a guideline if the student brings something else (hockey, in this case) to the table.

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2013-14 Season Thread (Part 2)

Let me pass along what I sawfrom the games this past weekend. If you go back and watch the video archive from the weekend broadcasts please notice that UNH had a hard time catching passes, winning board battles, winning faceoffs, winning foot races to the puck all weekend. Say what you may about your likes or dislikes about this team, those are not normal characteristics of this bunch. Compare that to the ND weekend when they won a high % of faceoffs and board battles etc. They controlled all of those situations that weekend. This Team physically hit their wall this weekend. Watch the archive. A tired player has problems handling passes, reaction times are slower, don't have the leg strength to win the board battles. I noticed situations when players were falling down just by trying to take hard turns to get back in the play. Tired players are slow to read and react to game situations as well. I thought that they were gased from their first shift Friday night. It happens. Vermont is not a team with abnormal size or exceptional footspeed. They don't really have any players that are likely to be placed on the All Hockey East team etc. Their defense is of average speed and size, and they have as many smallish forwards as UNH does. But they were fresh and rejuvenated. With the injury situations, ( not making excuses just using it as reference) the 3 oldest Def have been skating well in excess of 30 minutes a night for the past 3 weekends. The bottom 3 haven't picked up any additional on their share of reps in that time. Tough to keep up with long term. They key forwards are also getting exorbident time as well. They have had a tough post holiday stretch- Hoilday tournament- 2 against UNO- 2 against Union- 2 against Maine- 2 against ND- 2 against Vermont. Must be easy to play only 2 games a week? They practice hard 4 days a week- with old school coaches- ban the water bottle style- if 5 side boards is good for you then 10 must be better. Happens to every team- check the Bruins schedule out- I am sure they have had some unexplainable games. Vermont was off last weekend- do you think they had to put out as much energy last weekend as UNH did? Doesn't take much effort to pop open a Natty light.
The sky isn't falling down and the end of the world is not this week. Hopefully they can get their legs underneath them and get things going back in the right direction again. It is unfortunate, but the empty weekend they have coming up is in 2 weeks, and they face Merrimack and the playoffs after that. Hindsight says it would have been great to have had that last week or the week before. Don't question their intensity or enthusiasm. They care more than you do about results. There is not a person there that doesn't care.

Thanks for this perspective I for one appreciate it. The 'Cats have had quite a season there is no doubt about that. And it's absolutely true that their play was absolutely uncharacteristic, esp. Friday night. Everyone here I think just wants to see them succeed...keep some positive momentum going which in hockey I have discovered as a newbie fan, can be a tall order. (Especially with the extra ice time many players have been logging with the injury situation). Here's hoping and I'd be shocked if they didn't care...that would be unthinkable. One of the best cheers at the 'Whitt is "Hey Casey DeSmith...we are right behind you". (darn that pink hat )

[Snively65]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2013-14 Season Thread (Part 2)

I agree, the geese, as I am one of the few here who has not said that our players quit this past weekend, admittedly only seeing the Friday night game in person. But, having been at Lake Whitt for the two previous Friday night games also, I think that Vermont was a much stronger opponent than either Maine or Notre Dame, regardless of their records coming in. No question a short bench is going to wear down any team.

[Ryan422]

Re: UNH Wildcats 2013-14 Season Thread (Part 2)

UNH will never become the most desirable destination for most of the top players who grow up inside Interstate 495 in eastern Massachusetts. Those type of players will prefer to play at BC and/or BU - or Harvard if the kid excels at academics.

It's a reasonable expectation for UNH to recruit one top player from Massachusetts every year.

I agree and if UNH is getting at least one 'top player' from Mass each year I can live with that. Hopefully Kelleher develops into a real good player here. Eiserman seems like a good recruit and if all goes well Nazarian would be a nice fit too. That is definitely good news for the future and hopefully a step in the right direction since I took a look at the 2003 team....

Because on the 2003 team there were 8 players from Mass. All were pretty decent too. I know two are goalies but still & they were good too:
Saviano, Collins, Prudden, Foley, Truelson, Yandle, Pietrasiak, Ayers

All but one(Pietrasiak, Shrewsbury) were from inside the 495 boundary (The last UNH skater from inside 495 was Butler in '09-10. May not have been a highly touted recruit but certainly worked out well. So '02-03 had 7 players from Eastern Ma. and there has only been one(Wyer) the last 4 seasons.). I'm not trying to discredit you or disrespect you. You do great work for this team and I appreciate it, and I completely agree with you on recruiting in Ma., trying to recruit inside that boundary of 495 must be hell. Trying to convince a kid from Ma. to come up and play puck in 'cow-hampshire' could take some work. And I would assume it has only gotten harder with the success of BC the last decade and BU winning in '09. They obviously have the pick of the litter, nothing real new though. But what else has changed? Because I'm just saying UNH has had 8 Mass players(7 Eastern Ma.) on their team before (A year they went to NC) so maybe they could do it again...? That's the only year I looked at b/c I just wanted to take a successful year(Last time UNH went to the FF) and see how many players were on that team from Mass. That's certainly not the one and only reason why they went to the NC that year. Obviously. That's not the one factor that will result in success, I get that. They could certainly do it with zero players from Mass. or have a bad year with every player being from Mass. But interesting none the less. Hopefully recruits from Mass. will keep coming though because they usually work out pretty well (Sounds like 2, both from inside 495, will be on the way in the next 2-3 years. Sign of good things to come? Who knows. Ha.). I'm sure you'll let us know C-H-C.