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Maine Hockey Thread II: The Search for Spock

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  • Re: Maine Hockey Thread II: The Search for Spock

    The superclass of Flynn, Abbott, Diamond, and Nyquist was recruited before Corkum started at Maine.

    This year is the first class the he can take credit for.

    If you ask me, that's a huge drop-off. Beyond huge. So is next year's class. Probably his 3rd class, too. This year's freshman class is the fourth on Corkum's watch. I'll grant you that the trajectory looks good. This year's class is closer to what Maine needs every year. But I just don't see how there's any question that Corkum's first three were lacking.

    As for the other point, it just doesn't matter. Really, what difference does it make? If the assistants aren't doing a good job, and it's the HC's responsibility to replace them and he doesn't . . . that's not exactly an argument in *favor* of the assistants. Your point is just that assistants' failures are also the HC's failure. I can concede that point, and it changes nothing about why I think a clean break would be best.

    Of course, this is all hypothetical. I'm going to give Corkum a fair chance, mainly because I have no say in the matter.

    EDIT:

    On second thought, this might actually be a really good argument for promoting Corkum and bringing in a new guy to take lead responsibility for recruiting
    Last edited by amherstblackbear; 05-01-2013, 11:58 AM.
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    • Originally posted by amherstblackbear View Post
      The superclass of Flynn, Abbott, Diamond, and Nyquist was recruited before Corkum started at Maine.

      This year is the first class the he can take credit for.

      If you ask me, that's a huge drop-off. Beyond huge. So is next year's class. Probably his 3rd class, too. This year's freshman class is the fourth on Corkum's watch. I'll grant you that the trajectory looks good. This year's class is closer to what Maine needs every year. But I just don't see how there's any question that Corkum's first three were lacking.

      As for the other point, it just doesn't matter. Really, what difference does it make? If the assistants aren't doing a good job, and it's the HC's responsibility to replace them and he doesn't . . . that's not exactly an argument in *favor* of the assistants. Your point is just that assistants' failures are also the HC's failure. I can concede that point, and it changes nothing about why I think a clean break would be best.

      Of course, this is all hypothetical. I'm going to give Corkum a fair chance, mainly because I have no say in the matter.

      EDIT:

      On second thought, this might actually be a really good argument for promoting Corkum and bringing in a new guy to take lead responsibility for recruiting
      Diamond was a year behind the other guys. I'm not sure comparing classes is a very useful exercise. There surely is different money/spots available from class to class. On top of that the talent available isn't the same every year. Where some of the guys commit three or four years before they show up it can get confusing which coach recruited which player. I feel like in general though the quality of the commits Maine has received the last few years, irrespective of class, has been pretty good.

      For better or worse, it looks like Bob is the best available option by quite a distance.
      Originally posted by BobbyBrady
      Crosby probably wouldn't even be on BC's top two lines next year

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      • Re: Maine Hockey Thread II: The Search for Spock

        AmherstBlackBear, you're 1,000,000% right.

        First of all, Brian Flynn wasn't a major get as a recruit. He was a nobody who caught the eye of assistants at Maine and got a shot to come up. He is a hell of a player, and I am glad he came. But he wasn't some "WOAH!" major get out of high school. He literally only got an offer at Maine.

        Anyone who says Corkum is/was anything other than miserable at recruiting doesn't know their *** from their elbow. When Corkum sat in the driver's seat to sell this program, he had:

        1. A decently positioned program with recent frozen four appearances and a good class coming in
        2. A program not far removed from dynasty status
        3. An arena that kids DIE to play in, resources and training rooms that are as good or better than anything else in college, a place where kids can come in and be IT right away. Players love Alfond. People want to play there.

        I had friends that were top flight recruits, second round picks. One in particular had two calls with Grant Standbrook, was interested in the program wanted to come up, but in transition NEVER got roped in by the rest of the staff. He ended up playing at another Hockey East Program. He would have been tremendously helpful on a line at Maine. What happened Bob?

        Gut the fish that is Maine Hockey. Start this thing over.

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        • Re: Maine Hockey Thread II: The Search for Spock

          Originally posted by BearBrews View Post
          First of all, Brian Flynn wasn't a major get as a recruit. He was a nobody who caught the eye of assistants at Maine and got a shot to come up. He is a hell of a player, and I am glad he came. But he wasn't some "WOAH!" major get out of high school. He literally only got an offer at Maine.
          Flynn had no D1 offers right out of prep then got a few ECAC offers and Merrimack and Providence after Monarchs. He chose Maine at last minute, but didn't get money right away so it was luck that the staff got him.

          Priceless and others think it's Corkum's. I'm beginning to think it will go to someone else...

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          • Re: Maine Hockey Thread II: The Search for Spock

            Originally posted by all bear View Post
            Yeah, chit I'll buy everyone a pizza if Gwoz ends up at Maine. Cannot possibly see that happening. MSU would be a plum job and he'd be all over that I would suspect.
            Only thing working in Maine's favor is his age, not knowing how fast MSU, Wisconsin jobs open up.

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            • Originally posted by irishfan85 View Post
              Only thing working in Maine's favor is his age, not knowing how fast MSU, Wisconsin jobs open up.
              Has he been on campus? I suppose a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. I would rather see someone with Maine ties, but he certainly has a stron track record.
              Originally posted by BobbyBrady
              Crosby probably wouldn't even be on BC's top two lines next year

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              • Re: Maine Hockey Thread II: The Search for Spock

                Originally posted by irishfan85 View Post

                Priceless and others think it's Corkum's. I'm beginning to think it will go to someone else...
                Me too, the longer it takes the more I think someone else has the job. Why take this long to name Corkum?
                I swear there ain't no heaven but I pray there ain't no hell.

                Maine Hockey Love it or Leave it

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                • Re: Maine Hockey Thread II: The Search for Spock

                  Originally posted by walrus View Post
                  Me too, the longer it takes the more I think someone else has the job. Why take this long to name Corkum?
                  Why take 15 days to decide to fire Whitehead?

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                  • Re: Maine Hockey Thread II: The Search for Spock

                    Originally posted by BearBrews View Post

                    I had friends that were top flight recruits, second round picks. One in particular had two calls with Grant Standbrook, was interested in the program wanted to come up, but in transition NEVER got roped in by the rest of the staff. He ended up playing at another Hockey East Program. He would have been tremendously helpful on a line at Maine. What happened Bob?
                    Standbrook and Bob never coached Maine at the same time . So it was not Bob's responsibility

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                    • Re: Maine Hockey Thread II: The Search for Spock

                      Originally posted by Priceless View Post
                      Why take 15 days to decide to fire Whitehead?
                      Money? Although my source say 1 donor took care of that. I dunno, I assume Abbott and company were in town and could have done it anytime. Actually why did they wait until after the season if they just wanted to appoint Corkum as coach?
                      I swear there ain't no heaven but I pray there ain't no hell.

                      Maine Hockey Love it or Leave it

                      Comment


                      • Re: Maine Hockey Thread II: The Search for Spock

                        Originally posted by walrus View Post
                        Money? Although my source say 1 donor took care of that. I dunno, I assume Abbott and company were in town and could have done it anytime. Actually why did they wait until after the season if they just wanted to appoint Corkum as coach?
                        that review period was nothing more than lining up private money to pay TW off.

                        as far as the recruiting discussion, here's my take:

                        Other teams have gotten the cream of the crop for a long time and maine has largely gotten that next level type player with a few really elite guys sprinkled in here and there. Maine won games by being tenacious, gritty and having a good mix of physical and skill guys. The physical guys to skate and the skill guys could take the body. When Maine wasn't the best team on the ice, they were still capable of wearing the better team down and winning games that way.

                        I think the focus of recruiting of late was to recruit for speed and skill and less so, the gritty/physical style. The problem is, when you are getting the second/third tier skill guys and end up playing teams that are more or equally skilled and equally quick, then you have nothing left to neutralize a better opponent. This was exacerbated by the less physical style TW wanted his team to play.

                        So where does the buck stop? Is it on the assistants who were out doing the recruiting, or was TW saying go get me this kind of player and that's what they come up with? The question is, how much discretion do the guys beating the bushes have? I have a hard time believing that Corkum had the same latitude/discretion Grant had.

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                        • Originally posted by gscott13 View Post
                          that review period was nothing more than lining up private money to pay TW off.

                          as far as the recruiting discussion, here's my take:

                          Other teams have gotten the cream of the crop for a long time and maine has largely gotten that next level type player with a few really elite guys sprinkled in here and there. Maine won games by being tenacious, gritty and having a good mix of physical and skill guys. The physical guys to skate and the skill guys could take the body. When Maine wasn't the best team on the ice, they were still capable of wearing the better team down and winning games that way.

                          I think the focus of recruiting of late was to recruit for speed and skill and less so, the gritty/physical style. The problem is, when you are getting the second/third tier skill guys and end up playing teams that are more or equally skilled and equally quick, then you have nothing left to neutralize a better opponent. This was exacerbated by the less physical style TW wanted his team to play.

                          So where does the buck stop? Is it on the assistants who were out doing the recruiting, or was TW saying go get me this kind of player and that's what they come up with? The question is, how much discretion do the guys beating the bushes have? I have a hard time believing that Corkum had the same latitude/discretion Grant had.

                          Maine also had outstanding goalies. Not so much last 3/4 or after Howard and Bishop to a lesser extent. If Howard, Snow or Dunham were there past 2 or 3 years they would have had home ice playoff games and heading to Garden

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                          • Re: Maine Hockey Thread II: The Search for Spock

                            Originally posted by daaabears View Post
                            Standbrook and Bob never coached Maine at the same time . So it was not Bob's responsibility
                            Uh, Corkum took over Grant's recruiting, so it was Bob's responsibility. That's the point. Grant left and Bob dropped the ball on the handoff.

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                            • Originally posted by BearBrews View Post
                              Uh, Corkum took over Grant's recruiting, so it was Bob's responsibility. That's the point. Grant left and Bob dropped the ball on the handoff.
                              That's incorrect, Guy Perron handled recruiting in between them.
                              Originally posted by BobbyBrady
                              Crosby probably wouldn't even be on BC's top two lines next year

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                              • Re: Maine Hockey Thread II: The Search for Spock

                                Originally posted by Drew S. View Post
                                That's incorrect, Guy Perron handled recruiting in between them.
                                Uh, no, not correct, Standbrook and Perron left the same year after 07-08. Bob's first year was 08-09

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