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Gurtholfin
02-28-2013, 05:30 PM
Again, I said I partially conceded the point above. I wasn't implying that using the players we did was a handicap, and I am not intending to diminish the accomplishments of teams who won championships with all variety of players. The championships themselves should count the same.

What I am saying is, these accomplishments are unique to college hockey, and were important to USA Hockey and Minnesota Hockey. An NHL commissioner (forget whom) called Minnesota's championship in 1974 at the time "arguably the most important thing to happen to USA Hockey".

These things showed American kids it wasn't just Canada's game. That US kids could compete with and beat teams with rosters heavy on Canadians.

Sincerely, I'm not trying to toot Minnesota's horn here. I know people here hate provincialism and I know I have a tendancy to be very provincial. I just don't know how else to explain what really are truths.

By recruiting primarily Minnesotans at the University of Minnesota, John Mariucci gave more opportunities to play at the next level to Minnesota kids.

During Mariucci's tenure, high school hockey programs in Minnesota grew ten fold. Thus more and more Minnesotans began to play the game.

Minnesotans comprised over half the 1960 and 1980 US Olympic Hockey rosters. These Gold Medal teams gave inspiration to play to many other kids around the country.

It's why John Mariucci is not just in the US Hockey Hall of Fame, but in THE Hockey Hall of Fame as a builder. How many other college hockey coaches are in both Halls as a builder?

The impact of Minnesota's recruiting practices WERE significant to the growth of hockey in this country. All I'm saying is that would be a factor of mine when determining Minnesota's "greatness" as a program.


6>5

GopherBigGuy911
02-28-2013, 05:37 PM
For good reason too. He breaks from the philosophy and gets Dave Spehar. What a disaster!
Yeah he was pretty much a wet fart after his Sophomore year

JDUBBS1280
02-28-2013, 05:40 PM
6>5

I wrote:

"I wasn't implying that using the players we did was a handicap, and I am not intending to diminish the accomplishments of teams who won championships with all variety of players. The championships themselves should count the same."

burd
02-28-2013, 06:26 PM
I wrote:

"I wasn't implying that using the players we did was a handicap, and I am not intending to diminish the accomplishments of teams who won championships with all variety of players. The championships themselves should count the same."

It's settled then: 6>5. Or, to put it another way, 5<6.

Ergo 7>>5 and, of course 5<<7.

And logically then Fido Purpur >John Mariucci and Bob Johnson > John Mariucci.

Most likely Fido Purpur = Bob Johnson

Most important, UMinn tradition of winning fewer championships > lot of schools

JDUBBS1280
02-28-2013, 06:31 PM
6>5

I also said:


What I am saying is, these accomplishments are unique to college hockey, and were important to USA Hockey and Minnesota Hockey. An NHL commissioner (forget whom) called Minnesota's championship in 1974 at the time "arguably the most important thing to happen to USA Hockey".

These things showed American kids it wasn't just Canada's game. That US kids could compete with and beat teams with rosters heavy on Canadians.

Sincerely, I'm not trying to toot Minnesota's horn here. I know people here hate provincialism and I know I have a tendancy to be very provincial. I just don't know how else to explain what really are truths.

By recruiting primarily Minnesotans at the University of Minnesota, John Mariucci gave more opportunities to play at the next level to Minnesota kids.

During Mariucci's tenure, high school hockey programs in Minnesota grew ten fold. Thus more and more Minnesotans began to play the game.

Minnesotans comprised over half the 1960 and 1980 US Olympic Hockey rosters. These Gold Medal teams gave inspiration to play to many other kids around the country.

It's why John Mariucci is not just in the US Hockey Hall of Fame, but in THE Hockey Hall of Fame as a builder. How many other college hockey coaches are in both Halls as a builder?

The impact of Minnesota's recruiting practices WERE significant to the growth of hockey in this country. All I'm saying is that would be a factor of mine when determining Minnesota's "greatness" as a program.

JDUBBS1280
02-28-2013, 06:37 PM
"The University of Minnesota Winning the National Championship with an all-American team was the biggest accomplishment for USA Hockey" - Clarence Campbell, Commissioner of the NHL (1946-1977).

burd
02-28-2013, 06:43 PM
I also said:


What I am saying is, these accomplishments are unique to college hockey, and were important to USA Hockey and Minnesota Hockey. An NHL commissioner (forget whom) called Minnesota's championship in 1974 at the time "arguably the most important thing to happen to USA Hockey".

These things showed American kids it wasn't just Canada's game. That US kids could compete with and beat teams with rosters heavy on Canadians.

Sincerely, I'm not trying to toot Minnesota's horn here. I know people here hate provincialism and I know I have a tendancy to be very provincial. I just don't know how else to explain what really are truths.

By recruiting primarily Minnesotans at the University of Minnesota, John Mariucci gave more opportunities to play at the next level to Minnesota kids.

During Mariucci's tenure, high school hockey programs in Minnesota grew ten fold. Thus more and more Minnesotans began to play the game.

Minnesotans comprised over half the 1960 and 1980 US Olympic Hockey rosters. These Gold Medal teams gave inspiration to play to many other kids around the country.

It's why John Mariucci is not just in the US Hockey Hall of Fame, but in THE Hockey Hall of Fame as a builder. How many other college hockey coaches are in both Halls as a builder?

The impact of Minnesota's recruiting practices WERE significant to the growth of hockey in this country. All I'm saying is that would be a factor of mine when determining Minnesota's "greatness" as a program.

Yeah, well, Fido had a zamboni lead his funeral procession, and that trumps all.

Sorry.

JDUBBS1280
02-28-2013, 06:53 PM
Full Quote:

"Clarence Campbell, the learned and colorful commissioner of the National Hockey League, had been invited to be the guest speaker [at US Hockey Hall of Fame game]. Campbell was well attuned to the scarcity of U.S. players in pro hockey, and he blamed U.S. colleges for failing to develop U.S. players."

"American sports of all kinds are associated with institutions, and they offer a great deal to be commended for, such as discipline, good facilities, and coaching," said Campbell. "Regrettably, from what I've seen, a high percentage of college players were not Americans. They were young men recruited from Canada, which means U.S. college hockey has limited the development of American Hockey".

Mr. Campbell went on to say, "The Midwest Junior Hockey League and the University of Minnesota winning the NCAA championship with an all-American team were the biggest accomplishments for U.S. hockey".

<a href="http://books.google.com/books?id=n87sotGrluIC&pg=PA78&lpg=PA78&dq=Clarence+campbell+herb+brooks+hockey+mastermind&source=bl&ots=zGpDMhpblp&sig=zz6XGwJBn7m75FrX-F_ZytHkdl4&hl=en&sa=X&ei=0-ovUfeTBaT-0gG764GQAQ&ved=0CC0Q6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=Clarence%20campbell%20herb%20brooks%20hockey%20m astermind&f=false">Link to Read Quote</a>

burd
02-28-2013, 07:02 PM
Full Quote:

"Clarence Campbell, the learned and colorful commissioner of the National Hockey League, had been invited to be the guest speaker [at US Hockey Hall of Fame game]. Campbell was well attuned to the scarcity of U.S. players in pro hockey, and he blamed U.S. colleges for failing to develop U.S. players."

"American sports of all kinds are associated with institutions, and they offer a great deal to be commended for, such as discipline, good facilities, and coaching," said Campbell. "Regrettably, from what I've seen, a high percentage of college players were not Americans. They were young men recruited from Canada, which means U.S. college hockey has limited the development of American Hockey".

Mr. Campbell went on to say, "The Midwest Junior Hockey League and the University of Minnesota winning the NCAA championship with an all-American team were the biggest accomplishments for U.S. hockey".

<a href="http://books.google.com/books?id=n87sotGrluIC&pg=PA78&lpg=PA78&dq=Clarence+campbell+herb+brooks+hockey+mastermind&source=bl&ots=zGpDMhpblp&sig=zz6XGwJBn7m75FrX-F_ZytHkdl4&hl=en&sa=X&ei=0-ovUfeTBaT-0gG764GQAQ&ved=0CC0Q6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=Clarence%20campbell%20herb%20brooks%20hockey%20m astermind&f=false">Link to Read Quote</a>

Did you know that many of those Canadians were not chaste?

JDUBBS1280
02-28-2013, 07:16 PM
Did you know that many of those Canadians were not chaste?

I've supported my statements with facts and testimony, you've supported yours with sarcasm and immaturity. Yet I'm the one who gets criticized.

I'll repeat that I have the utmost respect for what other programs have been able to accomplish, and I don't want to diminish their achievements in any way. But if I were to rate the "greatness" of the college hockey programs, I would certainly include things like their effect on hockey in this country.

Just my two cents.

Happy
02-28-2013, 07:43 PM
It's settled then: 6>5. Or, to put it another way, 5<6.

Ergo 7>>5 and, of course 5<<7.

And logically then Fido Purpur >John Mariucci and Bob Johnson > John Mariucci.

Most likely Fido Purpur = Bob Johnson

Most important, UMinn tradition of winning fewer championships > lot of schools

Oh, so when John taught Bob every thing he ever knew about hockey, instead of some random Canadian, it was a good thing. How much credit does John deserve for this? Does Bob even become a hockey coach if he doesn't play for John at Minnesota.

JDUBBS1280
02-28-2013, 07:57 PM
Oh, so when John taught Bob every thing he ever knew about hockey, instead of some random Canadian, it was a good thing. How much credit does John deserve for this? Does Bob even become a hockey coach if he doesn't play for John at Minnesota.

You give burd too much credit. He didn't know Bob played under John, or that John encouraged him to get into coaching.

"Mariucci strongly encouraged Johnson to build the University of Wisconsin program from within the state, envisioning that Wisconsin could develop a high school network to rival Minnesota's, if Wisconsin youngsters grew up with the objective of playing for the Badgers."

"Instead, Johnson couldn't resist more instant success by following other U.S. college coaches to Western Canada's recruiting ground, where he could cultivate the same connections he had developed at Colorado College."

"Forty years later, Wisconsin's high school program is pretty good with a strong team or two, but not nearly as deep or broad as it could have been if it had adapted Mariucci's vision."

<a href="http://books.google.com/books?id=n87sotGrluIC&pg=PA48&lpg=PA48&dq=John+Mariucci+suggested+Bob+Johnson+recruit+in+ %20state&source=bl&ots=zGlBTfo7sm&sig=Wll6SL0f5VeJbuE9b_AT5TziT74&hl=en&ei=Xme5TtTTD8qHsAKsgcWlCA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=6&ved=0CDoQ6AEwBQ#v=onepage&q&f=false">Link to Read</A>

Wisko McBadgerton
02-28-2013, 07:57 PM
Full Quote:

"Clarence Campbell, the learned and colorful commissioner of the National Hockey League, had been invited to be the guest speaker [at US Hockey Hall of Fame game]. Campbell was well attuned to the scarcity of U.S. players in pro hockey, and he blamed U.S. colleges for failing to develop U.S. players."

"American sports of all kinds are associated with institutions, and they offer a great deal to be commended for, such as discipline, good facilities, and coaching," said Campbell. "Regrettably, from what I've seen, a high percentage of college players were not Americans. They were young men recruited from Canada, which means U.S. college hockey has limited the development of American Hockey".

Mr. Campbell went on to say, "The Midwest Junior Hockey League and the University of Minnesota winning the NCAA championship with an all-American team were the biggest accomplishments for U.S. hockey".

<a href="http://books.google.com/books?id=n87sotGrluIC&pg=PA78&lpg=PA78&dq=Clarence+campbell+herb+brooks+hockey+mastermind&source=bl&ots=zGpDMhpblp&sig=zz6XGwJBn7m75FrX-F_ZytHkdl4&hl=en&sa=X&ei=0-ovUfeTBaT-0gG764GQAQ&ved=0CC0Q6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=Clarence%20campbell%20herb%20brooks%20hockey%20m astermind&f=false">Link to Read Quote</a>


While this certainly may have been Mr. Cambell's most heartfelt opinion, to give some context: Campbell, himself a Canadian, was speaking prior to a UMD - UM matchup in a room more than half full of Gophers who had just won the referenced title the season before at the time of this quote.

Gurtholfin
02-28-2013, 07:59 PM
Oh, so when John taught Bob every thing he ever knew about hockey, instead of some random Canadian, it was a good thing. How much credit does John deserve for this? Does Bob even become a hockey coach if he doesn't play for John at Minnesota.


By that logic, YOU guys are to blame for Eaves.


I'll never understand why anyone would argue against an obvious joke.

Wisko McBadgerton
02-28-2013, 08:00 PM
Oh, so when John taught Bob every thing he ever knew about hockey, instead of some random Canadian, it was a good thing. How much credit does John deserve for this? Does Bob even become a hockey coach if he doesn't play for John at Minnesota.

To carry it further, does Herb ever win the '80 gold without Bob's son carrying the scoring load?

It's the circle of life!

JDUBBS1280
02-28-2013, 08:02 PM
While this certainly may have been Mr. Cambell's most heartfelt opinion, to give some context: Campbell, himself a Canadian, was speaking prior to a UMD - UM matchup in a room more than half full of Gophers who had just won the referenced title the season before at the time of this quote.

Before the US Hall of Fame game. USA Hockey certainly didn't dispute his comments.

burd
02-28-2013, 08:05 PM
Oh, so when John taught Bob every thing he ever knew about hockey, instead of some random Canadian, it was a good thing. How much credit does John deserve for this? Does Bob even become a hockey coach if he doesn't play for John at Minnesota.

:) I don't know quite what to say. Tied a piece of shoe leather to a string out of boredom and threw it in to see if a bullhead might come along and I get a you, Happy? You're a trout at least, aren't you? You don't belong in this ditchwater.

JDUBBS1280
02-28-2013, 08:07 PM
To carry it further, does Herb ever win the '80 gold without Bob's son carrying the scoring load?

It's the circle of life!

Mark wasn't even the best player on that team. Brooks regarded Pavelich as the best player on that team.

And Bob learned from John, then taught Mark (who was birn in MN also by the way), so by your reasoning Mark should be thanking John for teaching Bob so Bob could teach him :D

Wisko McBadgerton
02-28-2013, 08:09 PM
Before the US Hall of Fame game. US Hockey certainly didn't dispute his comments.

Well, I'll give you that John Gilbert didn't dispute this quote, as he provided it. But for all we know US hockey had him killed for saying this very thing. Mr. Campbell was dead just a few years later.

burd
02-28-2013, 08:10 PM
OK OK Can we at least agree on this. Those John Mariucci inflatable dolls are awesome the way they can take a beating and still hold air. The guy's a SAVAGE!